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Sharpe
03-21-2013, 11:37 PM
Greetings!

I'm not an artist. I'm certainly no where near many of the members' level of talent on here. I just use GIMP, but not very well. XD

Here's the base of my map (3,000 x 3,000): http://img706.imageshack.us/img706/6050/shadowyrm6.jpg

First, I painted black walls on a white canvas. Then -- obviously to those who know of it -- I used RobA's Subterrainian Map Prettier Script (http://www.cartographersguild.com/automation-scripts-actions/2759-subterrainian-map-prettier-script-4.html#post40367). After removing the square grid, I sandwiched a hex grid (http://www.cartographersguild.com/automation-scripts-actions/5338-gimp-script-hex-grid.html#post60475) between the wall and floor layers (we play GURPS Fourth Edition (http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/), which uses hexes).

Then, I freehand drew the little elevation stairs all around and used the drop shadow filter on them.

That's it so far.

Eventually, I'll remove the wall texture and use filters to create my own with the help of the tutorial, "How to Blend Textures for Use in Battlemapping with GIMP. (http://www.cartographersguild.com/tutorials-how/12066-my-battlemap-tutorials.html)"

Next, I'm going to add stalagmites everywhere. Then, I plan to blend in some dirt texture (created with filters) on the floor. Not sure exactly how I should do that, I just know one single texture for the whole floor is boring.

I'd love to add mist, but I've no idea how to even start with that or how well even an expert could pull it off.

Dramatic lightning would be great as well, but again, I'm a total newbie with little experience and no talent.

One thing I really want to accomplish is add water in the center room on the bottom "row" of rooms using only filters, no textures. Though I worked through a good tutorial (http://www.rwenger.com/ocean-images-how-to-make-water-in-gimp/) once, I can't seem to get results that please me. If anyone can help, I'd appreciate it! I want to add a pool of water to the north and south of the "bridge" in that room.

I might break down and add furniture and stuff, but I typically use minis to represent things like that. Also, I have no resources at all, rugs, tables, urns, boxes, books, piles of coins -- none of that stuff. I'd have to spend hours searching for it all.

Well, thanks so much for talking the time to read my post and look at my map! Advice is greatly appreciated, but remember, I barely know how to use GIMP at all! :)


Regards,


-RD Sharpe


EDIT: Latest version: http://img854.imageshack.us/img854/7528/shadowyrm8.jpg

Sharpe
03-22-2013, 12:45 AM
Update: I added three new layers in an attempt to make water. The water layer is just a selected area filled with blue at normal and 75% opacity. I know water isn't "blue," its translucent and reflects whatever is above it, but... I didn't know what else to do there.

The top layer is just a 50-px brush around the edge, then a gaussian blur with a radius of 100 px.

The bottom later is the floor texture copied, then blurred by a radius of 5 px.

It just looks kinda... surreal. Not really like water, I don't think. Reducing the opacity of the blue makes it more translucent, but not really closer to water.

I dunno.

Jacktannery
03-22-2013, 07:35 AM
Great start Sharpe. Your map has great personality. I like your water but agree that it is very saturated with blue. Water is very hard to do, and i'm terrible at it so can't advise, but there is nothing wrong with your water. If you are aiming for a photo-realistic water, then you will need to desaturate it heavily until only only a trace of blue remains - water in a lit cave like this is very reflective, almost glass-like. If its in the dark the water is black; this can still look good but very dark water depends on really good edges. You can see it in a map of a cave I did for a friend in the Virtual Tabletop/Battlemap Mapping forum, look for 'Heart of Shadow' cavern map.

Other than the water (which I quite like anyway) I think your map is a bit dark. Lighten it up a tiny bit

The key problem on your map is your steps and changes in levels. You have the shading backwards. Take a good look and you will see what I mean. Its wrong - you need to do it again the other way around. This will help make your map come together. Also did you really use drop shadow on this? Don't. Just do it by hand with the smudge tool and the eraser tool. It will take longer but look better.


