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meleeguy
05-08-2008, 02:19 AM
The Token Inn - A place to park your token when you are not adventuring.

We'll see how far I get.

Great site.

meleeguy
05-10-2008, 07:48 PM
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Onward!

Redrobes
05-10-2008, 08:23 PM
Nicely done, and you also now on the May 08 Thumbnails (www.viewing.ltd.uk/Temp/CG/ChallengeTN/Challengers_May08.htm) page too.

meleeguy
05-10-2008, 08:43 PM
Thank you, this site is proving a great inspiration and resource to me.

My hat is off to you all.

Could I get a thread name change to

May Entry: The Ambush Inn

:)

Constructive criticism is most welcome! I'm a little above the byte count limit so I'm going to put in some carpet. I'm worried how to texture the stable floor without it being an eyesore.

Redrobes
05-10-2008, 09:01 PM
It looks great but both your textures are a huge byte sink. Could you get away with something less expensive for the gray mottled one ? It would give you more memory to play with finer detail for the interiors.

Torq
05-11-2008, 04:17 AM
Thank you, this site is proving a great inspiration and resource to me.

My hat is off to you all.

Could I get a thread name change to

May Entry: The Ambush Inn




Consider it done.

Torq

meleeguy
05-11-2008, 10:33 PM
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For those who may not know, I just discovered in PS7 "Save to Web..." (jpg) yields much better file sizes than "Save As.." (jpg).

This is look is much more as I originally intended.

RPMiller
05-12-2008, 05:35 PM
Your shadows are a bit too "overpowering" for most VTT use. Generally speaking shadows are not a "good thing" to add to VTT maps because you never know what the lighting will be or which direction it will be oriented. Not to mention when the furnishings are placed they typically are not going to have a shadow so it will look a little odd.

Otherwise, this shaped up very nicely.

meleeguy
05-12-2008, 07:18 PM
Your shadows are a bit too "overpowering".

I very much appreciate the feedback. That makes sense. I'll try either a drop shadow or perhaps nothing at all since the flagstone texture is so strong already.

I'm going to focus on the inn interior (as per Redrobes), and move outside again if time permits. At this point everything is a struggle as I traverse all the various learning curves.

I'm assuming doors and windows are desirable from a VTT perspective. What about carpets, tables, and chairs?

Thanks again,
-meleeguy

RPMiller
05-12-2008, 07:52 PM
Basically anything that is considered "stationary" can be put in to the base map, but stuff that might get tossed around, moved, etc. should probably be added later as a stamp. Generally doors and windows are fine. Some GMs like to have the door as a separate stamp so that they can actually "open" it for the PCs but I think they are in the minority.

There is another thread that lists various things to not include in a VTT map. If you click the New Posts link at the top you should see it in your list.

meleeguy
05-15-2008, 03:40 AM
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meleeguy
05-15-2008, 04:15 AM
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dorpond
05-15-2008, 12:37 PM
Coming together nicely!

If I would change one thing, it would be to lower the saturation a bit. I think too much in-your-face color can take away from the overall scene.

I personally prefer a more washed out look but that is just a matter of taste and style.

Nice job though!

meleeguy
05-15-2008, 01:55 PM
Thank you!

Saturation, hmmm. Anyone have any recommendations on either books or web sites that covers this sort of thing from the artist's perspective? My college days are long over but I've got this itch that says I should sign up for Color 101.

:)

Midgardsormr
05-15-2008, 02:14 PM
For starters, look in the Mapping Resources forum for a thread that says something about color scheme generators.

I'll keep an eye out for decent color theory tutorials, but most of the ones I have run across so far describe color mixing instead of what makes a pleasing palette.

meleeguy
05-15-2008, 02:45 PM
Pontificating on pleasing palettes is perilously perplexing!

Color scheme generators, here I come.

meleeguy
05-16-2008, 06:01 AM
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torstan
05-16-2008, 06:56 AM
I like the layout. I have to say that I can't help but see the walls as set down from the floor. I guess this is because the 'standard' lighting angle for images is often from the top-left.

