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ravells
06-06-2008, 11:32 AM
Just a placeholder for my choice of place to map. Torq, is there anything I need to know about this place that's not in the Wiki?

::Edit:: Changed from Arkender which is on Lake Festus which (I am pleased to report) is already being mapped extensively!

ravells
06-06-2008, 04:25 PM
I love the name 'Stormlit Cloister' - it brings to my mind images of an isolated, spired monastery city perched on top of a bleak and desolate range, where the faithful, during their meditations, watch dark thunderheads roll across the flanks of the mountainside far below their eirie peak.

Here the monks have retreated to find a cure to the plague. Consequently, they have sent out a call for all skilled in the arcane arts to join their college and many have answered. Some wizards prefer to work alone, and for them special quarters are built resulting in a gradual and extensive expansion of the original complex.

To reach the Cloister, travellers must ascend the 'ten thousand steps', a steep and perilous stair carved into the mountain. There are simple rest-houses upon the way, for the journey takes four days.

The denizens of the Stormlit Cloister lead a simple ascetic life. In upland pastures acolytes tend a breed of hardy goat which provide milk, meat and fur. Vegetables are grown in small gardens under the eye of Father Meehan - the head of the order.

Torq
06-07-2008, 06:02 AM
Run with it man, run with it! I love the idea. I'm very happy that Stormlit Cloister is in good hands. Go Groam!

Torq

NeonKnight
06-07-2008, 06:33 AM
Haha!

You're doing Stormlit Cloister, and I am doing Small Coping ;)

ravells
06-07-2008, 02:49 PM
Neon! We must see if we can link up thoughts .... supplies from Small Coping to Stormlit Cloister perhaps? Here's my first WIP (trying out yet another style).


### WIP ###

Sigurd
06-07-2008, 03:23 PM
Very Pretty

Torq
06-07-2008, 05:17 PM
Very cool Ravs. I love the "clean marine" style.

Torq

Redrobes
06-07-2008, 06:53 PM
Nice :o - you don't hang about do you ! I haven't even picked a place yet.

ravells
06-07-2008, 08:11 PM
I have no idea where I'm going with this. There's the grand hall, to the north of that the communal area with the guest wing and to the east of that the kitchens and storage to the north with the herb garden outside.

The Angular building is the Dojo for the fighting monks (in honour of Torq).

Can you guys think of any other types of buildings that would go in the complex?

ps thanks for the compliments but it's very simple...no special effects in this one.

ravells
06-08-2008, 02:43 PM
Next WIP - just following my nose with no real plan in mind. I think I know the functions of the various buildings, but it would be nice to somehow find a way to emphasise verticals without interfering with the simplicity. The one on the right has a drop shadow...which do you think looks better?

### Latest WIP ###

Gamerprinter
06-08-2008, 02:58 PM
The one on the right with the drop shadow is better than the one without. Perhaps the shadow needs to lengthen a bit, but it does help define the walls and the verticle feel you are looking for. 8)

GP

Sigurd
06-08-2008, 03:24 PM
I definitely like the drop shadow but it depends on how "architecty" you want it to be. I'd say if you go with the drop shadow you have to add some grunge as well to give it a lived in look. If you have a pure conception and planning sort of map (also a valid style) I'd avoid the shadow.


Sigurd.

It looks really nice.

ravells
06-08-2008, 04:38 PM
Thanks Guys. I always get tempted into using effects and for this challenge I thought I would try to avoid them and make this an archtecty style....but the pull is strong! I kinda like the drop shadow...maybe I'll make an exception and allow myself just one effect....

Torq
06-08-2008, 05:45 PM
I think the shadow works very well. It adds a huge amount of definition but its very subtle and seems to be omni-directional. I dont think it strays very far towards photo realism and therefore doesn't break the style you are going for.

Torq

Midgardsormr
06-08-2008, 06:08 PM
Can you guys think of any other types of buildings that would go in the complex?

Chapel, library, and infirmary. Possibly a carillon, though that would probably be part of the chapel.

A cloister might also keep some small quantity of livestock--chickens or hogs come to mind.

NeonKnight
06-09-2008, 01:48 PM
When I was making the Temple for the past Monastery challenge, I did some research into real Monasteries.

You will need:

Grain & Food Storage
Arch Cleric's House (the lived separate)
An Alms House or other place for the handing out of material for the poor (may not need, based on remote location)
Privy, which was usually built at the back, overhanging a stream or river to easily dispose the waste.

Some good details on Catherdral Building here: http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gothic_architecture

I did a lot of research at the time of that challenge and I found LOTS of good resources at the time.