Eventually, I'll remove the wall texture and use filters to create my own with the help of the tutorial, "How to Blend Textures for Use in Battlemapping with GIMP."

I like your wall texture. In any case, there is an easier and better way. Do not get hung up on textures - textures are the enemy! Seamless, repeating textures are only good when you want to produce a very large number of identical maps. Otherwise, you should not use them. Instead, use google image search to find photos of 'rock close up' .Choose an image (of high resolution) and save it as a .jpg (WARNING - if you plan on selling your map you can't use copyrighted images and should credit all open-source images so think carefully) you like and stretch/crop it on its own layer on your drawing until it covers the whole thing. Then using a layer mask, make it visible only on the walls. Then either desaturate it totally (luminosity) and add a burn layer of pale colour over it at 35% opacity, or adjust the colours, so it works on your map. Then add another layer over it with various opacities of black to make the walls much darker and varied. It's easier than it sounds.


Next, I'm going to add stalagmites everywhere. Then, I plan to blend in some dirt texture (created with filters) on the floor. Not sure exactly how I should do that, I just know one single texture for the whole floor is boring.

Good luck with stalagmites - they are really hard to do. One idea is just little circles of normal wall - I think that looks the best after much trial and error. Whatever you do DO NOT try and use the stalagmite objects other people have made and uploaded for use as .pngs, they look awful.


I'd love to add mist, but I've no idea how to even start with that or how well even an expert could pull it off.

It's easy! Make a new (transparent) layer, FILTER>RENDER>CLOUDS>FOG, change colour to something good like very pale grey, then press ok. Then use a layer mask to remove it from the walls, and change the opacity. The crucial thing with fog is that you need to light and shadow it. To do this, copy the fog layer and apply its layer mask and make this layer invisible. Then make a new 'lighting' layer and with a big fuzzy brush messily draw very pale yellow (eg) overlay highlights over some of your fog. Then add layer mask, and make that mask the copied and applied fog layer. Then do the same for some shadows. Its important to give fog depth otherwise it looks crap.


Dramatic lightning would be great as well, but again, I'm a total newbie with little experience and no talent.

But you are half-way there! Just build it up gently with layers of darkness and light. Advise! Use layers of black shadow set to 'normal' at 50% opacity, and layers of pale orange light set to 'overlay' at 80% opacity. Draw thickly with a fuzzy brush and then use your smudge tool and go crazy, then block out the walls with layer masks. Build up layers of light and darkness, every now and then go out of the room and take a break and return. It doesn't take talent - only patience.


I might break down and add furniture and stuff, but I typically use minis to represent things like that. Also, I have no resources at all, rugs, tables, urns, boxes, books, piles of coins -- none of that stuff. I'd have to spend hours searching for it all.

Overuse of these pre-made objects can lead to disaster - cluttered clashing maps with no sense of style. Avoid if possible.

RobA
03-22-2013, 12:35 PM
After removing the square grid, I sandwiched a hex grid (http://www.cartographersguild.com/automation-scripts-actions/5338-gimp-script-hex-grid.html#post60475) between the wall and floor layers (we play GURPS Fourth Edition (http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/), which uses hexes).
-RD Sharpe

Hoya!

Glad the script is useful for you!

If you use the latest version: http://www.cartographersguild.com/automation-scripts-actions/2759-subterrainian-map-prettier-script-7.html#post114446 it has an option to create square, hex, or none. To create the hex grid, you will need my hex script Hex Grid | GIMP Plugin Registry (http://registry.gimp.org/node/15852) also installed.


-Rob A>

Sharpe
03-22-2013, 03:14 PM
Thanks, both of you for your replies! Very, very appreciated.

I don't have time to reply right now (including to PM's), but real quick, I just wanted to mention that the steps aren't backwards as far as I can tell. For example, from the entrance, the three steps to the east are going up. So, they're right, correct? If you go north from the entrance, the two steps there lead downward.

