View Full Version : September-October Challenge: Favorite Sites of "Nasties" in NY Moviedom

09-17-2010, 03:14 AM
I've been fiddling with this idea for a while now trying to figure out what approach would work best. The Monster Gourmet Guide didn't quite work for me and I wanted an actually useable sort of Tourist guide so placing it in the realms of "reality" rather than fantasy - sort of. It's vaguely interesting as "factual" to see where films were made but it would probably be rather "dry" if that's all it did - so I've scoped it within the framework of how good the locations were in their films as if they were actors and, to some extent, the monsters were the critics.
I think.

It's kind of evolved that way after I doodled some "quickie" sketches of possible "scenes" for some of the locations and then tried to write up what could be said.
Attached is the sort of evolutionary sketch so far. The little red circles sketched in show the actual locations in relation to the land outline. Due to the clumping of some of the sites I'll probably have to distort the "land" somewhat too - I may even have to redo the whole thing at a different angle since some places are obscured by others at this angle.
Anyway, I've decided to post this early version just to let people know where I'm going on this, my second entry, and I really do welcome any and all C & Cs you might have about it. I am aware that there's a bit of a "tangle" between text and drawings sometimes, that all has to be worked out in the layout and when I have finalised the actual text....
Please forgive the very rough nature of the cartoons at this stage - I'm not all that good at "quick" cartoons - I have to work at them quite a bit to get the desired effects (if at all !!)...
### LATEST WIP ###

I'm still going to try more work on the 3D entry - I'm just "resting" from that for a bit...

09-17-2010, 04:41 AM
Some suggestions:

1. Some of HP Lovecraft's stories dealt with a huge subterranean cavern under Red Hook where cultists and the monsters they worshipped hung out. Don't really know if this'd qualify for you since it's print, not film, but meh, thought I'd throw it in.

2. Q: The Winged Serpent. Awesome early 80s flick about a resurrected Aztec god munching down on NYC.

3. V (the original series). Not sure how you'd show this; maybe just one of the saucer ships?

4. Mimic, from Guillermo Del Toro. Giant humanoid-looking bugs. Good movie.

5. Mulberry Street. Giant mutant rats attack and bite New Yorkers and turn them into giant mutant rats.

6. Friday the Thirteenth VIII: Jason Takes Manhattan. :D

09-17-2010, 07:30 AM
this is going to be sooo good - love your doodles :)

09-18-2010, 06:53 AM
@Diamond - Thanks! Yes, I was going to keep away from books and comics and just limit this to films. However the other suggestions are all valid. I already have Q sketched up there, he's the dark winged thing getting evicted from his Chrysler Building attick by the lousy targettiing of the Helicopters trying to hit Godzilla - it's not much of an idea but the Q was apparently too small to actually damage buildings? I'll have to see if I can dredge up some data to confirm that.
Mimic and Rats are a "can do" I think - in some manner, do you know if there are any "landmark" buildings associated with them?
Jason eh? That bears investigation! You have to give the guy credit for persistence if not his dress sense!
Thanks again!

09-18-2010, 10:14 AM
Jason Takes Manhattan is a must add. :)

09-18-2010, 03:22 PM
Mimic and Rats are a "can do" I think - in some manner, do you know if there are any "landmark" buildings associated with them?
Well, for Mulberry Street, you could somehow accentuate or enlarge the actual Mulberry St. (it's in, or just north of, Chinatown) and have large mutant rats running up and down it. :D

Mimic was strictly subways, so maybe draw an enlarged subway opening and have one of the bugs looking out from it?

09-19-2010, 08:46 PM
My "researches" on "V" seem to indicate that whilst they were a global "phenomenon" I can't find any specific relationship with NY. Most of the plot seems to hinge around LA, so I'll probably leave that one out as too "generic" or too centred elsewhere.
Jason aparently ends up in Time Square, which is a definite "go-er", as it's a location not represented yet!
The Mimic bugs will have to be included in some "general" way, and as you say, the Rats of Mulberry can at least be nailed down to a street. I think I have the DVD! The UK version was titled "Zombie Virus on Mulberry Street" -- I have no idea why they deemed it necessary to do that !

09-29-2010, 08:20 PM
Time to get back into this now that I'm resting the Plumton doodle. I have to run off a set of half decent (hopefully) cartoons of the relevant buildings and their, er, protagonists... for use in the map as sketched in the original post.
Anyway, here's the more completed versions of what I was thinking for:

The Brooklyn Bridge vs Cloverfield
The Flatiron Building vs the US Army missing Godzilla.

