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Torq
06-08-2008, 05:49 PM
Airith. I would really like to do the city of Tirylus for the challenge this month. I discovered that your region still doesn't have a name. Have you come up with one since posting the map?

Also is there any more infor on Tirylus that you have, whether you've posted it ot not? Any suggestions and creative help would be greatly appreciated.

Torq

Torq
06-11-2008, 11:05 AM
I haven't heard anything from Airith so I'm really doing my own thing with the city. I've only really been working on layout so far, but this is what I've got up to this point. Lots of work to do still.

Torq

Talroth
06-11-2008, 11:33 AM
Looking good so far. What is the population suppose to be?

Few questions:

1. Why do you have massive walls, but apparently no gates? (or why are you allowing people to build houses in the middle of your gates?)

2. What is the building in the middle right, that has the long narrow parts coming out of it, and running up the streets? Is that just an error? Or is it some cool building that has some interesting function?

3. at the north end of the wall, by the gate, you have houses outside your wall, but there is no gate to that section of land. Why not move the north gate to the other side of the river, and act as a way to cross all 'three' rivers in that region?


Hope to see more soon.

ravells
06-11-2008, 11:49 AM
Lookin' really great, Torq! That's some volume of housing that you're generating! I'm lucky if I can build one a day!

Torq
06-11-2008, 03:59 PM
Looking good so far. What is the population suppose to be?

Few questions:

1. Why do you have massive walls, but apparently no gates? (or why are you allowing people to build houses in the middle of your gates?)

2. What is the building in the middle right, that has the long narrow parts coming out of it, and running up the streets? Is that just an error? Or is it some cool building that has some interesting function?

3. at the north end of the wall, by the gate, you have houses outside your wall, but there is no gate to that section of land. Why not move the north gate to the other side of the river, and act as a way to cross all 'three' rivers in that region?


Hope to see more soon.

1. I'm not really sure. How many does the size suggest?
2. The narrow parts are the extant sections of some of the original town walls. Most of the stone has been taken for buildings, and several buildings actuall incorporated the old wall in their structure.
3. I am planning to build a bridge across the river in that area. The area outside contains a spa area where people go to "take the waters" which are believed to have magical curative properties. It isn't as polluted as it is within the city's walls.

Torq

Torq
06-11-2008, 04:05 PM
Lookin' really great, Torq! That's some volume of housing that you're generating! I'm lucky if I can build one a day!

Thanks Ravs. As for the housing, I'm not doing the structures individually. Drawing each structure makes mapping cities almost impossible for those who dont have many hours in the day to spend on it.

The basics of the layout are done using RPG City map generator. That produces about a third of the buildings. I find them too small so I "supersize" them to add volume. The second third (the more detialed buildings) are cut and pastes from the Lankhmar geomorphs that were posted here a while back, and the last third use a Gimp brush that RobA made. This makes the small buildings. I do a lot of manual tidying and shadowing.

Torq

Airith
06-12-2008, 06:25 PM
woah! I completely forgot to look through this section. Thanks for doing one of my cities Torq! I'll type up my stuff in a bit, I've been thinking for a while, but haven't really put anything to paper. I looked over the map, but don't worry if whatever I say doesn't work with it, my fault for being late.

Tirylus is an Orvaelos border city, beside Bruskos. It's quite far from other big settlements, so it probably has to have everything to exist that far out. It has its own garrison as well. I kind of thought that it would use the southern river as a natural wall, but since you've already gone over both banks it doesn't matter. 2 major roads, one going east following along the river, to a castle, the other west over the river to the capital city. I'm kind of thinking of giving my region a more ancient chinese dynasty theme, but still thinking about other ideas. Also, probably quite a bit of farmland east of the city. The area south and a bit southwest of the city is covered with gnoll warbands, and possibly orcs. *cough* sadly no name for the region...

Hopefully you can read through that mess of ideas I just spewed out. You don't have to follow it that closely, it will be your map after all. If you have other questions I'll answer them now that I know about the thread :) I've also added an update of my map (i finally did those roads) in my thread.

