PDA

View Full Version : July Entry : The Solur Nexedifice of Kharaghan



Crayons
07-12-2010, 04:24 PM
This is a long shot. I'm doing this thing in 3D in POVRay to see what I, and it, can achieve. I'm also experimenting with another sort of challenge someone posted about how to map a building on a cliff side. Heck, go for broke, why not??!!

It might be a tad tricky to pull it off and I'm not sure how exactly I'm gonna present the final version so that it qualifies as a map worthy of even being here. So why put it here?
Well, because the rules say so, but mainly to make sure I do it! By going public I'm kinda gonna look like a complete screwup if I don't at least complete most of it.

It took me a few days to summon the wotsit to do this and I only started yesterday, so ---- when's the last date for modifications????? Erm, 26th??

Anyway - The Temple of Light is a Solur Nexedfice in the Desert of (somewhere hot sounding)... erm... Kharaghan. (It'll do.)
This ancient volcanic plug tabletop hill rises over 200m over the surrounding desert plains, and its core material attracts the sun's energy with a major intensity, especially when reinforced by the Nexomantic Incantations of the Solur Munks who maintain, operate and distribute the energy collected via the Nexus Maze.
The Munkhaven has been carved into the living rock about halfway up the sides where it is shielded from the intensity of the Solur Lance that is focussed by the Solurium Nexus Edifice itself (the currently invisble thing on the top!)
The rest, well it's all Nexomantics and highly secret.

Anyway - here's a side angle view. I've created a height_field (several hours with PSP X and Wilbur (thanx Waldronate, good prog!)) and I've put in the main foundations for the Munkhaven - they'll probably repaint these later!

### Latest WIP ###
26946

Did I do this right??

Gamerprinter
07-12-2010, 04:38 PM
Interesting approach, so this is a cliffside community with a single street on the inside. Will there be towers to high levels or just the single street/ledge level?

Nice to see someone new get in on the Challenges! Good luck. (Yeah, the 26th should be the final day, though it gets delayed sometimes...)

GP

Crayons
07-12-2010, 05:00 PM
I'd hate people to think I went into this with any significant plan !! 8)
The "street" is more likely to be a "path" and it will be at the cliff edge side of these foundations, with ballustrade, and steps between levels. The red end is the more "mundane" part of the complex, kitchens and so forth. It'll have an overhanging goods lift to the ground. Obviously no properly Solurly pious person would use it, they would use the access path!
The purple end will be the "religious" end, and would be the entrance to the access tunnel to the Nexus Edifice itself. The Green area will be mainly clear "garden" space for meditation. "Garden" in so far as sun worshippers in a desert might deem suitable.... hrm.

Immolate
07-12-2010, 06:48 PM
Sweet. Ness... Sweetness. And light!

Crayons
07-12-2010, 09:39 PM
Ok, the lads have been out with the paint brushes and the Health and Safety Majixians have erected safety barriers.
Looks like they're clocking off for the evening.
Bit of a close-up.
### Latest WIP ###
26952

Immolate
07-13-2010, 12:05 AM
Wonderful stuff!

Steel General
07-13-2010, 09:26 AM
Very cool!

mmmmmpig
07-13-2010, 11:50 AM
love the detail close-up! I really look forward to seeing how it turns out

Crayons
07-13-2010, 08:28 PM
OK, the builders have been in. Bit of mud and adobe here, some tiling there. Even the rare piece of wood!
Erm, I'm not sure how big the images I post here as WIP can be, but these are bigger ones but I've converted them to jpgs to try and keep the size down.
Apart from adding the buildings (some of which are randomly generated and might get tidied up a bit) I've also worked on the terrain. For the localised area of this "town" I can now "carve" the cliff face, which is what I've tried experimentally with the beginnings of a cloister on the "garden" level to the right. If I can, I think I'll make the stairs to the top of the hill this way.
As with much that I do in life, this thing is evolving as I do it - and GamerPrinter's question about levels has had me thinking along those lines too. In addition, when I replied that the path would be along the cliff edge when he asked about it being on the "inside" - the positioning of the steps means that the path sort of meanders through the middle, which I like.
The colour scheme is currently very "deserty" for all the logical reasons - I'm hoping to add in some "colour" later with rooftop paraphenalia (sunshades, clothes lines perhaps.)
I've also generated a form of "map" mode - an above view - to see how it pans out and see if my path actually goes anywhere. There's some stairs that need shunting around a bit...
Oh, the wood platforms for the "goods lifts" had to have a "mezzanine" since the drop isn't vertical. Also the "wood" texture is just a placeholder for now, proper planks will be along eventually.
More later...
### LATEST WIP ###
26969 26970

Gamerprinter
07-14-2010, 01:13 AM
I like how this is turning out! Have some REP for doing such a nice job on your first map challenge entry here at the guild.