The very basic questions are : Are they of a suitable quality? and... Are they at all amusing? Any and all C & Cs welcome!

09-29-2010, 08:50 PM
Looks good!

also, wasn't I Am Legend in NYC? though thats more hordes of zombies/vampires/whatever-they-are than one big baddie.

edit: yes, it was manhatten

09-29-2010, 10:44 PM
The Godzilla doodle is hilarious! :D

09-30-2010, 12:46 PM
Rythal: Yup, I am Legend is in NYC. The problem with it is that there is no specific building damage or location "worthy" of note although I'm sure locations could be identified there isn't really anything to depict.
My current thoughts on the Title/Theme of the map is probably going to be something like "Manhatten Movie Monster Mayhem" and will be limited to the perspective of buildings/edifices that have suffered or been intrinsic to some monster's or alien's "attentions". This rather rules out "I am Legend" and also probably "Mimic" suggested earlier since they are too general in nature. I have the movie so I'll watch it just to check. Thanks for thinking about this though!

In the meantime, here's my view on King Kong (with a reference to the Daleks thing too). The Aliens from "Indepedence Day" will also feature but that image will be seperate (for now) so that I can jigger the position on the final map so that it doesn't obscure the poor old "Giant Mantis" in the tunnel behind...

Empire State Build vs King Kong, Daleks (and the USAF?).

09-30-2010, 02:01 PM
That's awesome! Have some rep.

The less location-specific stuff could be used to fill in semi-random streets in otherwise "boring" areas if you find sections lacking sufficient "landmark" monster victims.

09-30-2010, 06:10 PM
WOW, Those drawings are awesome! I can't wait to see the finished map. And I don't think that the Daleks are going to use Empire State Building any time soon :D

09-30-2010, 06:57 PM
That's awesome! Have some rep.

The less location-specific stuff could be used to fill in semi-random streets in otherwise "boring" areas if you find sections lacking sufficient "landmark" monster victims.

Yeah, you could have an 'I Am Legend' zompire or three peeking out from behind buildings, a Mimic bug and a Mulberry rat peeking out of storm drains or something. Are you planning to have a key noting what each monster is? That'd help with the more obscure/less-identifiable-with-major-landmarks ones.

Steel General
09-30-2010, 07:18 PM
I think it would have been US Army Air Force, IIRC the current Air Force didn't come into existence until after WWII

09-30-2010, 08:27 PM
Ah, yes, USAAF. You're most likely right General - I was going to avoid the issue by not particularly mentioning them in the text! :)

The idea is currently to have the text descriptions mixed in with the images much as the sketch at the start of this thread. It helps to fill in the gaps - either that and/or around the sides. The final version will have to be laid out once all the cartoony stuff is done. Mulberry street will probably feature since it does at least have a focal area and yes, Mimic and Legend zomboids will probably get a mention or something - I'm holding them in reserve in a way.
Anyway, a few more to add to the pile

The Independence Day Aliens - to be positioned over the Empire State when I sort out the layout

The Woolworth Building - a bit of collateral damage in Cloverfield

Madison Square Garden - Godzilla's little nest filled with those velociraptor look-alikes

These are all basically "tidied up" versions of the sketches included in the first post.

10-01-2010, 12:11 AM
The two hapless rogues from Home Alone would be good for a chuckle. I'm loving this.

10-01-2010, 12:31 PM
I'm afraid the Home Alone guys don't really qualify as monsters or aliens. The kid in it is probably borderline.:)

More stuff

The Chrysler Building vs, let's see, the US Army missing Godzilla (again), and "Q, the Winged Serpent"
(who had her nest there)

55, Central Park West vs Mr Staypuft

The Time Warner Building - another piece of collateral in Cloverfield

10-02-2010, 01:19 AM
Where's the stilt-monster from Cloverfield?

10-02-2010, 08:39 AM
You're right, I guess. In the back of my mind I was working from the principle that we don't see what Mr Cloverfield actually does to the building, only the result. That being the case I was going to leave him out of the scene, but it's very dull without and who's to say a little bit of imagination isn't what really happened? I'll get onto it! Thanks.

10-02-2010, 12:49 PM
what about Jason Takes Manhattan ? (joke sort of)..

