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Yandor
08-09-2011, 10:05 PM
So I've stuck my hand back into the Town building scheme... Who ever said that Town building was a sink whole of time.... I never believed them, until now! haha I've tried many times to do a town map, and... well... cheated my way through as much of it as possible (short cuts, simple patterns etc)... So heres my attempt, so far at tackling a real city.

I have Ascension's town tutorial to thank, for some of the styles and processes (highly adapted and changed around with my own textures etc) This is just the Palace area, and "Noble area." I'm still debating on how I want to do roofs, and will soon be laying the foundation to the rest of the city.

Ideas, advice, techniques, anything would be wonderful!

p.s. This is a map from my Continent of Cairan, Kingdom of Torovia maps.

waldronate
08-09-2011, 10:33 PM
The gate to the north is interesting. It opens on ocean. I'm guessing there will be docks there eventually?

Yandor
08-10-2011, 12:28 AM
The first idea was a Bridge, but I'm thinking an Alcatraz prison kind of a thing. So we got the gates that lead to a dock for royal visits/ferry to the prison. Still trying to figure out what to do... I'm horrible at visual representation, so I'm just playing it by ear with the trial and error process... There will be other districts heading south and east(North East) of the palace area.

RevGunn
08-10-2011, 12:38 AM
Well, for what its worth, I think its an awesome start.

Yandor
08-10-2011, 03:09 AM
A Bit more of it being done, I made an attempt at the docks... haha can't say I like them all that much, i still think they are a bit large... Anyways still ideas, comments or anything would be of great help!

LonewandererD
08-10-2011, 06:04 AM
I think what the docks need are some drop shadows, what texture did you use for the sea/shallow floor and how did you implement it? It looks nice, will be interesting to see this progress.

-D-

Yandor
08-10-2011, 12:26 PM
Thanks D, I added a bit of shadow to it. As for the the pattern its the one I've attached. Well as for how I did it, I did Ascension's shore part of the Town Tutorial and just kind of spun it in my own way.

I've got 6 layers, starting from bottom to top of the stack

1 Base Layer with fill of 6dd0f7, Pattern overlay, Linear Light, 20 Opac, 50 Scale, Color overlay 6dcff6, Hardlight, 95 Opac
2 Fill of 003663, having a large feather, and had it contracted in (with an ocean selection) to make the darker shallow area. 40 Opac
3 Fill of 3e5778, Contracting even more then layer 2, and about the same feather (I think I contracted 100 for the first with 50 feather, then this one I did 200 or 300 contract with a 100 feather) this was to make the deeper ocean, set to Saturation
4 Fill of 003663 and this is to fill the opposite end (shallow end) of the previous layer (layer 3) same contract and feather but inverted, 90 Opac, and set to Saturation
5 Fill of 003663 with the same selection as layer 3 (I wanted a deeper blue for the deeper end)
6 then I selected the original water base (with a feather ended at the shore) and filled with 50% gray, set to Saturation and 30 opacity

Thats all of it!

LonewandererD
08-10-2011, 12:59 PM
Thanks Yandor :) . Will definately be giving this method a try.

-D-

Steel General
08-10-2011, 01:11 PM
I think this is coming along quite nicely, towns are hard.

Yandor
08-12-2011, 07:33 PM
Thanks for the encouragement SG, and they are a pain...

Anyways I've made a bit more progess (haven't had all that much time to work on it, I still don't know if I want this style of housing, or use the kind of square idea, where you have buildings lining a block of roads and a green area in the middle... I may end up doing sections of both, we'll see I guess.

So I added in the Prison (yes its bigger than the Palace, but thats intended, its suppose to be the prison of Torovia, anyone captured is taken there. I shorted up the palace docks as well. Also added in 1 section of housing/quarters, still have 2 others and a dock area/industry area to do.

Moe
08-13-2011, 01:07 AM
This gets more and more impressive :)
I really like your docks.

>Moe

Ascension
08-13-2011, 02:06 PM
The black stroke looks a little overpowering, maybe try a grayish brown so that it recedes a little bit instead of standing out so much. But if you keep it is as then that's fine, too.

Yandor
08-14-2011, 06:37 AM
Thanks Big A for that, I was thinking that before, (had reduced the opacity from the original) then I looked at it again after your remark, it was very obvious... Anyways I'm playing with ideas still, I still like my original plan, but I've got a few patterns (still trying to cheat my way through this, don't want to do it by hand! haha) but here are a few options tell me what you think, and possible pros/cons or whatever you think might help.