Jacktannery
03-22-2013, 03:37 PM
I don't have time to reply right now (including to PM's), but real quick, I just wanted to mention that the steps aren't backwards as far as I can tell. For example, from the entrance, the three steps to the east are going up. So, they're right, correct? If you go north from the entrance, the two steps there lead downward.

Perhaps, but you have made them LOOK backwards by curving them in the opposite way that one imagines steps should curve. Of the ones you mentioned, the steps going down look great - exactly right - but the steps going up LOOK wrong. Even if they are technically correct, they look wrong, to my eyes at least.

Jaxilon
03-22-2013, 03:58 PM
Looks exciting. Makes me want to get back to my own Gurps group.

Sharpe
03-23-2013, 07:48 PM
Great start Sharpe. Your map has great personality. I like your water but agree that it is very saturated with blue. Water is very hard to do, and i'm terrible at it so can't advise, but there is nothing wrong with your water. If you are aiming for a photo-realistic water, then you will need to desaturate it heavily until only only a trace of blue remains - water in a lit cave like this is very reflective, almost glass-like. If its in the dark the water is black; this can still look good but very dark water depends on really good edges. You can see it in a map of a cave I did for a friend in the Virtual Tabletop/Battlemap Mapping forum, look for 'Heart of Shadow' cavern map.
Wow, coming from you, that really is high praise! Your maps are as good as any I've seen anywhere ever -- real professional AAA stuff!

Your words are very generous, but there's really nothing to my map. It's just balck-and-white walls with Rob's script.



Do not get hung up on textures - textures are the enemy!
I'm trying to use no textures at all. Like I say, I'm going to replace the default texture Rob's script used with filter noise.



It's easy! Make a new (transparent) layer, FILTER>RENDER>CLOUDS>FOG, change colour to something good like very pale grey, then press ok. Then use a layer mask to remove it from the walls, and change the opacity. The crucial thing with fog is that you need to light and shadow it. To do this, copy the fog layer and apply its layer mask and make this layer invisible. Then make a new 'lighting' layer and with a big fuzzy brush messily draw very pale yellow (eg) overlay highlights over some of your fog. Then add layer mask, and make that mask the copied and applied fog layer. Then do the same for some shadows. Its important to give fog depth otherwise it looks crap.
I... I have no idea where to begin with that.

Layer mask? Fuzzy brush?




But you are half-way there! Just build it up gently with layers of darkness and light. Advise! Use layers of black shadow set to 'normal' at 50% opacity, and layers of pale orange light set to 'overlay' at 80% opacity. Draw thickly with a fuzzy brush and then use your smudge tool and go crazy, then block out the walls with layer masks. Build up layers of light and darkness, every now and then go out of the room and take a break and return. It doesn't take talent - only patience.
Again, this is so far over my head it might as well be Greek. Well, other than the layer of black at 50%. I currently have that over the whole map, and what I've done before is erase it to add lightning.

What am I drawing and what am I using the smudge tool on? I've never used the smudge tool.

Sorry I'm such a newbie. This is all a little overwhelming for me. :(

Sharpe
03-23-2013, 08:00 PM
Hoya!

Glad the script is useful for you!

If you use the latest version: http://www.cartographersguild.com/automation-scripts-actions/2759-subterrainian-map-prettier-script-7.html#post114446 it has an option to create square, hex, or none. To create the hex grid, you will need my hex script Hex Grid | GIMP Plugin Registry (http://registry.gimp.org/node/15852) also installed.


-Rob A>
Thanks so much for the link! I downloaded the old version not knowing there was a new one further in the thread. This new one works great!

In answer to your question in that thread, I definitely think the most current version should be included in the original post.

Thanks again!

Jacktannery
03-23-2013, 09:33 PM
Sorry I'm such a newbie. This is all a little overwhelming for me. :(

We all started somewhere.


I... I have no idea where to begin with that.