10-02-2010, 01:17 PM
I've got Jason slated for a possible appearance in Time Square - space allowing! Not to worry.

Time Warner Center - a revisit. The TW Center strikes me as a rather curious aspect of the film. We discover that whatsit's girlfriend is in trouble there fairly early on in the film and it would appear that the Cloverfield monster made a specific early visit to the Central Park area before coming back and hassling people further south again. Rather curious. However, such is it with movies and I don't expect a debate on the issue is likely to resolve this imponderable! :?:


I'm not fully au fait with americanisms, so "Well Shoot!" is my attempt at a mild american exclamation ... along the lines of "Well, crikey!" in the UK. Can anyone suggest a better word or expression? I'd like to keep this clean and more relevant to the locale?

10-02-2010, 01:58 PM
Here's a picture that illustrates why I call him the "stilt monster". He has a very unconventional limb arrangement.... not at all like a guy in a monster suit. I think the creatures in the remake of "The Fog" borrowed from that.

http://api.ning.com/files/tsZ4XiJwZ**pGvqq5Hrbgm573fGo5Vrqc5cAwoYjJjGpuaWtco u5g4iMbBue*k2KyUC*bvc*so2Sdv7DVXOMJVeJZJ1ar3VN/SPOILER_Cloverfield_Monster_by_Doki.jpg

10-02-2010, 03:41 PM
Yeah, I know, he's an ugly sort of chap... I've looked at no end of images on the web and I have the movie on DVD.
I'm being lberal with artistic license here mainly because he's more comical as a humanoid form where his stance/attitude is more recognisable. Old "stilty" is rather too pug ugly to attempt a comical aspect - well for me anyway. I've given him a fairly gangly frame (to go with his pot belly) and made some compromise to get his face "similar". The movie monster has big ugly lobes on the back of his head - which I've removed as confusing - and small eyes (relatively) which I've made larger as is usual in cartoons...

Now I need something for Jason to say... hrm...

this one may get some cropping during layout - it may also be smaller than the others... it's rather crowded in that region of Manhattan for some reason...

Steel General
10-03-2010, 08:34 AM
Now I need something for Jason to say... hrm...

Maybe something about trying out for the NY Rangers?

10-03-2010, 04:17 PM
Possibly! Could I get away with just calling them "Rangers" as in "Where can I try out for the Rangers?"
Perhaps a bit too long really. Maybe something like "Got any spare limbs??"

Anyhoo.. some more bits

The MIB HQ - not damaged but plenty of aliens...

and the MetLife building after a walk-thru by Godzilla

10-04-2010, 05:02 PM
Can't wait 'till you set the whole piece together... And did Godzilla jump trough the building?

10-04-2010, 06:40 PM
Can't wait 'till you set the whole piece together... And did Godzilla jump trough the building?

If I'm honest, I'm also keen to start sticking this together! It's getting a bit onerous doing all these! However, there are still 7 more cartoons needed! Ugh.
As a side note, I've deleted the "War of the Worlds" Athens NY ferry scene. There is no real ferry at Athens it was all mocked up. There really has to be something "visitable" for this map to work, to my mind.

The film doesn't actually show Godzilla and the MetLife building together, you just get a pan shot of the building sometime after the event and it's just a sort of oval hole rather improbably through it. I'd kinda imagine the thing would collapse with that degree of damage. Anyway, artistic "cartoony" license allows me to use the old cliche of leaving his silhoutte behind... ha ha erm... well...
Even more stuff, not terribly exciting but to my mind they qualify and need representation even in smallish images... tbd

Flushing Meadow vs the Bug in MIB 1

The Rosenberg Jewellers from MIB 1

Ben's Pizza Place - where "The Light of Zartha" worked
I don't really have an alien worthy of sketching for this... might have to think a bit more here

The Guggenheim Museum - where the "Perpetrator" in MIB 1 jumps/climbs up

10-07-2010, 09:54 AM
Looks really great.... I could never beat this one, so no need entering x)

10-07-2010, 09:25 PM
Go for it anyway! We need more maps!!! 8)

10-11-2010, 05:33 PM
Back in tablet mode again. Some more inserts for the map

The Monster from 20,000 Fathoms vs Coney Island

Cloverfield vs Statue of Liberty (1)

Cloverfield vs Statue of Liberty (2) - this I hope to have flying over the map

The WotW Tripods (2005) vs Bayonne Bridge

10-11-2010, 05:56 PM
Crayons - your artwork is awesome - I just hope you have enough time to piece it all together into a badass map (that I may actually buy) :)

10-11-2010, 06:14 PM
Thanks! I should be OK for time, there's only 4 more inserts to do.
I was looking at your hip-hop map earlier (lookin' good there! love the brickwork idea!). It occurs to me that my street map only really needs the "major" streets/avenues of Manhatten but I'm not all that sure what New Yorkers consider the "main" ones? You've selected a few salient looking roads for your map, are these the ones I'm looking for too?

