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View Full Version : {WIP} Nova Carta Ardenis - New Version of the Arden Map



Schwarzkreuz
04-30-2013, 04:48 AM
Lately I have been revisiting my stuff where I left of. So was the Idea to create a new Version of the Maps for Arden which stopped with my last absense. Well I am back and will try a new way for it.
Inspired massively by Vorropohaiah's Stereographic Map of his World (http://www.cartographersguild.com/regional-world-mapping/22315-wip-stereographic-world-map.html), I decided to also a Worldmap in 17. Century Mapstyle, incorporating sources from the Rumsay collection and a lot of inspiration from the maps of Diamond, -Max- and Vorro.

Also I intend to create a "Real" Atlas which share a common Design/Feel, so I can go getting the Bookbinders some Headache and Coins. Lets starts with the Basics. The original Arden map had an inside Maesurement of 9 Maps of 30 x 40 cm making it 90 x 120 cm, so I would like to repead that in a smaler scale of 1/4 of that original size making it 45 x 60 cm + 1 cm Free space at each side. Main font for Towns remains Roman Antiqua italic, fontsize 8. Main Fonts are from the IM Fell family.

Here are some Projectiontests, created with the great help of Vorro.
Added also a Version with the Earth projected on it for comparing.

@ Eilathen: This is the definite Version of my Arden map in Making so you cant complain anymore that I show you to less :P

Schwarzkreuz
04-30-2013, 06:15 AM
Here are in Order:

Rectangle Projection (Normal one), Mollweide, Ortelius and Wagner IV.
I would love some comments on what you guys like most. I am still unsure.

vorropohaiah
04-30-2013, 06:39 AM
ah this will be lovely :) nice to see the projections with your landmass.

i think the projections might look a bit better if you shift the landmass some degress to the left, bringing the large mass of islands on the right a bit more to the left, which will lessen the distortion on them as well as bringing them closer to the middle and decreasing the large 'empty' part in the left of the map. id post an example but don't have access to g projector at the moment.

a vertical perspective of the poles would be welcome too, to see what the undistorted pole really would look like. though from these, i think the ortelius is nicest from a purely aesthetical nature

EDIT, also, if you havent done so already i suggest exporting the map from g projector twice - once without graticules and once as a blank (white map) with graticules) that will save you a lot of swearing later on. due to the limited resolution of the g projector-generated map, youll probably have to redo the graticules using the pen tool (or with illustrator or something similar, though i have no idea how to use those)

Schwarzkreuz
04-30-2013, 06:40 AM
And the Mollwide Hemissphere concentrating on Land and Ocean. Also I have shrunken the Desrupted Rift (strange structure far right) it was somehow looking too weird and distracting.

Added also a Gott-Mugnolo-Azimuthal North/Southpole projection

- Max -
04-30-2013, 06:43 AM
Looks like you're off to a good start!

Eilathen
04-30-2013, 06:44 AM
@ Eilathen: This is the definite Version of my Arden map in Making so you cant complain anymore that I show you to less :P

You're welcome, SK :P ;)

On a more serious note: Very much looking forward to the endresult.

Schwarzkreuz
04-30-2013, 08:00 AM
Next set of alterations. Added the main rivers

vorropohaiah
04-30-2013, 08:39 AM
ok, are the rivers painted onto the equirectangular map or the individuial projections? if its the latter,that might be a problem later on if youre going to base other maps off of the projections. i think its better having them on the base map (even though theyll get distorted once theyre projected) at least you have a guideline onto which to pain the 'proper' river on a nother layer.

than again it depends on mow many maps you intend to create in this world - if its just the big world map, you might not need to

oh, and IM fell FTW. i love that font. the encyclopaedia im doing is based on that font familty and the 'old style hplhs', which is my fave at the moment

Chashio
04-30-2013, 11:27 AM
This looks like a cool project! Interesting to see all of the different projections.