Make a new (transparent) layer on top of all your other layers. Then from the menu at the top select: FILTER>RENDER>CLOUDS>FOG, change colour to something good like very pale grey, then press ok. Then delete the parts of the fog that you don't want, such as over the walls, so it only is present in the open areas.

mthomas768
03-23-2013, 10:33 PM
There's a fog/mist plugin for Gimp called Harry's Fog and Mist that I just installed yesterday. I haven't done anything with it yet, but it may be worth checking out (ah there it is: http://registry.gimp.org/node/19309).

I like the map quite a bit. A bit dark for my eyes, but coming along nicely!

Sharpe
03-24-2013, 03:11 PM
Using GIMP 2.8.4, the latest. My image is 3000x3000 and prints at 100 dpi.


It's easy! Make a new (transparent) layer, FILTER>RENDER>CLOUDS>FOG, change colour to something good like very pale grey, then press ok. Then use a layer mask to remove it from the walls, and change the opacity. The crucial thing with fog is that you need to light and shadow it. To do this, copy the fog layer and apply its layer mask and make this layer invisible. Then make a new 'lighting' layer and with a big fuzzy brush messily draw very pale yellow (eg) overlay highlights over some of your fog. Then add layer mask, and make that mask the copied and applied fog layer. Then do the same for some shadows. Its important to give fog depth otherwise it looks crap.

Okay. I made a fog layer and selected where I wanted the fog and clicked FILTER>RENDER>CLOUDS>FOG. It looked like the floor noise, so I removed the floor noise to avoid confusion.

Then, I duplicated that layer and made the first one invisible by removing the little eye beside it.

Then, on the duplicate, called Fog Light with a mode set to Lighten Only, I scribbled haphazardly not knowing where I should with my mouse using the Paintbrush Tool at 100 px. The color was fffdcc, a very pale yellow. It looked... Well, like I just described. A bunch of yellow lines everywhere. :(

I didn't bother to do the same with black because obviously, I'm not doing the right thing at all.

Here is the update: http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/7528/shadowyrm8.jpg

Yes, it looks ridiculous, but I wanted to illustrate how little I understand the instructions given.

Also, the default filter needs some help. The fog should be thicker in the low spots. So, I'll have to do something about that. This was just a quick test. The mist is coming from the room with the water (bottom row, very middle).

Further advice would be greatly appreciated, if anyone has the patience of Job to help such a hopeless newbie.

Jacktannery
03-24-2013, 05:49 PM
Sharpe, that was brilliant - you gave me a good chuckle with your disastrous yellow lighting on the fog (!).

On a more serious note, the fog actually looks great. It gives a strange glowy effect to the cave. I recommend extending it everywhere so lighten up the map. It doesn't look anything like fog, obviously, but we can't win everything.

Why don't you work through this tutorial Sharpe http://www.cartographersguild.com/tutorials-how/3143-%5Baward-winner%5D-explanation-layer-masks-gimp-ps.html.

Sharpe
03-24-2013, 09:51 PM
Apparently, mist is beyond my level of talent and probably will remain so for the foreseeable future. Not everyone can make awesome battle maps!

I took the layer of 50% black off: http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/7528/shadowyrm8.jpg

EDIT: Also, I'm working through that tutorial right now.

EDIT x2: Okay! I worked through the tutorial! Now, I'm going to work through the one I put in my first post. Hopfully after that, I'll be able to manage to actually do something with the knowledge!

Sharpe
03-24-2013, 10:42 PM
Look out, Cartographer's Guild! Sharpe is now a MASTER of layer masks. Basically, that means I'm on the road to becoming the very best fantasy cartographer ever.

http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/5701/layermasks.jpg

^Gaze upon that image and weep tears of awe as you bask in the luminescence of its transcendent beauty!

Yeah, give me a month and all the so-called greats on here will be all like, "Oh, Sharpe, your maps are so totally radical and ours aren't worthy." And, they will be correct!


EDIT: Back to reality, I started playing around with where the stalagmites will go and added some dirt to the entrance and main cavern using a layer mask: hhttp://img854.imageshack.us/img854/7528/shadowyrm8.jpg

I tried the water again, but it was still a no-go. Since there's no real moving air, it should be both flat and clear as glass, and since there's no real light, no real reflection. The mist, though, should be something that would reflect...

