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View Full Version : September-October Challenge: New Amsterdam - in Three Deee



Crayons
09-05-2010, 08:48 PM
I think of this as "pre-apocalypse" ( "apocalypse" being Independence! ) :D - a time when the Brits were just happy fighting the Dutch or the French or anyone else - and even the odd American... (did I say odd?) :D
Anyway - the 3D New Amsterdam is already being done by the New Amsterdam History Center apparently, so I thought I'd have a rather more simplistic go at it. All I've done is a very basic height_field which approximates the land shape for now, as for the hills - it has no resemblence whatsoever - I'll improve on theh eight when I get around to it.
It's very dull at the moment, but here's the starting "placeholder"... it may take some time... but I hope to use the results for another entry later, perhaps.
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Crayons
09-06-2010, 03:40 PM
I have the basic untextured fort walls modelled and approximately placed - interesting shape. I've also image mapped the current street plan of the area onto the height field so I have points of reference. The height field is slightly modified and I've put in the "canals".
I'm largely working from the "Castello" plan but I don't expect to slavishly recreate every building to the details available in various images... we'll see...
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torstan
09-06-2010, 03:51 PM
Looks interesting. I'm enjoying all the entries we're getting. A 3D of New Amsterdam should be a fun one.

Crayons
09-09-2010, 10:43 AM
Hrm.
I modelled one "dutch" style of house so far and I've put in a "test" street of random sized ones(untextured). They're very roughly to scale, but it's hard to tell what size the original houses were. What it is telling me is that the 3D model is going to be rather uninteresting. I'll try some of the larger buildings individually and see if it raises it somewhat, but I suspect that I may drop this entry...
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Crayons
10-07-2010, 09:42 PM
Hokayyy.
Gathering all the data is steaming along. I've plotted almost all the building positions (all 370 odd of them!), a few to add, a few to correct. I have some generic garden walls and placeholder painted floor and textures.
What rather concerns me is scale - I'm going to have to go and measure things from a better source than google maps. By my reckoning even my small looking buildings are too large so something's wrong. It's curious to note that the NAHC don't seem to put a scale up on their google map tool either. Their model looks great (very Ketchuppy!) but I'm not convinced they haven't fudged the scale too! What I need is a good reference baseline using two junctions that exist today and then - something like the length of Wall Street from Broadway to Pearl Street. Ah well tomorrow's search.
Anyway, this entry is still secondary to the Movie Monster Mayhem one, I just needed a rest from my tablet!
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Steel General
10-08-2010, 07:26 AM
Neat stuff Crayons! Wish I had the patience to work with the 3D stuff...

Crayons
10-11-2010, 07:18 AM
Been fiddling with the textures.

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I'm still not convinced this is gonna work

Marken4
10-13-2010, 10:16 AM
I love 3D - And this ent too shabby either :)

Crayons
10-22-2010, 03:42 AM
Still plugging away at this one...

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Marken4
10-22-2010, 05:57 AM
Looks nice =)

I would probably saturate the final result a bit. And the perspective is a bit weird.. Looks like you've tried to do an inception..

http://scifitoday.net/news/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/InceptionBend.jpg

Crayons
10-22-2010, 02:54 PM
The perspective would be wierd because there isn't any - it's an orthographic render, but you're right it, it does look odd! One of those things I haven't seen due to overexposure I guess.
I'll probably go for a perspective render in future, maybe it'll hide more too! lol.
It is a bit colourful now, I tend to use "placehold" colours during development - with POV it's easy to go back and "retune" when all the jigsaw pieces are in place. By "saturate" I would assume you mean "make paler"??? I'm not all that au fait with all the terminology of hue, colour, tone and so forth!

geamon
10-22-2010, 03:25 PM
It's actually "desaturate", make the colors less bright and intense I'm thinking. But I'm only learning too.

Crayons
10-29-2010, 04:24 PM
Well, it's getting late - I have tomorrow to do whatever else I can. Bridges, the remaining walls, more of the garden details...
What we do have here are the two wind mills, the main wall along what is now Wall Street aaaaanndd... a perspective view... to settle any queasy tummies from the rather skewed looking orthograpic view before.
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Obviously quite some stuff to do yet. I hope I have time.