Torq
06-13-2008, 07:45 AM
A bit more work done on this.

Torq

###Latest WIP###

ravells
06-13-2008, 03:54 PM
That is looking great, Torq! I love the river definition!

torstan
06-17-2008, 07:09 AM
Very pretty farmland. Coming along nicely.

jfrazierjr
06-17-2008, 08:23 AM
I have to say. while I love the farmland texture overall, I don't think it fits well at this scale. IMO, the buildings are way to large to match the implied camera height for the farmland areas.

Joe

NeonKnight
06-18-2008, 08:40 AM
I have to say. while I love the farmland texture overall, I don't think it fits well at this scale. IMO, the buildings are way to large to match the implied camera height for the farmland areas.

Joe

I have to say I agree. The farmland seems....off.

Torq
06-23-2008, 10:46 AM
Here's an update. I'm really running out of time but life is a little hectic at the moment. Will need to push hard for the end of the month. Comments welcome.

Torq

###Latest WIP###

ravells
06-23-2008, 10:57 AM
Hi Torq!

I really, really like this map. In particular - the individual trees which fit really well with scale on which you're working; the colour of the river (green rather than the usual blue) and river banks, which have a great shape to them and again beautifully in keeping with the scale.

The only thing that doesn't quite work for me at the moment (although you're probably in the process of dealing with it) is the uniformity of the paving. The texture itself is beautiful, but I think there's too much of it. It looks to me as if the entire area below the city was paved first and then the city built on top. Is there any way in which you could break up the paving, maybe with more green areas, suggestions of kerbs on roads...unpaved / muddy areas...anything to disrupt the uniformity?

Another thing to try (if you haven't already) which I discovered sort of by accident on the Arboria map is with these semi-isometric maps, to make the drop shadows of the walls very intense (little or no tranparency) and a darker colour of the wall (in this case gray). It gives a suggestion of the vertical height of the wall without the 'floating' drop shadow effect, i.e. the drop shadow looks like part of the wall itself.

cheers

Ravs

Karro
06-23-2008, 04:05 PM
The only thing that doesn't quite work for me at the moment (although you're probably in the process of dealing with it) is the uniformity of the paving. The texture itself is beautiful, but I think there's too much of it. It looks to me as if the entire area below the city was paved first and then the city built on top. Is there any way in which you could break up the paving, maybe with more green areas, suggestions of kerbs on roads...unpaved / muddy areas...anything to disrupt the uniformity?

Ravs

I'd add to this that it looks like the bottom of the river is paved with the same texture, which looks odd to me. Unless this is an aqueduct, then I guess that might be expected? But otherwise it looks too regular to be random river rock.

Torq
06-24-2008, 02:50 AM
I'd add to this that it looks like the bottom of the river is paved with the same texture, which looks odd to me. Unless this is an aqueduct, then I guess that might be expected? But otherwise it looks too regular to be random river rock.

Yes, the river is canalised (if thats a word) and paved with the same stone.

Torq

torstan
06-24-2008, 07:56 AM
Hmmm, not sure I buy that. If they were going to go to all the effort of paving the river they would surely make it a regular width - whereas this river looks to be much more organic in shape. Also, there's currently a brick wall at the end of the river at all three ends where it leaves the map. Not sure that's intentional :)

jfrazierjr
06-24-2008, 09:03 AM
I'd add to this that it looks like the bottom of the river is paved with the same texture, which looks odd to me. Unless this is an aqueduct, then I guess that might be expected? But otherwise it looks too regular to be random river rock.

I actually rather like that look, other than the blocked section on each end which does not look quite right for some reason(though it's not that bad).

Torq, I love the trees you added between the two versions. It really helps to make the whole thing pop.


On the down side, you have shadows for all your trees and buildings, but you bridges are flat on the water. Should be a quick fix though.