And don't worry about how fast I map, it's just a graphics work habit working alone in my own company, unless I work at a high rate of speed, I never get anything done - so its what I do. In fact five or six days is a longtime for me, usually most maps are measured in four hours or less, sometimes 2 days if I need to work on some detail that couldn't be done in one sitting. Six days for me is like forever! :P

As Jaxillion replied to your post in my entry thread, nobody works as a fast as I do, nobody.

You're doing fine.

GP

Sapiento
07-14-2010, 01:47 AM
Awesome! Looks great.

Gidde
07-15-2010, 07:13 PM
This looks really cool!

Crayons
07-16-2010, 12:41 AM
I was continuing along the "shelf" and got to the "Temple" area - which lead me to certain decisions I had been forestalling. At the moment the scheme of the place is rather mud-hutty but the temple, whilst following this form, is more lavish. So in a traditional vein I went for Gold, literally - this being common with Sun worshipping cultures.
This then gave me the final "look and feel" for the edifice itself , which, you may note, I have been studiously avoiding.
Thinking it all through I've tied together the basis of this world's Technomancy with the architecture and the theme of this challenge, ultimately.
The Technomancy revolves around the alternate "elemental forces" of Light, Gravity, Lightning and Entropy - as opposed to the old heretical "pantheon" of Earth, Air, Fire and Water. The unification of these new alternate energies is now approximately understood and relates to their interaction with Matter and in it's purest form, Minerals and Metals. Some materials attract or repel these forces and allow the Technosorcerors to, in part, manipulate them.
More of this later perhaps.
In terms of this as a project, the finished product is likely to be a stolen page from some Technomicon or other detailing the site. Being Technomagical in nature the depictions on the page will be Technological themselves - which is a cheaty way for me to present 3D "stuff" on it !!! Phew!
Anyway - as you may have guessed, the Edifce itself is a Solur energy array not dissimilar to a real world Solar Furnace thingy. The problem I have there is that the real things are huge and - well, not to put too fine a point on it, rather underwhelming. There are no blisteringly visible "light saber"-like beams of solid light energy, nothin'. Just a lot of mirrors somewhere hot, and a tower with a small window and... well, sadly, light itself isn't visible - only the things it hits... well you know what I mean! :P
Whilst I'm not here to belittle the hugely important achievements of the engineers and scientists involved in such things, the results of their endeavours are not spectacular in the way I need. I speak from experience, I once spent a year and a half designing some intensely rugged communications technology the only significant result of which was... well, the ability for people to talk to each other - just like on your landline. Wow. Underwhelming or what?
I'm rambling.
I need a reflector element for my collector. It uses a lot of thick gold enamelling. Not just for the lavishness thing, it's also practical (sort of). The gold reflects (mostly), it doesn't tarnish, so the mirrors stay good longer, and being malleable, scratches can be polished out. OK, yes, there are lots of baaaaad reasons to use gold I imagine, but it's my universe!
So here's a reflector in my POVRay "workshop" (the version I use for building "things" before including them)27123
(I've not put a latest WIP marker on this since it's only a subassambly)
I'm afraid I got a tad involved putting teeth on cogs and things, POVRay does that to you. Anyway, yes, the mirror is all blue as its reflecting the infinite blue of my workshop, but you can see its affect in the reflection of the x-y-z axes that are rendered there for my visiualisation.
I'm looking at the render of the array of these currently running on my laptop here. With all the light saberish "stuff" going on it has taken 16 hours to render at 1024x768 and it's only 75% done. Oh well. The image will work as an insert, I think (cropped, edited and much reduced!).