Alternatively, I'd suggest a softer drop shadow all the way around the walls. This has the advantage that it is agnostic about the actual lighting in the Inn but still pulls the walls above the floor when you are looking at it.

meleeguy
05-17-2008, 02:43 AM
Thanks Torstan.

and now...the color scheme generator made me do it!

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Is this..better...or have I strayed further? :D

torstan
05-17-2008, 06:57 AM
Nope, that's much better. The walls now look like they are above the floor. Good stuff.

Redrobes
05-17-2008, 07:56 AM
I don't know if this is useful but a while ago I asked Marcel of CGTextures if he had any Persian carpet textures and then he went out and took an absolute bucket load of them.

http://www.cgtextures.com/textures.php?t=browse&q=22019

jfrazierjr
05-17-2008, 11:50 AM
Pretty nice. One thing that bugs me is the wood floor texture. Unless this is modern day, you need some plank lines. Not sure if you can get this in and still keep the file size down though.

meleeguy
05-18-2008, 04:38 AM
you need some plank lines.

That comment prompted me to not give up on plank lines...I think this is far superior and compresses well.

Redrobes...those are jaw droppingly delicious carpets!

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meleeguy
05-19-2008, 03:37 AM
And some windows for assassins and thieves to make use of. :)

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meleeguy
05-22-2008, 03:24 AM
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Torq
05-22-2008, 04:36 AM
Nice Meleeguy. I love the new ground texture and the paths. They look cool. also the colours seem to have settled down a bit. I would suggest de-saturating the whole thing a little but that may just be a issue of personal taste. Keep it up.

Torq

meleeguy
05-22-2008, 02:31 PM
Thanks for taking the time to review and comment Torq. Quite simply, I greatly enjoy your maps.

Color, color, color, what's a fun way to learn about more about color? Anyone?

Midgardsormr
05-22-2008, 11:16 PM
I found a nice set of articles on Pantone's website:

http://www.pantone.com/pages/pantone/pantone.aspx?ca=29

Start with the articles listed under "Color Fundamentals." Their visual aids are inexplicably lousy, considering the source, but the info is very good. I haven't read all of it yet, but I'm working my way through it as I have time tonight.

meleeguy
05-23-2008, 10:26 PM
Thank you Midgardsormr, that's on the list.

This may be my final entry, if not then close to it. Thanks again for the help I've received and good luck to everyone.

Ahem, please let me know if you kill any players on it.>:) The design goal was warm, comfy, and tricky to defend.


Free for non-commercial use.

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meleeguy
05-24-2008, 02:01 AM
Minor errors corrected - who am I kidding, I'll be fiddling with this until the threads are locked probably.

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meleeguy
05-24-2008, 02:03 AM
Please note you may need to click thru the "in place" viewer, which for me gets the plank lines wrong, which are straight.

I wouldn't want to be caught with my planks down again. :o

meleeguy
05-24-2008, 02:07 AM
Sorry for all the posts, I didn't turn on some layer effects that I want folks to see on.

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meleeguy
05-24-2008, 02:20 AM
Corrected door widths.

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meleeguy
05-24-2008, 04:26 AM
Bright walls were hurting my eyes, so I added some badly needed grunge.

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meleeguy
05-24-2008, 07:24 AM
Short drop shadows added, it seems too flat otherwise. The plaster needs it own layer (so it can be very short), and the chimney needs its own also (taller).

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alucard339
05-24-2008, 03:58 PM
Your inn is looking better each time, but I would add texture to the floor (a cloud layer in screen or overlay in Photoshop), so it would not look so perfect.

Unless I'm mistaken, your windows seem to float on the wall. You should cut your wall as you did for your doors, so they will be part of the wall.


And finally I would try to add a noise layer to your ground dirt so it would look more real and sandy.


Continue the great work,
Alu.

meleeguy
05-25-2008, 03:34 AM
Greetings Alucard,

More astute comments - this site is like the collective Yoda of map making.