My Entry for the Monastery Challenge can be found here: http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?t=947

and of particular interest of what exactly is found at a Monastery can be found here:
Medieval Church Architecture (http://www.britainexpress.com/History/medieval/church-glossary.htm)

ravells
06-09-2008, 02:47 PM
Excellent, thanks guys, this is really helpful. I'll make a start on the library next.

ravells
06-09-2008, 05:16 PM
Here's the next WIP with a library and a hall for the junior acolytes...infirmary next

### Latest WIP ###

NeonKnight
06-09-2008, 05:20 PM
Any chance of labeling?

ravells
06-09-2008, 05:21 PM
I thought I'd leave that until the end!

ravells
06-10-2008, 08:12 PM
Just one more building today..I'm hoping at least one-a-day might yield a result worthy of Torq's lands. Anyway, if I don't finish it for the comp, I'll make sure it's complete for the world.

::: Edit ::: oh wow, I like the new thumbnail program! It supports transparency on the thumbnail!

Sigurd
06-12-2008, 02:53 PM
On the topic of Labeling....

I thought I'd leave that until the end!

Its gorgeous, I love your colour choice and shape of the buildings. What are you building it in? Illustrator?



Please give us labeled and unlabeled versions if you're not sharing the work files :).


Please, Please, :)

Sigurd
06-12-2008, 03:57 PM
I pulled this from the web once because it seemed a really authentic point of view. It might be useful...? I did not write it.


Real Life Monasteries

I was educated at a Catholic HS run by Cistercian monks, and even stayed in one of their monasteries in Rome while on vacation.

Things to consider, in no particular order:

1) The food was simple, but fresh and plentiful. Most was either straight from the surrounding farms that morning or raised/farmed/made by the monks themselves. Agriculturally, the Cistercians in particular are reknown for beers, wines, liquors, and cheeses. A jolly, rosy-cheeked brewmeister would not be out of place.

2) Some monasteries have servants, but in others, the monks and brothers do all or most of the work themselves. Unlike Eastern monestaries, the physical exercise in a Western monestary is almost exclusively menial labor- farming, cleaning, sweeping, etc. A PC with in-depth knowledge of herbalism and animal husbandry would be appropriate.

3) Priestly duties rule the day. They have a rigid schedule for prayers and for performing ceremonies for the surrounding community. Everything else in their day revolves around their prayer schedule.

4) Many monasteries had incredible libraries, and scrivening was a major way for the monasteries to make money. The labor involved in duplicating an illuminated text was NOT cheap. Archivists, loremasters, and the like would be common.

5) As a tangent of the skills involved in duplicating illuminated texts, many monesteries have embraced their members practicing and teaching the arts. My own experience included a monk whose sculptures grace not only his monestary, but are also in collections all over the world, and another who gave me private lessons in classical music on his 400 year old cello. Thus, an archetypal artist- even a PC with Bard levels- would not be out of place.

6) It wasn't uncommon in both the Western and Eastern tradition for people who had lived terrible lives to enter the monasteries in order to repent their evil deeds and recenter their lives. There are some who posit that St. Peter was a mercenary of some skill and money before being called to the faith. Several European rulers spent time in monesteries and cloisters.

7) Depending upon the particular religion or religious order, science was either embraced or supressed. Some monestaries were key in preserving the works of Greek, Roman and Arabic theoriticians...while others put such works to the flame. Both the alchemist/true scientist and the witchhunter can coexist in such a life.

8) Because of the compartmentalized structure of monastic life, it was possible to commit great evils even within the walls of the monestaries. In a fantasy world, though, the existence of magic may make that much more difficult.

9) The "idiot" may not be an idiot at all, but may just be feigning a condition in order to observe the inner workings of the monestery. He may be an agent of the Crown, the heirarchy of the church, or some unknown power...

10) Despite their busy days, monks still have leisure time. While some pursue the arts, many more become phenomenal linguists. Of the monks I know personally, only a couple are merely bilingual. Many know 4 languages fluently, and fluency in 7 or more languages was not uncommon. Someone like this could be quite worldly and well-traveled, acting as a translator or even a diplomat.

ravells
06-12-2008, 04:45 PM
On the topic of Labeling....


Its gorgeous, I love your colour choice and shape of the buildings. What are you building it in? Illustrator?



Please give us labeled and unlabeled versions if you're not sharing the work files :).


Please, Please, :)

Gosh, I'm glad you like it, Sigurd. I was beginning to think it looked a bit blah. The problem about mapping at this scale is that each building needs to be drawn individually and I wanted lots of them but just don't have the time. Here is the latest WIP which is still very much a WIP, but I'm just playing around with how the buildings should be located outside the monastery walls, but nothing's really working.