Jacktannery
03-25-2013, 03:37 AM
Well done for working through the tutorial. Wish I could see you magnificent map (which by the way you could just attach normally using the 'attach file' option, rather than through image-shack) but I can't.

Jacktannery
03-28-2013, 05:21 AM
Reposting this again - examples of what Neyjour & I meant for your yellow dirt, and an example of some decent simple water using a blue-grey colour.

53076

Sharpe
03-28-2013, 08:12 PM
Oh, hey thanks! I didn't see that before the crash. I really appreciate the help a lot!

I know there were posts, but I only glanced at them and don't recall what was said.

I do know of the different layer settings such as overlay. To me, the overlay-style layer settings look like different-colored rock floor rather than dirt. I actually wanted a different "texture" -- texture as in the visual and tactile quality of a surface, not as in the graphics sense.

Do you guys not like the dirt texture?

How did you make the water? I hope I can mange to do the same; I really like it!

Thanks again! :)

Jacktannery
03-29-2013, 06:10 AM
Do you guys not like the dirt texture?

I don't dislike it. However I think you and I use the term 'dirt texture' differently. To me, your yellow flooring looks much cleaner and smoother and more brightly-lit than the grey stone flooring. I am not getting the sense that the addition of the yellow makes the floor look dirtier or more textures. However you shouldn't worry too much about what I think - in any case it has a lovely glowing quality and I like it.


How did you make the water? I hope I can mange to do the same; I really like it!

Very very easy. I just painted a dark-greyish-blue colour on top then lowered the opacity until I could see your grid pop through. Then after that it is all shadowing. Compare your water in post 1 with mine above: they are pretty similar except the colour. The other, more subtle difference, is that I actually have two shadow layers on top of the water: a big heavy one coming out from the cavern walls, and a much lighter smaller one from the bridge. This is important because there are three elevations in this room (wall; bridge; water) and you need to show that with the shading.

EDIT: the other difference is that my shadows are drawn by hand and they are not very regular. I did them really quick with the smudge tool and the uneven effect looks natural. Your very even shadow is not as realistic, and also your shadow causes a bit of a 'step' just inside the water.

Sharpe
03-31-2013, 06:07 PM
I am not getting the sense that the addition of the yellow makes the floor look dirtier or more textures.
Well, I'm not trying to make the stone dirtier. I'm trying to add a layer of silt/dirt/mud atop it, totally making it a different floor material. The rough stone is beneath the dirt, completely covered.

It doesn't seem very popular, though! XD


I just painted a dark-greyish-blue colour on top then lowered the opacity until I could see your grid pop through. Then after that it is all shadowing. Compare your water in post 1 with mine above: they are pretty similar except the colour. The other, more subtle difference, is that I actually have two shadow layers on top of the water: a big heavy one coming out from the cavern walls, and a much lighter smaller one from the bridge. This is important because there are three elevations in this room (wall; bridge; water) and you need to show that with the shading.

EDIT: the other difference is that my shadows are drawn by hand and they are not very regular. I did them really quick with the smudge tool and the uneven effect looks natural. Your very even shadow is not as realistic, and also your shadow causes a bit of a 'step' just inside the water.
Okay, I'm attacking it again.

First, I drew the wall side of the pools' shadows in a thick-ish (size 20) black brush not worrying too much about any sort of consistency. Then, I took the smudge tool and rapidly clicked maybe a hundred times haphazardly around the black's edges, pulling slightly from both the water and the shadow side, but mostly from the shadow's side. After that, I used a gaussian blur at 15. Last, I reduced the layer's opacity to 25%. Then, I repeated the process for the bridge and step in the northern pool, making the black skinnier.

EDIT: Went back and added an overlay layer of turbulent solid noise at 50% opacity.

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/7528/shadowyrm8.jpg

It still doesn't look as good as yours, but there's my latest attempt.