Also, even though the farmland background looks better blown up in size, I really don't think it goes with this map. The reason why at that they are all blurry while your city building lines are super sharp and clear. To me it just tends to stick out rather than blend into the background as I would expect. Again, based on scale, the fields should be fairly well visible at this altitude, especially when contrasted with the buildings and trees directly over top of some of them.

Joe

RobA
06-24-2008, 09:17 AM
Torq - the detail is incredible (as always).

Not sure about the repeating stone pattern in the texture used for roofs. It all runs N/S.

-Rob A>

Karro
06-24-2008, 11:54 AM
Yes, the river is canalised (if thats a word) and paved with the same stone.

Torq

Well... I guess consider my comment retracted then.

Torq
06-24-2008, 02:41 PM
Great crits and comments guys, thanks. Most of it is on my to do list, but my problem is time this month.

To DO:

Add realism to fields
Shadows for the bridges
Get rid of the paved anomalies at the river ends (which were not deliberate)
Imptoved Roof Textures
Finish roofing the city
Break up the cobblestones some more
Labels
Additional single features

I'm going to get as much done as possible within the time allowed, but might have to carry on after the competition is finished.

Torq

jfrazierjr
06-24-2008, 02:46 PM
Great crits and comments guys, thanks. Most of it is on my to do list, but my problem is time this month.

To DO:

Add realism to fields
Shadows for the bridges
Get rid of the paved anomalies at the river ends (which were not deliberate)
Imptoved Roof Textures
Finish roofing the city
Break up the cobblestones some more
Labels
Additional single features

I'm going to get as much done as possible within the time allowed, but might have to carry on after the competition is finished.

Torq

Just make sure on your final that you can get us a nice hi-res version. This is a beautiful city, and I for one would like to chunk this into Maptool and have a nice little goblin/orc/whatever city siege battle...


Joe

Torq
06-24-2008, 03:07 PM
Joe

I would love nothing more than to have this map used for that purpose. As long as you promise to post a screenshot or two. My concern is that I have kept enough res in the bank. I'm using Gimp at 2144x2144 for the original but only 72dpi. I hope thats enough.

Torq

jfrazierjr
06-24-2008, 03:55 PM
Joe

I would love nothing more than to have this map used for that purpose. As long as you promise to post a screenshot or two. My concern is that I have kept enough res in the bank. I'm using Gimp at 2144x2144 for the original but only 72dpi. I hope thats enough.

Torq



Understood. I did not see a scale yet, but I expect it's probably to small as is to really be a "perfect" VTT map. RPMiller, Dorpond, or Torstan would be able to share more, but I think the suggestion is 5 foot =50 px at a minimum, with 100, 150 or even 200 px per 5 foot being the best.

In any event, the map is a great piece of art no matter how you look at it and even if it can't be used very well for VTT, it makes a great player handout of a generic city. hmmm you might just have to get my vote for this months challenge again. argh!!!! there are SOOOO many awesome maps. It will be really hard to choose my pick for this month...

Joe

torstan
06-25-2008, 08:43 AM
Yes, it's a bit low res for use in maptool as an encounter map - but actually not as bad as all that.

Here's a quick screenshot using this in maptool Any closer in and it gets a bit pixelated, but at this distance it works pretty well and would llow for some nice large scale battles. If a specific area was of interest for a battle, that area could be done in high res and imported in to patch that area - a bit like in Google Maps.

4973

jfrazierjr
06-25-2008, 09:25 AM
Yes, it's a bit low res for use in maptool as an encounter map - but actually not as bad as all that.

Here's a quick screenshot using this in maptool Any closer in and it gets a bit pixelated, but at this distance it works pretty well and would llow for some nice large scale battles. If a specific area was of interest for a battle, that area could be done in high res and imported in to patch that area - a bit like in Google Maps.

4614

Whats the bigger ugly round token? Is that an Ogre?

torstan
06-25-2008, 09:34 AM
And the prize goes to Joe for his perception!

Yep, a big ugly ogre.

Torq
06-26-2008, 11:57 AM
I managed to get a bit done today so here's the latest.