I might start labelling it this weekend, and sure you can have a copy labelled and unlabelled. This is all done in drawplus X2 which is like a poor man's illustrator but much easier to use.

Thanks for all the monkish info and cheers, your message really cheered me up about this drawing!

Ravs

### Latest WIP ###

ravells
06-14-2008, 07:25 PM
I think I'm done now. I just couldn't get the outside bit to work, so, it's just within the walls. To tell the truth it was all getting a little too hard!

There's a labelled and unlabelled version.

Cheers

Ravs

### Latest WIP ###

Redrobes
06-14-2008, 07:51 PM
Lovely ! - but isn't that a sort of French way of spelling amphitheater ?

Edit -- I am getting either er or re on the end depending on who you use to look up the word but all have the 'h' in it.

ravells
06-14-2008, 07:55 PM
Oh! I thought amphitheater was the US spelling? I looked it up on onelook.com and Wiki and it looks like they are both acceptable. You had me worried for a moment there!

cheers

Ravs

Redrobes
06-14-2008, 08:06 PM
Theres still an 'h' missing tho yes ? You have Amphiteatre instead of Amphitheatre.

ravells
06-14-2008, 08:07 PM
Yikes! Thanks...I'll amend and repost!

:: Edit :: Done - and I had to sneak in one of those cool symbol fonts that Jaerdaph found.

Sigurd
06-15-2008, 12:38 AM
Its very pretty, but I think the red numbers are too lurid for my tastes. Just my .02.

I love the attention you pay to the wall outline. It really suggests interesting stone work.


Sigurd

Torq
06-15-2008, 03:56 AM
Great work Ravs. I think the whole thing turned out beautifully. I'm already thinking of how to use the cloister in an existing game I'm playing. It may even be big enough to use in a VTT. I like the bright, colourful pulp stlye but I think that the actual floorplan may get lost amidst the brighter colours. I feel its so detailed and architectural, as well as beautifully coloured that it should be focal point of the map, but it seems to be be fighting for attention a bit, amidst the bright labels, title, border and symbols.

Torq

ravells
06-16-2008, 06:14 AM
Thanks for the feedback guys. I spent hours trying to find a decent background for this. Because the colour scheme on the map is so light, a dark background made it pop more.

I was trying to get a sense of drama into the map - 'Stormlit cloister' suggests to me deep, bright sunset like reds behind a mountain - hence the choice of the colouring of the Title.

And then I went a bit mad with super saturated colours which really stand off the page!, but you're absolutely right, the map gets lost among all the other elements.

I think I might try again with the composition and make a series of different choices on how to present the map.

ravells
06-16-2008, 04:51 PM
How is this? Any better?

C&Cs gratefully received.

Torq
06-16-2008, 04:58 PM
Massively cool Ravs. I really like it and I do think its an improvement. The plan now has centre stage. The latin inscription is a bit real world for Groam though isn't it?

Torq

ravells
06-16-2008, 05:04 PM
Glad you like it! Do you want to make up some script to go where the latin is? I couldn't really think of anything to put in there and the space was just a bit too big to leave alone. I thought of maybe listing the major characters in the monastery but some sort of Groamish speak would be better...

How about this with a bit of history?

### Latest WIP ###

The-Somberlain
06-16-2008, 05:40 PM
Exceptional map! I am literally drooling over this...I want to play in it, with it...Ok, I am getting out of control here!

Great job ravells!

ravells
06-16-2008, 06:19 PM
Wow, thanks!

I have to thank Torq though who gave me some really good C&Cs from the last version.

Redrobes
06-16-2008, 08:33 PM
This is very good again Ravs ! I have been away for a day and it gets that much better than before and it was good then too. I don't often like the gothic style font - probably because its a little overused but in this example it works brilliantly. I'll go and update the WIPs now. Its been a while...

rlucci
06-16-2008, 09:34 PM
I think the white background is much better than the dark one. I love the detail and the way you labelled everything with those thin black lines (instant info without a lot of clutter). Overall, one sweet map.

Just two gnit-picky question: How do our monks get into the ampitheatre? And, wouldn't there be a direct path between the west gate and the stables?

waldronate
06-16-2008, 09:47 PM
Lovely map. One question, though: Everything has contrast shading except the pillars in the grand hall. Do they emit light?

Ascension
06-16-2008, 10:06 PM
Dude, that's just about perfect. It looks like something out of one of my Illuminated Manuscripts books. Kudos galore.

Torq
06-17-2008, 04:36 AM
I really love it Ravs. Clear and artistic. When a map combines those two aspects well its always a winner. I love the text too. I just thought of a slogan for the monastery, that would form part of a mantra of some kind "From surrender, purity, From purity, Salvation".