Diamond
04-30-2013, 03:53 PM
Don't have too much to say at this point, except... AWESOME! Looking forward to seeing what you'll do with a complete world map.

Schwarzkreuz
05-01-2013, 07:06 PM
I am thinking about how to progress from here on. I liked Vorro's Stereografic Map WIP, and would love to do such a Map for Arden combining several of the rendered Globes on such a map.

Also I like this kind of images, this one is from the Rumsey collection.

Schwarzkreuz
05-01-2013, 09:18 PM
Here are my Coastbrushes, I did a new complete set and its completely free to use. I mentioned them earlier in another Thread, that they make my life a lot easier to creat natural Coasts. Just use them to paint on a white layer and than pitch up the contrast (ctrl+L) so that there is only solid black in teh image. Than select the black solid objects, with the magic wand tool and fill a new layer with white and use layer effect stroke. Finished.

Also added all my drawing tools for realistic 'old printed Linework' which I use for nearly everything.

54147

vorropohaiah
05-02-2013, 01:12 AM
thats a pretty small map. i also used one from the rumsey collection for mine, though its ending up more different

Schwarzkreuz
05-02-2013, 05:24 PM
Which one did you liked? I am taking Inspiration from an Big Joan Blaeu map

vorropohaiah
05-03-2013, 02:06 AM
showing you this link probably proves how unoriginal i am as its almost exactly the same - (Composite of) A general map of the World or terraqueous globe with all the new discoveries and marginal delineations, containing the most interesting particulars of the solar, starry and mundane system, by Saml. Dunn, mathematician. London, Publishe (http://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/servlet/detail/RUMSEY~8~1~31510~1151092:-Composite-of--A-general-map-of-the?sort=Pub_List_No_InitialSort&qvq=w4s:/where/World/when/1804/;sort:Pub_List_No_InitialSort;lc:RUMSEY~8~1&mi=6&trs=26)

Author:
Anville, Jean Baptiste Bourguignon d, 1697-1782; Dunn, Samuel; Riccioli, Giovanni Battista; Robert Laurie & James Whittle

Schwarzkreuz
05-03-2013, 05:24 AM
Ohhhh yes, its very nice. But comeon there is Not sooo much posdibilities of Variation for stereografical Maps to design, the details determine the uniqueness of the Map.

vorropohaiah
05-03-2013, 05:32 AM
true about the stereographic, though the map in the link has a lot of real word information like terminology and geography and astronomy definitions, which i decided not to include in my map, though there will be some text information, though for stuff more pertinent and specific to the world

Chashio
05-03-2013, 08:56 AM
That's one of my favorite old maps, vorro. Attention to detail, succinctly laid out, and more importantly it's in English. ;)
I can see in what way you're following the layout, but that really won't make yours any less interesting you know.

Schwarzkreuz
05-03-2013, 09:07 AM
I can only agree to what she said, your style is verydetailed and skillfully executed, lots of classic old mappers a lot floppy. Like people who do sausage string borders ,,,,

vorropohaiah
05-03-2013, 09:25 AM
damn sausage string borders...

Chashio
05-03-2013, 09:27 AM
Hey! I repped you for the rest of it. ;P

Schwarzkreuz
05-03-2013, 11:17 AM
I think I may be able to do some Designs today, so Let's see where this leads.

Schwarzkreuz
05-03-2013, 03:01 PM
I succeeded after a little experimenting to create a inked Grid for Neatlines

The trick is: you take the bad quality render from G.Projection, and make it as large you need, than make a selelction of the Neatlines, now carefully reduce the selected area by 1 pixel, again and again, till you reach the last position where all lines are still intact, than create a path, fill path with black, and stroke it with a grundgy 4 pix brush

- Max -
05-03-2013, 03:57 PM
Indeed, nice job!

vorropohaiah
05-04-2013, 02:14 AM
think you mean graticules ;) i had tried this myself though the intersection between graticules was too 'fat' for my liking. shame i couldnt get rid of that as its a nice quick way of getting them done.