10-11-2010, 07:02 PM
I selected the streets that were relevant to the map. Most New Yorkers will probably question them - however the old school hip hoppers will know the streets well.

10-12-2010, 09:29 AM
I thought I ought to run a quick "check" on the theory of the whole thing by doing a quick layout despite having 4 more inserts to do.
This one tries to put the cartoons as close to the physical locations on the map as possible and I think you'll agree - it's a complete shambles!!! Aside from the confusion, it accentuates the difference in the perspective "views" of each thing. (The text/key for this scheme would have been around the edges....)
Also, in resizing some of the cartoons, the line widths need thickening up again...
I'm posting it anway as a "stage" in the progress of this thing and an example of "how not to" I suppose!
Elements like the streets and anything in red are just rough sketched at the moment.
### LATEST WIP ###
<Drag and drop to Recycle Bin!>

10-12-2010, 10:36 AM
My suggestion would be to import all the line art into illustrator, then auto-trace it. Then you have vector outlines you can resize. If you don't have Ill, there are other free tracing programs out there, just not sure the names of them.

10-12-2010, 11:03 AM
Now THAT is something I did not know about! You live and learn!
I have Inkscape - installed but never used yet - which can do it. I need to investigate a method from there. For a quick test my PSP X can't read the svg outputs of Inkscape (plain or Inkscape) - for example. It's probably best that I stick with PSP as the main tool given the time constraints!
Good advice! Repped!

10-12-2010, 11:57 PM
This is what I'm planning to use as the main map element of the thing.
Since the map is about the real contemporary New York I'm thinking of keeping the detail to the amount necessary for a Tourist Guide - the sort of thing you might buy in a Tourist Information Office or find with all that other crud in your hotel room.

This version has the streets and "incident" locations and addresses marked - I think it's enough information for a tourist to find the locations? Any New Yorkers here got any comments about that?
Hrm - it'd be better if I marked the closest subway stations too. Damn, more research!

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10-15-2010, 05:40 PM
Hrm... the silence is rather ominous... hit me with the critiques guys! Please???

I've about done all the cartoons, just one to do - Cloverfield dropkicking Miss Liberty's head...
Right now I'm juggling text vs cartoon size vs available space vs pointers to the locations and it's painful. I've got to cut the text down - the map is going to be more full than I thought if I want the fonts this size...
still very WIP - I'm pushing text and images around on different layers trying to organise this... I'm no graphic designer tho!
### LATEST WIP ###
the cartoons will get a white background when finalised.

Oh, and I added some relevant subway stations. I wish the station names were a bit more distinctive.

10-15-2010, 05:51 PM
Sorry for no response to last update.. :P And you are going to change the colours, right? ^^' I mean.. Light blue and grey? Eh? xD Anyway, the drawings still look great. The text could probably be shortened down a bit..? And you got The Scream all over the map! :D I'm proud of being Norwegian right now :D

10-15-2010, 06:43 PM
Mayhaps a slight 'glow' around the lettering? Something to help someone to see/read them?

Aval Penworth
10-15-2010, 06:52 PM
I'm not feelin' it so far. What was your idea behind the colours?

10-16-2010, 12:19 AM
Colours. Argh. :?
Simplistic reasons really. It's a city, so grey. It's water, so blue. Keep them light to allow stuff on top to show better.
Red text in Chiller font, blood and so on.
Dark blue for subway stations, it seems to be kinda standard.
It's a utilitarian approach, I suppose. In the back of my mind I have that tourist map thing. One of those fold out things in about A4 size you get from a tourist information centre. SImple colours for clarity and cheap printing.

You're right, colours. Hrm, back in a tic...