Sharpe
03-31-2013, 06:08 PM
Looking at them side-by-side, I'd say maybe you got more rowdy with the smudge and made your black thicker...

Jacktannery
03-31-2013, 06:26 PM
Well I think yours looks better than mine! (I never use gaussian blur because the results are too homogenous, I just blur everything manually, so that's the main difference between your and mine). Your shadows are perfect now.

To get the water to look more like mine (if that's what you wanted) just add some pale blueish spots and mix them in with the rest. Definitely better than post 1 at least.

Sharpe
03-31-2013, 06:31 PM
You're much, much too kind! Thanks so much for all your help!

I've updated it very slightly since your last post. It looks almost identical to yours now. I'm going to take a brake on the water for a bit.

Maybe stalagmites next.

Anyone have any suggestions for natural-type "stuff?"

Neyjour
04-01-2013, 04:29 AM
For your dirt, you could try these: Sandy Soil (http://neyjour.deviantart.com/art/RPG-Map-Elements-61-361769854)

I had posted that just before everything went *poof*. :P

Or, you could go to CGTextures and look for a nice dirt/soil texture to make your own overlays. It works best (IMO) if you make the selections with an inside and outside feathering. :)

Sharpe
04-02-2013, 03:15 PM
Hey, thanks! I saw those on DA!

In GIMP, what does outside and inside feathering mean? How is that accomplished?

Neyjour
04-02-2013, 06:41 PM
You're welcome! :)

I’m sorry, I don’t know how to accomplish it in GIMP. My PSP8 is very old and not 100% compatible with my OS. Every time I try to use the crop tool, the program crashes, so I use GIMP just for cropping and I haven’t really explored it beyond that.

I use overlay pieces (and feathering in general) for my ground textures all the time now, because they allow you to avoid repeating patterns (with seamless textures) and give you a nice, natural looking transition between different textures.

Here’s a quick tutorial to show you how I do it in PSP8. It might help you with translating the steps yourself in GIMP, or hopefully someone who has a better knowledge of the program can tell you how to do it.

--------------------

1) Open a ground texture (I got this one from CGTextures) and select the Freehand Selection tool.

2) Draw an irregular shape. (You’re going to be using a large feathering, so make sure you don’t draw too close to the edges of the image. And keep in mind that the feathering is going to be inside as well as out, so if your selection is too small, you won’t have a solid texture in the center.)

3) Go to Selections > Modify > Inside/Outside Feather

4) Select Both, set your Feather amount, and click OK when you’re done. (I usually set the amount to 60 or 80, or occasionally I might go a bit higher. It just depends on what you like, the textures you’re using, and how defined (or not) you want your transitions to be.)

5) Go to Edit > Copy to copy your new selection.

6) Go to Edit > Paste > Paste As New Image

7) You’ve now got a new overlay piece on a transparent background. Save it in PNG format to preserve the transparency, and then repeat all the previous steps to create several more pieces, each one a different size and shape.

8 ) I made four different pieces and copy/pasted them (each as a new, separate layer) onto some floor tiles. As you can see, they blend together really well and you can’t differentiate between the individual pieces. You can also use each piece multiple times, and flip/mirror/rotate them before pasting them onto your map.

9) For the final step, make any colour, curves, or brightness/contrast, etc., adjustments needed. Here, I’ve changed the colour and adjusted the Curves to better compliment the colour of the floor tiles. (I constantly make adjustments like these to all my textures as my map progresses)

10) This is an example (from a maze map I’m working on right now) of how feathering gives nice, natural looking transitions between textures. And I made various adjustments to colour, brightness/contrast, and curves to each one, so they look good and blend well together. :)

Sharpe
07-12-2013, 12:57 PM
Wow. Almost four months since I took a "break" from this project.

I remember thanking Neyjour for her assistance in the post directly above, but there was a server crash or something and we lost a couple days of posts.

Anyway, I've started again, but I have to re-learn some of my weak GIMP skills.

One difference: I've given up my resistance to using textures. Instead of trying to do everything with filters, I'm going to do like almost everyone else and use textures found on the Net.