Schwarzkreuz
05-04-2013, 03:15 AM
Hmmmm true, it looks inked and Not printed

Chashio
05-04-2013, 08:45 AM
Is there a way to get G-Projector to display just the longitude or latitude lines instead of both? If so, you could use your technique on two separate images and merge them. No more fat intersections. Probably not possible though. :\

vorropohaiah
05-04-2013, 09:02 AM
unfortunately not, that would be great though...

Schwarzkreuz
05-06-2013, 02:44 PM
The new map is about 120cm x 160 cm 300dpi in size. It will be a huge map for sure

Schwarzkreuz
05-06-2013, 07:04 PM
Here is another Version with the Colorsheme established.

The Lines are colored like a dark Ink with golden color particles. The True Seas and the Ocean of Sand are colored with a slight wash of Blue and Yellow. Also did I decided the Designelements on this map. The top will be a big Field with the name of the Map, Mapper and some small texts. The Corners of the rounded Map will get some inked decorations, with Cartuches left and right bottom. The most south Area will holds different text elements about the Imperium of Icath and its Borders, also Information about the Aliance of the Northern Freestates, and the other continents.

vorropohaiah
05-07-2013, 12:14 AM
Looking cool. Very Athas in feel with the sea of sand.

Schwarzkreuz
05-13-2013, 07:57 PM
It was more inspired by Mad Max, I started inventing this world in mid '90.

Here is an Upgrade on my new Mountains. Somehow an old Style, but not just copies of Allstar Joan Blaeu, but my own recreation of the Copperplate mountains.
Still lots to render....
Critical comments on my new 'Fantasia' set of Forests, motivated me to show that I still have the skills to do proper copperplate style mountains with the hightes details....


I think this will be my finest mountenset so far.

- Max -
05-13-2013, 08:12 PM
I think this will be my finest mountenset so far.

I totally agree with this. They looks great and very fine drawn!


It was more inspired by Mad Max
And I'm not mad :P

Schwarzkreuz
05-13-2013, 08:17 PM
And I'm not mad :P

LOL, I didnt thought about that.

Carbus
05-13-2013, 08:21 PM
Wow....just wow o.o
They look perfect.

vorropohaiah
05-14-2013, 01:02 AM
Crap, very similar to the mountain set im working on at the moment

Schwarzkreuz
05-14-2013, 02:11 AM
Can you show something?

vorropohaiah
05-14-2013, 02:21 AM
when i have a map to use them on - at the moment the only personal map im working on is the stereographic one which doesnt use mountains. Id' like to wait until that one's done first, then once i start on something else ill put the new mountains to use.

dont worry though, yours are better :)

Schwarzkreuz
05-14-2013, 02:28 AM
I am sure its worth waiting. I think i resume my worldmap soon too

vorropohaiah
05-14-2013, 03:16 AM
looking forward to seeing more :)

actually are those mountains hand-drawn or done on computer? the lines look mighty thin to me. if theyre by hand are they what, a 0.10mm line?

Schwarzkreuz
05-14-2013, 06:44 AM
I use a 0,2 for outlines, a 0,15 for Smaller outlines or structures or a 0,12 Nanotechnology Liquid Ink Precission Pen. Where for Heavens sake can you buy a 0.10? And is it Inkbase? The Sciense Department of Pilot-G advertise the 0,12 Nano as one of the smallest Inkbase Pens worldwide.... If you know a good 0,10 please let me know.

But the new mountains are digital painted in 1200 DPI to simulate the finest line of a 9 Ám Micrometer pen

vorropohaiah
05-14-2013, 06:54 AM
i had a feeling they were digitally painted :) the lines had that feel to them (not in a bad way at all, and very much looking like theyre hand-drawn)

i wasnt under the impression 0.1mm pens were that difficult to get ahold of. a google search should give you quite a few results

- Max -
05-14-2013, 07:14 AM
I use 0,1 and 0,05 uni pin from Mitsubishi. Works fine for me.