1. So I've got the original colored area, I've got around the south end of it the same patterned just not cleaned up (can you tell the difference yes no?)
2. Its the same as #4 but reduced down in size
3. Is like the colored area but has more diagonal buildings (aidybaby's pattern reduced by 50%)
4. Its a pattern I used to brush in the roads...

I need to clean up all the areas (around the edges) I plan on adding color to individual buildings/areas (not just a random cloud color) Also plan on created individual buildings in the middle of these areas, mostly important buildings of note really. But let me know what directions would be better! Thanks!

oh I had to dropped the resolution of the image to fit the attachment size. If a better resolution on the areas is needed let me know!

Yandor
08-14-2011, 02:41 PM
So I woke up this morning and realized I could of done a much better job in separating the sections, then realized I'm an idiot, haha... I could of done the sections of housing much better (crisper edges) I shrunk the original patterns down and they got fuzzy edges which make the sections of houses look like garbage. I fixed up the patterns and colorized them so you can "judge them" better =D

1. Original Colored area to the South
2. Red area just north of Colorized Area, is #5's pattern reduced to 85%
3. Green Area is #5's pattern reduced to 75%
4. Yellow Area is AidyBaby's Pattern reduced to 50%
5. Blue Area, Original Pattern to create my housing sections.

I'm still undecided, I'm leaning more towards #2 or possibly #3... I'm thinking if I use #2 for most the city, and use #1 for Park areas, and less dense areas (remove some of the middle buildings )...

I realize it all comes down to scale, as it is my major flaw... So as I said any comments would be wonderful!

edit: #2 wasn't the right pattern (was the same as #5) so I fixed the image)

Yandor
08-15-2011, 04:12 PM
Well I played with the idea a bit more, I think I like this for a base, I probably will go through and clean up the funny edges on the buildings but I think I'm going to move forward on this idea...

Alright so image #1 (Tyris5a) is the original pattern and Image #2 is the adjusted portion of the same area. The Adjusted area is the idea of what I'm going to be doing with the rest of the building sections. (even the red houses on the south side I'll change over.) Mind you the adjusted area was done very quickly so some building sections (in the this area) weren't even touched from the original pattern....

Comments or Criticism is welcome!

Ascension
08-15-2011, 04:46 PM
I like 2 there, the houses are a bit smaller thus the roads are a tad wider. Feels more "right" to me.

Yandor
08-17-2011, 06:24 AM
So I took another stab at it, I shrunk them down a bit more, I almost think that the area now is a bit big for the amount of "buildings" that are inhabited (aka my 100,000 town went to 1,000,000... not really but thats the idea, and still don't know if its a good or bad thing)... Meh regardless I like progress, and good progress at that.

So with this image, we got the shrunk houses, cleaned up outskirt housing, shrunk the buildings and color of the buildings inside of the Stone Wall area (bottom left side) Also added in a plaza area to see how good the effects and stuff can be...

C&C would be appreciated!

ravells
08-17-2011, 06:49 AM
Looking great! Fab road network! I just wonder whether the castle wall might look better if you changed or reduced the size of the texture? Because the flagstones are all oriented NS/EW it looks a bit odd to my eye, but it's a very small thing.

Yandor
08-17-2011, 07:06 PM
Thanks Ravells, I'll touch those up!

So I was trying to calculate out the scale, what it comes down to from the Far West Wall of the palace, to the farthest Eastern edge of the city (straight line West to East, no diagonal) is about 7.5 or 7 1/2 miles, and from North to South its 9 miles... Is this even realistic for a Large City? I know in modern days its fine, but a fantasy Land...

Now that I've got the concept, Layer effects and process to recreate everything, would restructuring the entire city be a better idea? (better lay out really) I was thinking, of leaving the Stone walled areas, so the palace,prison and rich area, but redoing the entire outer layout.. Suggestions??

Edit: I calculated it from my Large world map, and Kingdom maps. So as I scaled up from my continent map, I got my kingdom scale, and then from kingdom I got my city scale. The image of Tyris is 5000x4000 px which is 16x13 miles (almost full image I showed here (http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?15524-City-of-Tyris&p=161594&viewfull=1#post161594))

Yandor
08-18-2011, 11:24 PM
Alright so heres the new and improved Tyris, I think this is a much better version, but let me know!

Yandor
08-19-2011, 03:06 AM
Well I've been trying to figure out the best way to do a business quarter... area with small ally ways, and very condensed buildings, that will contain many shops... Well I've got this, does it work? Don't worry about the color of the buildings but I'm talking about shape and everything else! I also think I'll need to cut the buildings up a bit more but yeah...