Torq

### Latest WIP ###

ravells
06-26-2008, 12:07 PM
This is seriously epic in scale and execution. Congrats on a fantastic entry, Torq - it's beautiful.

jfrazierjr
06-26-2008, 12:18 PM
OH YEA... Now there are actually bridges... I echo ravells... My only disappointment is that it's not large enough to use as a battle map without pixelization... heh... but that would be one HUGH freaking map...

Joe

Torq
09-15-2008, 08:19 AM
Having spent some time away from this map I have now done some more work on it, as I never finished it in time for the June challenge. After finishing my shot at this month's challenge I have come back to Tirylus. I have tried to break some of the uniformity of the cobblestones and the surrounding countryside. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Torq

Steel General
09-15-2008, 11:10 AM
Torq I think it looks great so far.

Not sure how much "farm land" you wanted around the actual town, but maybe add some more of what you already have in the south to the other areas, even if its just hinted at near the edges.

Also, I don't think they would have houses/etc. and trees so close to the gates themselves. I would think they would have those areas cleared for defense purposes.

ravells
09-15-2008, 05:48 PM
Really crisp and cute. Nice work Torq!

Torq
09-19-2008, 04:37 AM
"Crisp and cute? Crisp and cute?" :0 Have you seen my avatar? I'll give you crisp and cute ;). Thats it I'm never doing another city map.

Torq

jezelf
09-19-2008, 08:30 AM
Cool. very cool. great progress on this.

A couple of things if you want 'em. The resolution of the field texture is lower than that of the rest of the work. Sharpen it up, or put the trees like the ones you've scattered over the ones from the textures.

I would expect more of a defined road into the the main gate. it looks odd the cobbles just stop at the gate and then there's a mud road. Maybe have some road texture that isn't in such a high contrast to the cobbles? Also if the time line is the equivalent of medieval times, then Romans where before making decent roads.

I was watching a program on Castles last night, your general castle with stone masons takes about 10 years. With your map, it would be nice to see more evidence of this time passed for such a sizeable town. So more smaller communities outside the walls on the north side along with some more fields perhaps?

Lastly, some of the buildings look like they are 'crushed' along the north wall, it doesn't look like they are placed naturally nor aligned to the wall itself.

Just some observations.

ravells
09-19-2008, 02:41 PM
Sorry. I meant to say, Crisp and really cute! ;)

Airith
10-08-2008, 09:37 PM
That looks amazing Torq, it looks like a real bustling city that grew there. Although not entirely what I originally thought, it still looks great. Want to come up with some info about the place? Maybe even add it to the wiki :D I haven't done any real thinking about this place so you'll have free reign.

Oh yeah, so is this pronounced "done"?

Torq
10-09-2008, 06:00 AM
Thanks Airith. Sorry if I hijacked your city somewhat. I also havn't done much thinking about context, but I dont think its quite finished. I would still like to make some changes but just havn't had the time.

Torq

torstan
10-09-2008, 03:52 PM
That's looking great. Nice improvements.

industrygothica
12-12-2008, 02:27 PM
I'd like to get Tirylus added to the wiki. Do you have any more updates or any details on the city yet?

Gandwarf
12-13-2008, 03:43 PM
Torq, I totally missed this city somehow. I think it's awesome and I repped you for it. I love your towers, the slopes of the rivers, the houses and the vegetation. I don't see anything I don't like and I have been studying it for over 5 minutes. Very cool!

Torq
12-14-2008, 02:49 PM
Thanks Gandwarf. IG I have set myself the goal of finishing this one before the year is out. It has been been one of the most difficult maps I have done, which probably means I learned the most from the process.

Torq

industrygothica
12-14-2008, 06:38 PM
Thanks Gandwarf. IG I have set myself the goal of finishing this one before the year is out. It has been been one of the most difficult maps I have done, which probably means I learned the most from the process.

Torq

Your effort shows, most definitely. I'll be waiting for the tutorial on the buildings. ;)

Let me know when you're ready for it to go into the wiki.

-IG