Crayons
07-16-2010, 01:49 AM
Huh!
That all said (in the above), the render suddenly perked up at the end! Finishing in 16 hours and 46 minutes.
I'm posting the unabridged version of the render (just cropped a bit) to show up the strange black artefact that seems to have occurred. I think this is a result of so many light cylinders overlapping at the "focus" - I'll have to tidy that up in PSP I guess.
I'll probably try and fix it properly though - this was supposed to be just a first "stab" at seeing what the thing would look like. In this version the reflectors are actually pointing in a rather arbitrary angle in relation to the "sun" and I really ought to do all the maths to get it "right" - even if the actual beams of light will always focus properly! There are some other bits that aren't quite right or are too "simple" for me.
For those of you who haven't used 3D tools like this it's all a huge "cheat" - artistically speaking. I say "artistically" inadvisably here. Most of the time one just bangs out objects and chucks them together, then with a few extra lines of code you can let loose the "serendipity monkeys" and hope something interesting happens. Someone mentioned the old infinite number of monkeys writing shakespeare adage elsewhere here recently. In some ways, running POVray is like all those simians!
### LATEST WIP ###
27124
Technomancy Notes: The Solur Collectors focus the Energy onto the central tower which directs the beam into the Inner Sanctorum where the Light is Blessed and routed on to the Entromantic Temple for transmission down their Air Pipe (or something!) :lol:

Jaxilon
07-16-2010, 03:20 AM
ahhh, I'm blind!! I looked into the Sun :O

Very cool man, this is coming along nicely.

tilt
07-16-2010, 05:06 AM
@GP *spaghetti western style music playing* .... *close up to eyes of man with black hat.* .... so ... I hear you're a fast mapper... *hand poised above pen*... *lol*

Back to business: Looking really good Crayons - very nice work indeed and a very cool idea too :)

Aval Penworth
07-17-2010, 08:11 PM
I must be having a dumb momment, because I can't understand what is going on in this project. I suppose when it is finished it will all make sense.

Crayons
07-17-2010, 10:49 PM
I must be having a dumb momment, because I can't understand what is going on in this project. I suppose when it is finished it will all make sense.
What seems to be the problem? You can always ask !

Jaxilon
07-18-2010, 04:06 AM
I think I know what he means - The first post is a distance shot of community living in the side of a cliff. The next few show a side shot of buildings in the cliff and a top-down view of same. Then you show a single Solar Collector followed by an array of Solar collectors (so far they don't look to be located withing the community but I'm guessing that's what comes next).

Possibly some confusion due to never having used POV (I think that's what you said you were using). Perhaps it's the different views without much reference point due to everything not being in a comprehensive piece yet. Personally, I think I follow what you are doing and look forward to seeing how it all turns out.

Crayons
07-18-2010, 07:42 AM
Ah! Right. Well, the two tie together much as one would expect. I've just worked out the cutting in the side of the cliff for the stairs up to the actual Nexus link itself.
Light is collected during the main daylight hours, deflected into a subterranian area for "processing" and then routed sideways out again for onward transmission towards the next Nexus node. In order to transmit such an amount of power through the air it requires a rarified atmospheric "pipe" created by mages of the Entropic Order whose temple sits higher up in the excavated recess in the cliff at the exit point (the rather dull looking tube at the moment).
This is a view closer to sunset.
### LATEST WIP ###
27186
I still have the main buildings to complete.

Jaxilon
07-18-2010, 01:00 PM
Now see, that is just pretty dang cool

Aval Penworth
07-19-2010, 09:51 PM
Okay, now it makes sense.

I am guessing that your program can view that scene from various angles, is that right?

Crayons
07-20-2010, 11:28 AM
Okay, now it makes sense.
I am guessing that your program can view that scene from various angles, is that right?
Absolutely. What it can't actuallly do is render a real isometric view. You can simulate it reasonably well by standing the camera off a long distance and cutting down its angle of view which is what I did in an earlier WIP view.

Aval Penworth
07-20-2010, 11:40 AM
So you can make it look more mappy. As impressed as I am by the 3d stuff, I still think it needs to perform the function of a map.

tilt
07-20-2010, 11:49 AM
So you can make it look more mappy. As impressed as I am by the 3d stuff, I still think it needs to perform the function of a map.

yes, that's one of my concerns also - making it more than a "pretty picture" - but it is definitly looking nice :)

Crayons
07-20-2010, 11:56 AM
So you can make it look more mappy. As impressed as I am by the 3d stuff, I still think it needs to perform the function of a map.

That's part of the "challenge" for me. However, I've done enough "flat maps" to be confident of the basics, it's more about the issue of the buldings being on a shelf that is problematic. It's likely that I'll need to "slice" this hillock up somewhat for the map views.
I guess the ultimate question is "what is a map?".

Gamerprinter
07-20-2010, 02:39 PM
I would say, even if you include multiple views, top down, side view, isometric view, cutaway of the mountain, all in 3D should be fine. Make sure you label structures, include a scale, especially for the top down and provide a compass rose showing direction, you should qualify for being "mappy" enough.