Crayons
10-30-2010, 06:47 PM
Time for bed over here. I should be able to get some more done tomorrow - depending on the actual challenge end time.... :)
That's about it for architectural "stuff" - time for some text I guess.
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tilt
10-31-2010, 02:36 AM
very nice looking crayons, a little to saturated in my opion (as mentioned above), but I'm aware this is not the final version yet :) ... love the little ship :)

Aval Penworth
10-31-2010, 03:08 AM
Looks pretty cool. I would prefer more muted colours, myself.

Considering Manhattan is about 3.5 Km wide though...those farm houses seem pretty big. And, Bajeepers! Broadway looks about 300m wide. Is that right? Don't really matter.. that's art for ya.

Crayons
10-31-2010, 06:27 AM
Ah yes.
It probably needs explaining by someone doing an historical map here! :D
Manhattan at its thickest is possibly 3km wide.... now. However, the "best" historical reference of New Amsterdam is the "Castello Plan" of 1660 - and varients.
Firtsly, New Amsterdam is/was at the very tip of Manhatten. From Wall Street down. "Wall Street" getting its name for obvious reasons!
Most of that part of modern Manhattan is now built on landfill. I've marked the perimeter of 1660 New Amsterdam here on this openmap image.
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(The "X" marks the castle)
The original "Castello Plan" looks like this...
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There are a number or versions of this but they all show the same basic road widths as they all come from the same source map and it's the one all the historical people use as their reference. Including the good Larb, here. The width of the roads is what makes mapping this in the rather more "crowded" fantasy "look" rather impossible. Unless one decides to really "let rip" with Artistic License!

The scale was indeed tricky but I calculated a "baseline" from googlemaps - being the length of Wall Street from Pearl St to Broadway as about 410m (IIRC). Even so - I felt I needed some "tweaking" but I think I have the building dimensions about right.
The people at the "New Amsterdam History Centre" have a 3D model already and their scaling seems to imply that my houses are a bit small...hrm.
www.newamsterdamhistorycenter.citymax.com

Aval Penworth
10-31-2010, 06:37 AM
Fair Enough. I've spent a bit of time in Manhattan and it certainly seems bigger than you describe. But clearly you've done your research, and that landfill point makes sense... so hats off to you. (Grin) Nice work.

Crayons
10-31-2010, 07:00 AM
LOL!
Sadly I've never been there! My only exposure to the real USA has been sitting inside airports (awaiting connections while enroute to/from New Zealand) and looking at it across the Niagara Falls! Not the best vantage points.
I can only assume that "Broadway" got its name for very good and real reasons and that being somewhere with LOTS of space they decided to use as much as possible! This is certainly something I've noticed on my trips in Canada.
For example: Motorways/"Freeways" (or whatever you call 'em!) - in Canada - the central reservation was what I can only call "huge". If one were to crash and veer onto the central reservation you'd have a good 100 feet or more to travel across before meeting the oncoming traffic in the opposite carriageway. In the UK the carriage ways are almost always right beside each other and have a (very expensive) crash barrier. Space is at a premium.
That said, obviously Manhattan "density" and space premiums are high too - now!
This whole project has been interesting! It's hard to "nail down" old history of UK towns in terms of dates or maps - stuff just sort of "peters out" or fades into the further past. With colonial expansion people just plain "arrived" and were apparently more interested in marking their own history down, I guess. It's also much more "modern history" by comparison! For example - the school I went to predates the "Castello Plan" by 60 years.

Crayons
10-31-2010, 02:42 PM
I'm sort of just posting this as a stake in the ground at this version. There are still some minor bugs to sort out with the labelling which I hope to get done tonight, time permitting. Not to say that there aren't all sorts of other bugs I'd like to fix one day but that's part of the whole thing with 3D!
Anyway - this is full size, I guess. Not sure what paper size it has ended up as but....
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[Right now though, I'm hating the green on my Monster Mayhem entry and I just have to fix that! I have no idea what I was thinking at the time, it was late! Doh.]

Gallifreyan
10-31-2010, 03:10 PM
Fantastic map, Crayons! I really like 3dness and perspective of it.

Crayons
10-31-2010, 07:18 PM
OK. Time's up this side of the pond, for me at least.
Last one until some hypothetical later season, potentially... as it were... ehem.

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Erm...