(The subway station symbol is tunnel shaped with "The Scream" for a bit of fun. )

10-16-2010, 12:25 AM
Bayonne Bridge has an "it's" for "its" error. If you're still switching text around in general, I'll hold off on checking the rest for now. I don't really like the red lettering. That'd be a fine font if you were doing slasher horror locations, but these are largely monster films. Something a little less "spattery" in green would be my choice. You might also want to see if you can thin down the line between land and water (depending on the colors you use for land, you might not really need a line at all), because where the line crosses your drawings right now, it detracts a bit from those wonderful monster+building pics.

10-16-2010, 02:20 AM
"It's" and "its" always catch me out however hard I concentrate! Thanks!
I'm probably going to reduce the font size to ease the crowding and reduce the amount of text to a minimum for the smaller buildings - enough to remind people what it is they're looking at without any of the embellishment.
The "idea" (such as it is!) is to wipe out the map underneath the text and cartoons much like this (after improving the text layout that is)
which removes a lot of the "blank" areas of the map. That sort of effect will have to be at the end once the layout is done.

I'm still agonising over colours and whether to bang in a texture for the background map. I'm favouring taking the blue away from the sort of primary pale Cyan towards a more "complex" blue, still light but veering towards turquoise. The grey I can't really figure an alternative to. It is "city colour" and it acts as a balance for the brighter text and contrasty cartoons. Green font might lead me elsewhere...
I still like the Chiller font here as it has that oldies movies feel to it but as you say, it's "slasher" not "monster". Old monster movie posters have that stentorian sort of bold capitals.
You've given me a load to think about, thanks guys!

10-16-2010, 05:38 AM
I've been playing. Trying our some ideas like swatches. The main title font is a more "B Movie" style I rather liked.

Steel General
10-16-2010, 07:59 AM
I like the text in the right-most 'box', it is by far the easiest to read and for me it just plain looks better.

10-17-2010, 11:59 AM
Agreed. Simpler is better, I think you could just replace all text in the box (except the upper header) with a plain font. Probably arial or something. And by using lower case letters the text will be alot easier to read and people will focus more on the illustrations.


10-18-2010, 11:22 AM
Point taken. I'm not a great fan of Arial for this sort of thing. I think I've come up with a legible font that fits with the style (Amiene).
That said, I've not done a map like this before anyway, so... comments would be much appreciated - if not always followed to the letter (or font!) :D

### LATEST WIP ###

It's rather shambolic, which I sort of like, but then again, I don't have the skills of a Graphic Designer, so...

EDIT: Ah crud! I just noticed that whopper of an error in the left corner. Doh!

BTW: I'm trying a 128 colour optimised palette PNG file here so it's a bit squiffy

10-19-2010, 05:00 AM
I'm still fiddling with other methods and/or looks for this. I may post a few if you can spare the time to peruse? It may be the best version has elements of different proposals. Your help is very much needed. For example - if you still feel the font is not legible enough, I wanna hear it! The source document is massive and has about 30 layers so I can mess around with lots of things still.
### LATEST WIP ###
(not so much "latest" as "alternate")

10-19-2010, 05:06 AM
looking good crayons, always hard to get a lot of stuff in small places... In my humble opinon I like this latest version better, the drawings are more integrated, making the map seem less cramped. However, I think the grey is to gray, I'd love this with white or a little off white instead. :)

10-19-2010, 06:00 AM
Cheers tilt!
I'm still popping in versions and this was serendipitously the next one - with more white, less hard edges, texture
Anyone just coming in at this post, there's two other versions on Page 5 messages #49 and #50 of this thread for comparisons.

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10-19-2010, 06:11 AM
This entry will probably get my vote for great drawings and text, it will, however, not get my vote for being a great map. Hope I wasn't to harsh on you now, but.. Well .. :)

10-19-2010, 07:22 AM
not a big fan of the "wall paper texture", sorry :)

10-19-2010, 09:02 AM
Yup, I'm with both of you on these critiques, which is why I'm still footling around with this thing!
The map. Hrm. Technically I think I've smothered it rather, in particular I've lost the distinctive shape of Manhattan - The Island. Second, it's too "unsketched" and clashes with the cartoony bits. Thirdly, it's too "flat" in colour. A 3D texture isn't the answer, it always looks like some kind of stippled wallpaper especially the one I just tried, I need to "paint" it.