Please let me know.

Yandor
08-20-2011, 06:34 PM
well I wasn't a big fan of the other process, it didn't really fit in with the rest of the map, so I decided to try another way, this is the result so far, its alright, not the best but I think it gets the job done, so I'll probably move forward and finish off the other business areas in the same manner.

The area to the right with the bigger blocks are don't yet.

Moe
08-21-2011, 12:54 AM
It is a pleasure to keep an eye on that and watch your progress ;)
In your latest WIP the houses look a little bit distorted to me - that may arise from the quarter's shape.
Perhaps it'll help if you'd arrange the houses a bit more irregular.

>Moe

Yandor
08-21-2011, 04:28 AM
Thanks Moe, maybe having a bigger view can help? I donno regardless I finished up the district, and I think I'm going to try one more thing to try and fix the distorted buildings. But Moe does this look any better anyways? Also would making the section fully squared off, meaning only straight lines, no waves or curves, think that may help with the distortion? But I'll post the cleaner houses when I do them, and I'll maybe even try doing straight lines, and post those up too... Anyways comments would be great!

Moe
08-21-2011, 05:48 AM
But Moe does this look any better anyways?
Definitely this looks better. I think it would help if you'd either straightened the main road leading to the docks or made it look more zigzaged.
The dock area looks very regular whereas the rest of your city is more organic. In combination with the shape of the coastline this might be the reason for the distorted look. The eye thinks it is somehow buckled.

I've sent you a PM ;)

>Moe

Moe
08-21-2011, 02:28 PM
Here is the example we talked of.
You can see that the dock area is of a less organic shape than the rest of your city (therefore I made the stamp-version).
Imho this looks less distorted...

>Moe

Yandor
08-21-2011, 02:41 PM
ahhh ok ok, I get what your suggesting (or I think so haha) There are plenty of inroads leading from the housing area into the dock area, and what your showing is to use those roads as part of my road network in the docks as well, not just end when they hit the dock area (also straightening out the main road too). Would having more squared buildings like the ones along the cost part of the docks be better as well?

Moe
08-21-2011, 10:22 PM
Would having more squared buildings like the ones along the cost part of the docks be better as well?
I guess that'll help, too. In general, alternating the houses shape gives a more organic look - and you could plant some of those grey houses (those on the dirt ground) inside the dock area to break the strong border between the docks and the rest of your city.

>Moe

Yandor
08-22-2011, 08:19 PM
Hmm so heres another stab at making it more "organic" like the rest of the buildings... I think I'm getting closer to the right result I'm looking for.

Moe
08-22-2011, 09:41 PM
Yupp, this is better imo - nicely done :)
You could also let some of the western quarters grow into the dock area, if you want to. It would rough up the border between the quarters
and erase the straight lines of the ground change.

>Moe

bigbear98
08-23-2011, 03:19 AM
I just found this, and this is a beautiful piece of art. Keep up the good work. I'm definitely going to use this for some RPG campaign, with your permission, when it is finished.

Yandor
08-23-2011, 04:24 AM
I'd be happy to let you use it, only on one condition ;) that you start getting your hands dirty with some good ol' map making yourself!

bigbear98
08-23-2011, 05:01 AM
I think that sounds like a task that I could try my hand at. Have you done this map primarily with Photoshop?

Yandor
08-23-2011, 05:37 AM
well good, yes its all 100% photoshop.

Yandor
02-07-2012, 01:00 AM
So after a long hiatus, and lack of time (hooray for school... All I have to say is Discrete math, and Boolean algebra can die...) Anyways, I had started to reshape Tyris, a day or so from my last picture update, and after a day working on it, school started and my time disappeared, so I've touched on it here and there for the last few months (only a few min really...) but this is the new run at it, and I like it a lot better, so far at least.

There are 5 images, I plan on shrinking the final image by 50%, I believe the image itself is roughly 3 miles, so the island shown would be around half a mile from E to W, and same N to S... So input ideas, and anything else is greatly needed.

Image 1 = Small overview of whats to come.
Image 2 & 3 = Full size, but I want to know what style of houses are better (rounded or squared).
Image 4 & 5 = 50% reduced size of 2 & 3.

Yandor
02-09-2012, 04:06 AM
Well small update... I did a bit of saturation on the town (roads, buildings etc). Also added in a few more things with the surrounding islands.


again, the full and 50% view of the image, C&C is welcome!