Well done.

Torq

torstan
06-17-2008, 05:28 AM
That is a real stunner. Good job.

Couple of questions, to follow up on Waldonrate's glowing pillars - the cloisters at the top end of the lecture area are also remarkably shadowless. The other thing is the compass. If the west gate is on the west of the monastery and the east gate is on the east, then the large pointer of the compass is pointing south, which seems a little counter-intuitive.

I apologise if there is a good reason for that elsewhere on the thread, I admit I just jumped to the most recent version. Otherwise, a truly excellent job. Well done.

torstan
06-17-2008, 05:32 AM
Also, you might want a door on the barracks. Currently if your soldiers need to get somewhere in a hurry they have to run a long way through the acolyte's quarters.

ravells
06-17-2008, 06:07 AM
Thank you for all the the compliments and for the C&Cs - all of which I will incorporate. It's so helpful having many pairs of eyes to pick up on the oversights. Hopefully it should not be more than an evening's work - what do they say? The last 50% of your time is spent on the last 10% of your drawing?

Torstan! Well spotted with the Compass, I'll reverse the Gate names! I really don't think the design of the compass works with this - I'll make something else up more suitable.

Almost there (phew!)

Ravs

Sigurd
06-17-2008, 02:28 PM
Lovely map. One question, though: Everything has contrast shading except the pillars in the grand hall. Do they emit light?

Man! You're tough!


I really like it Rav. It has a 'knightly' feel to it.

waldronate
06-17-2008, 04:20 PM
Man! You're tough!


It's a great map! But the pillars looked a little out of place, perhaps to draw attention to them. Imagine the scene: An immense and dark high-vaulted chamber with a single lighted doorway at the far end. As you enter, the nearest pair of pillars begins to glow with a shadowless white light, illuminating the images of titans and gods rendered in fantastic relief from the mosaiced floor through the wall carvings to frescoed ceiling. As you proceed down the row of pillars, each pair lights in succession to reveal further parts of the story of [insert story name here], with the previous pair fading behind you.
Or maybe it was an oversight. Works either way.

ravells
06-17-2008, 05:42 PM
Not tough! This is exactly what I need to spot the oversights.

Here is the latest version in which I hope I have incorporated the C&Cs.

I'm not happy with the motto though....it looks too much like a badge or something.

### Latest WIP ###

ravells
06-18-2008, 02:20 AM
Motto fixed and I've made the image a little smaller. I think this is the final entry now.

Thanks for all the help and encouragement, everyone.

### Latest WIP ###

Valarian
06-18-2008, 04:37 AM
I'm not happy with the motto though....it looks too much like a badge or something.
That's exactly what some of the churches did. Badges were given out to pilgrims so that they could prove they'd been on pilgrimage when they arrived home.

ravells
06-18-2008, 09:23 AM
Fancy that! I had a look online and saw some 'pilgrimage' badges and the hand and key crest looks like it could pass for one (the real badges are quite heraldic). Thanks Valarian, I had no idea about this little detail of history.

Karro
06-18-2008, 11:13 AM
This map = win.

Also... I love the background story. Is that your contribution or was it something that came with the description of the area?

ravells
06-18-2008, 12:17 PM
Thanks Karro! There are some magnificent maps in this month's challenge - Fort Lost is a really good entry and there are others which are still being done which I think will be real winners when they are completed. The real winner will be the CBWP which will have a whole set of new maps, which is what I really like about this month's challenge - every map will have a use.

I made up the background story loosely based on what Torq had written about Groam - glad you liked it!

Karro
06-18-2008, 01:58 PM
Thanks Karro! There are some magnificent maps in this month's challenge - Fort Lost is a really good entry and there are others which are still being done which I think will be real winners when they are completed. The real winner will be the CBWP which will have a whole set of new maps, which is what I really like about this month's challenge - every map will have a use.

I made up the background story loosely based on what Torq had written about Groam - glad you liked it!

Yeah, I saw Fort Lost, too, and it's also great. I think the story really gives a sense of urgency to this place, that sense that we're on the edge of something important and dangerous...

rlucci
06-18-2008, 05:30 PM
You added a dovecote.

[rlucci wipes a tear from the corner of his eye]

I love dovecotes.

[sniff]

ravells
06-18-2008, 06:42 PM
Hate to say this, rlucci, but from what I read, they were introduced to provide the monks with some meat to eat (pigeon).....but in this monastery they're messenger pigeons!

Hussar
06-23-2008, 11:24 PM
Daaaaammmmnnn. *applause*