Schwarzkreuz
05-14-2013, 07:24 AM
I use 0,1 and 0,05 uni pin from Mitsubishi. Works fine for me.

I will try those. But non of the stuff you find are metal ball tip pens, with inklow regulations. The Mitsubishi sounds interesting but they have the wrong tip, maybe testing them soon.



EDIT: I am a bit stressed lately, so I am sorry if I seemed a bit aggressive in my posts lately.

- Max -
05-14-2013, 09:07 AM
No worry my friend, seems that no pets and no Max were harmed here lately ;)

Schwarzkreuz
05-14-2013, 10:44 AM
i had a feeling they were digitally painted :) the lines had that feel to them (not in a bad way at all, and very much looking like theyre hand-drawn)

Its always a pleasure of mine to try different things, over and over again till I canassimilate them. Its the same with my drawing technic, I dont think I will ever stop pushing Brush sets, but actually I like to work with sets rather than draw all by hand from scratch again. Some Guildmembers do wonderfull maps without any repeating forms, but for me, I have decided brushsets works best.

Chashio
05-14-2013, 11:09 AM
You might look into Copic for a smaller pen. I've heard they're nice. Pigment based inks. They have .1 ... I can't get them around where I am and haven't gotten around to ordering online yet, but there are one or two other mappers on the guild who use them to wonderful effect.

The mountains are beautiful. Your forests are nice too... they just triggered a hilarious day from my past. I didn't mean to be critical. My sense of humor is deplorable and awkward and I usually regret voicing it... sometimes it's half-voiced and that's immeasurably worse. :( I'm going to be my non-digital self now and keep my mouth shut.

vorropohaiah
05-14-2013, 11:09 AM
also, since you (and I) tend to work on very large maps its more sensible to use brush-sets. I might try a new map just to show off the new brushes as a break orm the large map and commissions... seems as though you've got me inspired again :)

Schwarzkreuz
05-14-2013, 11:42 AM
@ Chashio: Dont worry, no offences here, I am just a bit moody at the moment, feeling so much stress, like sitting on a bomb. Most people, who met me in person, think I am a calm person but in truth I am a choleric, who just represses his natur all time :D

@ Vorro: Cant count the moments, when I was amazed by your works and keep doing. In the way how you devellop your maps and the level of care and historical awareness you consider in your form and material, I am always reminded of the great fascination that made me a cartographer in the first Place. I think i will do a sample map with the new set too. To get it out and see how its working on an real use.

I appreciate booth your opinions, dont restain. This year wasnt the nicest one to be remembered for me in the future. And I still hope the tides will turn to my Luck, but well, we have to see.

Schwarzkreuz
05-14-2013, 12:36 PM
Ok here is another real Update on the Set

vorropohaiah
05-14-2013, 12:54 PM
Looking nice. And thanks :) seems we have the same effect on each other.

Chashio
05-14-2013, 01:18 PM
Believe me, I understand. My great aunt went 23 years thinking I had no sense of humor because I almost never smile or talk in public, and yet I'm constantly singing and laughing at home.

I envy you both your brushes. SK, you converted me to love drawing endless sets of mountains and trees in various styles but I can't seem to get the hang of using them on maps to my satisfaction so they stay in my sketchbooks and files doing nothing productive. Still, it's a relaxing pastime I suppose.

Battlecat
05-14-2013, 01:23 PM
Those mountains look stunning. I'm looking forward to seeing those in action when they're done.

Diamond
05-14-2013, 01:36 PM
I really think sometimes that SK might be the second coming of J. Blaue - just the sheer coolness of your designs, the way all icons work together, it just makes me envious. :D

Schwarzkreuz
05-17-2013, 06:55 AM
Next lines of Mountains finished (50% Size)

Schwarzkreuz
05-17-2013, 07:49 AM
After talking to -Max- I decided to create several flat big mountains to have additional options in building up ranges, adn skip the other peaky long mountains

vorropohaiah
05-17-2013, 07:57 AM
you mean like lego? having a mesa/plateau and just putting a mountain on top of it make it taller?