GP

ravells
07-20-2010, 03:03 PM
That's lovely work, Crayons! Can't wait to see more of it!

mmmmmpig
07-20-2010, 04:33 PM
This is really nice!

Crayons
07-20-2010, 08:34 PM
Thankyou all. It seems an appropriate moment to conclude the first part of this design, the actual 3D model part. The last buildings added were the Light Temple at the end of the shelf and the "mezanine" Entropy Temple (who have their own agenda when it comes to decor!) - and the Nexus link light beam...
From here on in it's getting all this into a final "mappy" result. Which will involve specific renders and a fair amount of tinkering in PSP X.... time is runniing out!!!
### LATEST WIP ###
27241

RobA
07-20-2010, 11:50 PM
Absolutely. What it can't actuallly do is render a real isometric view. You can simulate it reasonably well by standing the camera off a long distance and cutting down its angle of view which is what I did in an earlier WIP view.

I though POV had an isometric modifier for its camera....

(checking...)

Yep - orthographic keyword:


2.3.1.2.2 Orthographic projection

The orthographic camera offers two modes of operation:

The pure orthographic projection. This projection uses parallel camera rays to create an image of the scene. The area of view is determined by the lengths of the right and up vectors. One of these has to be specified, they are not taken from the default camera. If omitted the second method of the camera is used.

If, in a perspective camera, you replace the perspective keyword by orthographic and leave all other parameters the same, you will get an orthographic view with the same image area, i.e. the size of the image is the same. The same can be achieved by adding the angle keyword to an orthographic camera. A value for the angle is optional. So this second mode is active if no up and right are within the camera statement, or when the angle keyword is within the camera statement.

You should be aware though that the visible parts of the scene change when switching from perspective to orthographic view. As long as all objects of interest are near the look_at point they will be still visible if the orthographic camera is used. Objects farther away may get out of view while nearer objects will stay in view.

If objects are too close to the camera location they may disappear. Too close here means, behind the orthographic camera projection plane (the plane that goes through the look_at point).


-Rob A>

Crayons
07-21-2010, 06:16 AM
I though POV had an isometric modifier for its camera....

(checking...)

Yep - orthographic keyword:

-Rob A>
Crikey! Thanks Rob! There's me searching Help for "isometric" all this time! Why can't mathematicians just have one word for something! I imagine there's some subtle difference between "orthographic" and "isometric" but... (no explanations please!!!I will consider my life complete without such knowledge!) :lol:
I'll give it a go.

cfds
07-21-2010, 07:25 AM
Great work I love the MYST-like look.
As a fellow Povray user I have to ask: The light beam is emitting media? And where did you get the trees?

Crayons
07-21-2010, 08:17 AM
Great work I love the MYST-like look.
As a fellow Povray user I have to ask: The light beam is emitting media? And where did you get the trees?
Ah!
Right (apologies to non-POV users here!)
The light beam is a media cylinder and a cylindrical light source.


cylinder { < 0, 0, -300>, <0, 0, 20>, 3
pigment { rgbt 1 }
hollow
interior { media { scattering { 1, 0.001 extinction 0.01 } samples 30,100 } }
}
light_source { <0, 0, 20> color rgb <150, 150, 350>
cylinder
radius 2
falloff 4
tightness 5
point_at <0, 0, -300>
}
[Hrm, the editor seems to remove indents!]
To be honest I haven't got a complete "handle" on all the parameters used so I tend to use "educated trial and error" for what I want and as usual, Serendipity often has the final word! As you can see the light is pretty bright ! The "sun" I'm using is only rgb 2*<1, 0.97, 0.94>.
I'm all up for any advice on these matters, this is only my second attempt using media.

The trees? Home made. With the exception of the "leaves" on one tree - which uses a highly modifed leaf texture tile from Maptool/FM8 - everything in this entire design is essentially home made. Whilst I'm sure you're aware there are one or more tree generator POV sources available for free on the web, they're all "too good" i.e represent the workings of real POV experts seeking perfection. Whilst I admire their works, I needed some simple, rather quicker to render, trees. So a fairly simple four layer random branching algorithm and some simple leaves...
27263
[The trees on roofs and paths are in pots!]
The "tree fern" thing is just some tori for the trunk and a sliced up sphere/cone difference for the "leaf", the "normal tree" has each branch ending with a sphere image_mapped with that leaf texture I mentioned - modified so that the darker shades were transparent - and the "cactus" is just 6 flattened spheres rotated to make a segment with a load of spines that are frankly a little OTT for detail here. I tend to try and create stuff I can add to my "library" of bits for other projects later on.
Any help? ( I'm happy to give people source for this stuff - just give me time to tidy up the messy code and add the appropriate CC license! )