Eventually, I'll remove the wall texture and use filters to create my own with the help of the tutorial, "How to Blend Textures for Use in Battlemapping with GIMP. (http://www.cartographersguild.com/tutorials-how/12066-my-battlemap-tutorials.html)"

Well, I accomplished the tutorial before, but I had been playing with GIMP for a while. This time, I got stuck on the part that says, "Apply a linear blend along the edges of the road to achieve the following or something similar."

I couldn't figure out how to use the blend tool to create the effect.

However, I used the Gaussian Blur filter to produce the same result, it seems to me.

Anyway, no update because I'm still working on it. Just thought I would post and prepare the world for my return to battlemapping! ;-)


UPDATE: Just playing with textures. I still didn't figure out how I used the blend tool...

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/8955/3v3z.jpg

Neyjour
07-12-2013, 05:40 PM
I remember thanking Neyjour for her assistance in the post directly above, but there was a server crash or something and we lost a couple days of posts.

I remember that. I had just posted a BIG update on my freebies thread (with lots of links), and about 5-10 mins later everything crashed, they did a rollback, and my post was gone. *cries* I never did work up the energy to re-post it. Heh. :P

It's really great to see my Sandy Soil textures in use! You're the first one I've seen to use them. :) And I love the two mucky/swampy pools. That texture looks really great. :)

Sharpe
07-12-2013, 07:29 PM
You know, I went on a horse ride between now and when I made that post, and I got to thinking, "I never did mention that I took Neyjour's advice and used her dirt textures."

Thanks for making them! I'm very surprised to learn that I'm the first you've seen use them.

The water did turn out okay so far. All of the shadows on the whole map need re-done, though. I just doubled them so they could be seen with these new textures.

It's still far from finished.

Jacktannery
07-13-2013, 03:17 AM
Big improvements Sharpe. Neyjour's textures look great here. I agree that the shadow contrast could be toned down a little in the finished version along the cavern walls everywhere EXCEPT for the water and bridge where they are probably fine (this area needs to be a bit darker than elsewhere anyway).

Sharpe
07-13-2013, 07:26 AM
Thanks! :)

I found a texture I really (http://www.123rf.com/photo_8220071_anthracite-seamless-texture.html) like for the walls, but minimum purchase is $20! Gah! I'd pay the dollar for it, but $20?!

Here it is with the watermarked preview: http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/830/a6qv.jpg


EDIT: Ooo... I found the exact same one (http://www.shutterstock.com/pic-64853740/stock-photo-anthracite-seamless-texture.html) on Shutterstock, and I've wanted an account there for a long time! I might get one!

EDIT x2: Oh my god! Shutterstock charges $199 a month! Forget that!

Edit x2: No, I misread. It's $199/month for a year, but $249/month by the month! Holy cow! If I were a business that used that sort of thing, sure, I can see paying it. But that's big money!

Sharpe
07-15-2013, 02:59 AM
I got to thinking as I started to add bioluminescent mushrooms and lichen to the area with the mossy floor... Wouldn't it be hard for photosynthetic plants to grow absent sunlight?

Neyjour
07-15-2013, 04:14 AM
You're very welcome, Sharpe. Glad you found them useful. :)

As for the fungi...as I understand it, bioluminescence is a chemical reaction, so no sunlight required. It's flourescence and phosphorescence where light is absorbed and then re-emitted.

But in a fantasy world, I really don't think it matters that much. The "rules" can be whatever you want them to be. :)

Sharpe
07-15-2013, 08:37 PM
No, I mean plant life of any kind, which requires sunlight to grow (photosynthesis).

Regardless, I remembered that this is a map of a cavern with crack and holes in the ceiling, so sunlight shines down anyway. XD

Neyjour
07-16-2013, 01:59 AM
Yeah, if you're going for realism and your caves/tunnels don't have any sources of sunlight, the flora will be limited to fungi and tree roots: Cave Flora (http://www.cavesofmalaysia.com/photopage2.htm) :)