10-19-2010, 12:35 PM
The white soft call-outs above is my favorite. And I freakin love this map. I think it would be the best if you just had more time. That's what I was afraid of. You have so much badass artwork, I wasn't sure how you were going to merge it all together. It's busy for sure, but it's starting to work out. The city background "map" part is very dull. Also, I think a bit of color added to your sketches would be nice.

Overall - I love this piece. Especially the write ups. Great work Crayons.

10-19-2010, 05:33 PM
Spelling error in the Flatiron building description : Caeer should be Career I assume

looks good though

10-21-2010, 10:04 PM
This is probably the most "mappy" thing I've done here so far - without resorting to 3D that is. It's also a tad daunting because it's a real place (or so I'm told) and I'm trying to present real data about it. Probably a mistake.
Anyway, the map part was very plain so I've done a bit of this and that - some PSP textures and some painting stuff of my own. The brick thing is kinda partly because RJ put the idea in my head, partly bacause, well, it's a city, but mostly because it sort of reflects NY's city blocks structure... hrm.
Anyway, I'm about all done on this, for better or worse - unless anyone comes up with a stonking idea for it or points out some heinous error!
### LATEST WIP ###
This is a compressed jpg. The original is a pspimage file with more layers than I like to think about - 65 Megs of it. The flattened png file is 17 Megs.

10-22-2010, 10:26 AM
Nice work there Crayons. I'm not totally digging the grass texture, or even the brick for that matter, but it's alright.. What makes the map is the artwork. It'll definitely be one people remember!

10-22-2010, 10:33 AM
I'm lovin' it, and not in a McDonald's kinda way ;)

Keep up the work!

10-22-2010, 03:13 PM
A MacDonald's kinda way is OK with me if you want ! I'm more of a Burger King / KFC bloke tho. I only mention this because the design is meant to be a bit "tacky" in that commercial sort of way. I can see it as a table mat in a diner much more than as "work of art" in a gallery.
I am largely at a loss as to what to do with the map textures. The brick and grass thing was mostly about losing the "flatness" of before but without looking like wallpaper. I'm not wild about them artistically myself but they "fit" the best that I can think of right now. There's still several days for me to stare at the issue more... I guess the best texture would be something that looks like buildings and trees... hrm

10-22-2010, 09:57 PM
BENS PIZZA: No apostrophe? Also, description is missing closing period.
MADISON SQUARE GARDEN: "Average Joe" s/b capitalized. Also, "performance" is missing the "o".
TIME SQUARE: That would be Times Square, I think you'll find. Also, "psychopath" is misspelled (reverse the "s" and "y").
TIME WARNER CENTER: Missing the "T" to start off the second sentence.
CONEY ISLAND: I strongly recommend hyphenating "genre-defining".
MULBERRY STREET: It should be "eponymous", with an "m".
EMPIRE STATE BUILDING: The episode title is "Daleks in Manhatten". The Independence Day commentary is a bit rambling. You probably want two sentences there.
CHRYSLER BUILDING: It should be "Serpent" with two "e"s.

10-23-2010, 03:24 AM
Blimey. I thought I'd read all those enough times already - I guess one becomes blind after a bit.

The apostrophe was missing mainly because that font doesn't have one! I've fabricated one myself. As for all the typos, I've corrected those on my machine now, thanks.

I did mean to ask if it was "ok" to say that about Madison Sq Gdn. Being English I may have stepped on some cultural sensitivity? I called it an "Average Joe" because, IMO, it just looks a tad boring compared to other arenas I've seen?
I'll reword the Independence Day blurb as you suggest. It was niggling at me too.

10-24-2010, 12:22 PM
Loving where this is going - and good work to everyone on the detailed critiques!

10-24-2010, 06:15 PM
Don't feel bad. It's very, very hard to proofread your own work, unless you've been able to set it aside long enough to forget what you "know" you wrote.

10-27-2010, 07:34 AM

OK - time to finalise this. Unless there are any further typos or easily fixed errors this is the final version I reckon.
Again, it's a compressed jpg.
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10-30-2010, 03:49 AM
That. Is. Awesome! And the Mulberry rats made it in! Yay! :D

10-30-2010, 11:50 AM
Thanks Diamond! You're a diamond! 8)
Last call I guess - there were some bits of "whitewash" missing and some "blotchiness I didn't like. I hope this is a bit better.
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Back to POV I think...

10-31-2010, 03:24 PM
I keep saying "this is it, finished" to myself and then coming back to it. The green before was simply terrible, I can only plead late night insanity.
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