I've set the windows into the walls, which I though about doing earlier but tried the lazy way out.

You people are merciless - in a good way.

I must mull over your other comments, can you recommend an easy way to add 'sand' to a colored cloud layer? I'm afraid I have alot to learn about PS still.

This is fun.

-meleeguy

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meleeguy
05-25-2008, 03:54 AM
I make the 26th the last day for submissions - can someone confirm that?

I'm really enjoying the 'challenge' regardless of the outcome, but I want to know when I can no longer tweak my map. :D

alucard339
05-25-2008, 09:40 AM
Hi Mel,

If I read correctly, you need a little more explanation for the PS effects. :idea:

If not, look at it any way :P

I've use ur post version to do the following effect:

Step 1 - a cloud effect used on the stable floor

a) Create a new layer then use the filter/render/cloud effect. Donít' forget to select good colors.
b) To make the cloud look more contrasting, redo a filter/render/different cloud effect on the same layer
c) Try some layer style effects: I've chose pin light with a 30% opacity, so it will just add a slight effect to the ground.

Step 2 - make the inn floor more real

- chose the floor layer then either double click where the "F" will be or right click and chose the blending option. Then go on pattern overlay play with the pattern option until you find the desired effect. Same here as step 1, keep the opacity low.

alucard339
05-25-2008, 09:42 AM
Hi Mel,

Step 3 - the sand effect.

a) Make a cloud layer (as above) in a new layer, and then put a filter/render/fiber effect to it. Rotate and resize the layer to fit the wind effect on the sand then play with the layer effect (I chose color dodge and 50% opacity). Just make sure that this layer is just above the ground and not the stone walk.
b) I decided to put some more gray to the stone walk to make it come out more.

Step 4 - The windows

- Here some more advise to make them look more like windows:
a) In the blue ones, I have just cut out a portion on the exterior of the inn, but they still look funny.
b) In the red ones, I cut both side of the windows to make them more real: a window is supposed to be thinner than a wall.
c) Also make sure that your windows like those in the cabins look the same: ex.: the white side all to the exterior, so you will keep a real feeling to the map and not just a cut and paste feeling.

Hope it help u a bit,

Alu.

Midgardsormr
05-25-2008, 12:41 PM
Another strategy for grunging things up and/or disrupting patterns is to find a nice, contrasty grunge image and apply it to the surfaces you want to change.

Go to http://www.cgtextures.com and look up the grunge category. Find yourself some filth that looks good and save the large version. Open the grungemap you selected and play with the brightness and contrast until the areas you don't want to see are white. Place the map over the object you want to dirty up and crop it to fit. Set the mode to multiply (keeps dark areas and makes lighter areas transparent), and the grunge map will look like it's part of your floor.

The attachments below should illustrate. The floor, the grunge, the modified grunge, and the two combined:

Midgardsormr
05-25-2008, 12:45 PM
That example is a bit extreme. If you play with the settings a bit, you can come up with more subtle effects:

meleeguy
05-25-2008, 04:34 PM
Wow, simple yet chewy.

Many many thank yous.

jfrazierjr
05-25-2008, 05:22 PM
Wow, that is incrediably sweet! Perhaps closest to outside doors would be the heaviest concentrations of "dirt".

Joe

meleeguy
05-26-2008, 03:05 AM
I've minimized the path stones, to free up bytes for grunging. I've reworked the windows (thinning and color, removed colored shadow), and grunged the stable floor.

I've only PS7 with no fiber filter, and which I couldn't replicate the finer nuances of with any other tool yet. I'm moving past this to grunging the floor tomorrow with the ~4k bytes.

Thanks again for the great tips and lessons, such as I've been able to absorb.

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torstan
05-26-2008, 04:39 AM
This is coming along really nicely. Looking forward to seeing this when it has been grunged.

meleeguy
05-27-2008, 01:06 AM
Grunged floor, first attempt.

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