Eilathen
05-17-2013, 12:31 PM
Aww man, stop torturing us. Use those damn mountains in a map....right NOW!!! :D

Awesome work, SK. I'll rep you if i can.

Schwarzkreuz
05-17-2013, 01:12 PM
Not like Lego :D but close enough

@Eilathen: drawing Mountains is As much Fun As mapping for me, so it still might take weeks before i use them.

Carbus
05-23-2013, 09:10 PM
Stealing your coast brushes :P

Schwarzkreuz
05-29-2013, 08:57 AM
I found my old savefile and could resque most of my Borders, lost in a recent crash. I will aply them to this map.

vorropohaiah
05-29-2013, 08:59 AM
very nice borders. need to start experimenting with some more 'pictoral' borders

- Max -
05-29-2013, 09:24 AM
Already seen then so not a surprise but they are great! :)

Schwarzkreuz
05-29-2013, 01:33 PM
very nice borders. need to start experimenting with some more 'pictoral' borders

Sorry, what kind of Border do you mean? The ones with Flowers and other decor, or realy some with figures und landscapes in them?

vorropohaiah
05-29-2013, 02:06 PM
well im not sure what theyre called but by pictoral i meant the type of borders you posted above, rather than the 'boring' simple lines and neatlines that i tend to use

Schwarzkreuz
05-29-2013, 08:40 PM
Ok, I created a more 'pictoral' Border for the Arden Map.

Schwarzkreuz
05-29-2013, 10:09 PM
Here is another bigger update.

The 18 shields will show the Heraldry of the 18 Provinces/Terretories of the Icatian Imperium. The 2 bigger Shields will show the Heraldry of Icath Prime and Vantikas, the tow main Provinces.

vorropohaiah
05-30-2013, 12:51 AM
very sexy. the border fits in with the style of map and i like the big block of text in the bottom which saves me having to make a mock up for my one - i can go right in and add some text... once i write something fitting for the map :)

is that a linear/colour burn you used to get that brownish tint to the border?

Schwarzkreuz
05-30-2013, 06:00 AM
Yes, its a Linear Burn on 85%. And the Globes are on 95%. You have to have an Black linework embedded in White for this effect. Black alone wouldnt show the nice Brown tint, its basicly the pixelbleed from Black to the white area thats forming the tint.

- Max -
05-30-2013, 08:06 AM
Nice, but too small :p I want more details :D

vorropohaiah
05-30-2013, 08:11 AM
well if its anything like mine, its a huge map and hell have to upload it in pieces...

upload it in pieces!

thamupp
05-30-2013, 12:25 PM
Yes, split it up a bit so we can take a closer look at it! Looks amazing from what I can see though!

Lezales
06-15-2013, 01:30 AM
Any progress on those unbelievable mountains and that map ? ;)

Adolon
06-15-2013, 01:11 PM
I succeeded after a little experimenting to create a inked Grid for Neatlines

The trick is: you take the bad quality render from G.Projection, and make it as large you need, than make a selelction of the Neatlines, now carefully reduce the selected area by 1 pixel, again and again, till you reach the last position where all lines are still intact, than create a path, fill path with black, and stroke it with a grundgy 4 pix brush

Schwarzkreuz, would it be possible for you to upload a file with the Gott-Mugnolo Azimuthal path? I'm having a hard time making a neat path from a blank G.Projector render. It looks very ugly no matter what I do. Offset by 5 degrees if you would be so kind.

Schwarzkreuz
06-20-2013, 01:48 PM
Well, try to render the paath with a projecten enl÷arged to 30.000 Px, than it works fine.