RobA
07-21-2010, 08:26 AM
[Hrm, the editor seems to remove indents!]

use the CODE bbtag to wrap it. (I changed it for you)

-Rob A>

Crayons
07-21-2010, 08:35 AM
Cool! Thanks!

cfds
07-21-2010, 12:48 PM
Ok, that's how you did it, I only hope you have disabled media interaction for your "sun" light source.. And the trees are great, even close up.

Crayons
07-21-2010, 01:21 PM
Ok, that's how you did it, I only hope you have disabled media interaction for your "sun" light source.
Actually, I haven't. I figured that if the light beam is lighting up particulate matter thus then so would the sun. You might have noticed in the render with the reflectors and the multiple beams that there is a general area of interaction around the scene caused by my using a single large cylinder as the media "container". I'm gonna try this again with separate smaller cylinders for the media - constraining the media to the beam sizes. However, this might just take longer to render... or even bug out with a memory problem! Gah.
I'm not experienced with media. Is it likely to speed up my renders if I disable media for the sun and use the larger single media container? :?:

Erm, on the other hand - media is not an area I'm particularly concentrating on right now, mind! :oops: It's needed here obviously but... I'm just a hobby renderer.
The kind of POVray work I'm experimenting with here within the auspices of CG are related to simplifying and speeding up POVray for mapping purposes.

Crayons
07-23-2010, 09:32 PM
OK, still on the case. I've been rendering stuff and working on the underground as well (TBA). Anyway, this is a section of stitched together map view in the raw. I intend to do a bit of this and that on it with PSP X too - but not a lot. I'm currently targeting the final result at an A3, 300ppi thing...(I think!)

Query: That size of image is gonna be pretty large. Does that represent any problem? Is there a preferred file format or jpg compression factor advised here? The attached is a jpg compressed with a "factor" of 30, for example.

### LATEST WIP ###
27386

Gamerprinter
07-23-2010, 11:46 PM
There's a limitation about 4000 pixels wide and 4.25 MB so consider that and maybe created a 50% compressed JPG for final output. The system won't successfully load a file that's too big, so you'll know right away if the file you create is too big.

GP

Crayons
07-25-2010, 03:58 PM
OK - the original deadline is about up. I think I'm all done?

Some background to the "Universe"

Nexus Technomancy
Gone are old theocracies of elemental Earth, Air, Fire and Water. These "heretical" belief systems are now Anathema and their adherents are persecuted and converted or...
The Uinversal Forces of Light, Gravity, Lightning and Entropy are now the Foundation of modern Technomantic Energy Sorcery. The Secrets of their Craft are well guarded but even so, the Heretical Freedom Army's spies have managed to garner sufficient Sacred Data to unravel the Core Dogma of Nexomancy.
The Unification of Forces was discovered through Matter - Minerals and Metals. The Forces interact with matter in a largely definable manner although many relationships are still being researched and discovered. Sometimes attracting, other times repelling, these minerals and the concentrations of them have become the Loci of Technomantic Study and Learning over the decades.
Loci that can harness and transmit gathered Forces have become linked through the Nexuses, the most powerful of which are the Solur Nexuses that can be found all across the equatorial belt of the Empire.
The Solur Nexedfice of Kharaghan is one of the largest and most powerful of the Light Loci, its energy provides almost one thirtieth of the Nexus's total capacity due to its isolated location in that deep desert.
The ancient volcanic plug on which it stands has a deep concentrated core of Luxite that must have crystalised almost perfectly. A vein of Entropium Oxigate lies a few leagues to the north attracting a constant wind and forming a local vortex which is also tapped for energy. This wind incidentally helps to cool the Nexedifice and allows it to operated almost continuously during sunlight hours. An Entropium Air Tunneller Device provides the air displacement pipe for the energy link. A small Entromantic Order maintains and operates this at their Temple Annex in the cliffs above the main Light Temple complex. Although the energy beam seems significantly weaker at the output that is primarily due to the much lower particulate air matter density created in the pipe, along with the purity of the processed light, giving it a blueish tinge.

You get the general drift I hope.

As for the work, I have created this using Paintshop Pro X and Wilbur for the height_map terrain, with PSP X for the final compositing thing. The images themselves are all created using POVRay v3.62 from scratch - i.e. using standard primitives etc. (There is one image_map used that is a modification of what would normally be a "leafy floor" tile for something like Maptool or Fractal Mapper etc.)

That's about it.
Please feel free to ask any questions at all and please, please feel free to give C&C's! Something that I note has been something of a rarity during this WIP! (I mean the critique bit!)

The attached file is A3 size at 300dpi saved as a jpg with a compression factor of 50. The original is a tad large, sorry!

### LATEST WIP ###
27470

cheers!
Crayons

Gidde
07-25-2010, 05:09 PM
This looks fantastic. One little nitpick: I can't believe I never noticed it in the thread name, but unless you have a dialect shift in your world, it's Solar, rather than Solur.

Crayons
07-25-2010, 06:37 PM
Thank you.
Correct on both counts! It is merely a dialectic quirk I adopted for that that "forn parts" image!:D It's supposed to make it feel otherworldly, the kind of other world lacking suitable dikshunaries.

Steel General
07-25-2010, 06:44 PM
Great job...

Crayons
07-27-2010, 11:03 PM
Sorry about this. I've just had a try with some other compression levels of jpg. The previous compression was just messing up even the reflected clouds in the gold mounting/border so I've redone this at factor 35. I'm afraid that makes the file about 2 Megs so I apologise for the inconvenience. I also tweaked a few little things.
This should be the final version
### LATEST WIP ###

27518

cheers!

Gidde
07-27-2010, 11:17 PM
2 megs is still pretty small, actually. Keep upping your res until you're just under the limit (4.77) ... that way your final pic is as good as it can be for the challenge.

ravells
07-28-2010, 05:15 AM
I love it Crayons! You really do get the most out of the 3d renders by doing the little insets.

Crayons
07-28-2010, 10:37 AM
2 megs is still pretty small, actually. Keep upping your res until you're just under the limit (4.77) ... that way your final pic is as good as it can be for the challenge.

Oh, OK.
I took a moment to add a few more bits to the purifier too.
### LATEST WIP ###
27537

[Admins? I took several tries at uploading this but for some reason the Attachment Manager "bit" that makes a thumbnail so it can be inserted into the text didn't seem to "catch" - so I've just left it as a plain attachment. Dunno if there's a bug or something in there?]

cfds
07-28-2010, 10:55 AM
You have my vote for sure. Just an amazing piece of work.

Jaxilon
07-28-2010, 12:32 PM
I really like being able to check out all the stuff with this last upload. The reflections in the solur collectors is cool.

Aval Penworth
07-29-2010, 12:08 AM
It really came together well. I find the blue stuff behind the text distracting, but everything else is very cool. Reminds me of a brochure for a resort or perhaps the Solur Nexedifice investment prospectus.

ravells
07-29-2010, 07:17 AM
I'd agree with Aval on the blue clutter. It really doesn't add anything to the map.

Crayons
07-29-2010, 11:03 AM
Hrm, the clutter is reflected sky/clouds on the gold surface of the mounting. It's possibly a bit late in the day but I'll see if I can re-render with smoother gold, see if it makes it clearer. I was going to put some blurb in about the plaque always magically reflecting blue sky and clouds regardless of where it is viewed but I'd written enough already and it seemed superfluous.

And, yes, Aval, it is esssentially a kind of "propaganda" / tourist plaque! Part of me was thinking about those sort of postcards you can buy with several small images rather than one big one. TIme to heat up the computers again!
Cheers!

Crayons
07-29-2010, 05:37 PM
It took this long and I have a sneaky suspicion I've probably messed up something but can't see it!
I think you're right Aval, and ravells, I think the text is clearer here, so seeing that this forum isn't locked off yet...
Thanks for the critique!

### LATEST WIP ###

Gidde
07-29-2010, 10:09 PM
Yeah, that's much easier to read.

Crayons
07-30-2010, 04:23 AM
I was right about missing something and Aval very kindly pointed it out to me. At least I hope I corrected the same things as he spotted! There were a couple of crimson background patches showing from behind both the inset images and the border
Thanks Aval !
### LATEST WIP ###
27589

Redrobes
07-30-2010, 10:10 PM
Interesting read this. Its very hard to map something on a cliff and get a sense of depth to it and this seems to have achieved it very well. You have all the attachments and wip tags fine btw. This one is a strong entrant tho the competition is all pretty strong this month. Good luck with it.