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RedKettle
02-14-2014, 07:32 AM
Here is the latest for the fictional Irish Plantation town Blackross I am drawing for commission.

Blackross will be mapped in the present day, but in a black and white turn-of-the century Ordinance style. I have added some temporary coloring to the buildings and water for clarity. It is at the point where most of the important elements are present to one degree or another. Big items still missing are trees, labels, and the border/framing elements. Street layout and building mix have primarily been chosen by the client.

The northern edge and circular town-center are still unfinished, but hopefully they should be filled out soon. Other known issues are perhaps a little too much regularity in lot size and housing layout. I get the feeling that adding the trees may soften things a little.

Comments/critiques/suggestions are always welcome!

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Tracker
02-14-2014, 08:13 AM
Hello:
At first glance it looks good. At second glance it looks good. I agree about the lot sizes. There are very few cities that I know of that have uniformed lot sizes. I did not see any parks, or I missed them. I do like it.

Thanks for posting.
Tracker

pionono
02-14-2014, 08:56 AM
There's a park where the lake is on the top left, but most of the park features (like trees and ponds and park lanes) have yet to be added, as Redkettle mentioned in his post. I tried clicking on the image, but it's coming up blank, or it's not loading, is that happening for you too?

Jalyha
02-14-2014, 11:43 AM
Not loading for me either :?

Falconius
02-14-2014, 02:15 PM
Loaded for me and it's pretty badass. It's a shame you guys are missing out :p

I live the detail you have going on. To me the lot sizes seem fine, they seem like natural allotments that one would find in a city of this sort. I'm looking forwards to the development.

Jalyha
02-14-2014, 04:01 PM
Had to load it in a different browser :?

I don't think the lot sizes are a big problem. You said it's an older map style, but a more modern time, yes?

Lots are irregular in old places for 2 reasons: 1) they grow, organically, and 2) lack of tools/equipment to move through the land instead of *with* it.

Modern times/planned cities can eliminate a lot of this irregularity.
In fact, in some places the lot sizes might be regulated... *required* to be a certain size.


I give you 2 cities:

Quincy Il (https://maps.google.com/maps?q=quincy+il&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x87ddf79cd32e3b37:0x5f65b820ccb464be,Quincy ,+IL&gl=us&ei=W3T-UvrbHOSwyQHaloG4Bg&ved=0CJkBELYD)(large town/small city): Laid out in a very precise grid for most of the city.

A precise 12 blocks to a mile, except in the college area, throughout the city. Each "lot" size (individual houses/yards) regulated due to post office/fire department zoning requirements, until you get to the nicer areas :P

Indianapolis, IN (https://maps.google.com/maps?q=quincy+il&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x87ddf79cd32e3b37:0x5f65b820ccb464be,Quincy ,+IL&gl=us&ei=W3T-UvrbHOSwyQHaloG4Bg&ved=0CJkBELYD) (Metropolis): Similar grid pattern, distorted for larger buildings, and around a central "circle". The most variation is around freeways, parks, and of course the speedway, and further out toward the suburbs.


So, I don't think lot size is an issue at all.


Also, I like the detail :)

Larb
02-14-2014, 09:08 PM
The lots look like the typical gardens you'd find in english and irish towns accompanying terraced and semi-detached housing so they look fine to me.

TheHoarseWhisperer
02-14-2014, 09:30 PM
Agreed. This is a very good map, and a very convincing town plan (including lot sizes), given its modern context.

Ilanthar
02-16-2014, 10:54 AM
Very nice, I like the town plan.

xotoxi
02-16-2014, 11:09 AM
If you ask me, that map is pretty darn awesome.

And even if you don't ask me, it's still awesome.

darkseed2012
02-17-2014, 05:51 PM
I really like the style used. What program did you use to draw this with?

The city doesn't have a clear downtown. The type of buildings, I'm guessing are row houses really reminds me of the Sunset District in San Francisco, CA. For more accuracy with the passage of time, you should add out buildings in the backyards of some of the houses and more variety in the shapes of the houses, since people tend to add rooms as time passes. I really like how it is turning out. It looks like a lot of work.

RedKettle
02-18-2014, 06:56 AM
Apologies for not attaching things correctly the first time. I am not sure what I did differently this time to stop the attachment from loading, but I am hoping one of the Great and All Powerful Forum Overseers could step in and lend a hand (if they have not already! and many thanks if you already have!)

In order to help troubleshoot I will try another attachment on this post. The last was a 3MB .gif, and this latest will be a 4MB .jpg. Let us see if that is any better!
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Also, thanks all for the comments! It helps! Now the pressure is on to keep it looking good.


I did not see any parks, or I missed them.

I guess I should have warned you guys that I am using some very light gray lines, which may require some zooming and squinting. Since I am working with vectors right now I am hoping to spend some time at the end fiddling with lineweights, etc. to not only match the Ordinance map style but also to make this more legible.


You said it's an older map style, but a more modern time, yes?

That is generally correct.



What program did you use to draw this with?

I am using a CAD program (Draftsight) with some help from GIMP to switch between filetypes.



The city doesn't have a clear downtown. The type of buildings, I'm guessing are row houses really reminds me of the Sunset District in San Francisco, CA. For more accuracy with the passage of time, you should add out buildings in the backyards of some of the houses and more variety in the shapes of the houses, since people tend to add rooms as time passes.

The downtown area is not complete, but will be the denser core of the town, so I will keep your advice in mind as I continue to develop that area.

pionono
02-20-2014, 07:26 PM
Reminds me of Amsterdam...Buildings in the Netherlands by year of construction (http://dev.citysdk.waag.org/buildings/#52.367,4.8783,13)

Ilanthar
02-21-2014, 06:09 AM
Thanks for the link pionono, it's quite amazing!

RedKettle
03-25-2014, 07:23 AM
Here is the latest from Blackross. Most of the drawing of stuff is done, including the accessory buildings in the rear of the lots and trees. Now I am starting to work on labels/border/presentation/other mapping elements. Hopefully the labels should be on in the next few days.

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Also, very cool link pionono!

RedKettle
04-24-2014, 01:54 AM
Here is the latest!

It finally has enough elements to start understanding how it will look. For better or worse, the ordinance map style has been partially abandoned, and additions from more modern street/tourist maps have been used to fill the gaps creating a hybrid style. It seems to all work, but probably only because I do not know which rules I am breaking (or which rules to break!).

Some parts of the plan continue to be reworked, so this is still a little ways from complete.

The heraldry? comes from the client, and a large number of the street names have been borrowed from Cork.

Comments/Critiques/Questions welcome! I am not sure I am sold on the Black/White checkerboarding, the contrast feels a little overpowering relative to the rest. Also, I want to keep the tone of this serious, but I am wondering if this is feeling a little too stiff. Maybe more fancy fun lines are needed?

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Ilanthar
04-24-2014, 05:20 AM
I like the design and added elements. But I think the buildings were easier to spot with the grey lines you had before.

RedKettle
04-26-2014, 07:22 AM
Thanks! Yeah, I agree that the buildings are slowly fading away. I think that comment also brings up a broader question of what exactly I want (or what should be) emphasized. I think right now I am not sure, and it shows a little.
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RedKettle
05-01-2014, 02:50 AM
Before I go back to making actual map changes I wanted to make one more quick iteration of the layout. I've removed the outer border lines and instead started giving the legends/indexes their own cartouche-type borders. I've also removed the black in the formerly black/white grid numbering.
Despite the under-worked cartouches (I was looking at triskelions for inspiration, but I might need more spiral!), I think just the border change helps free up some of the stiffness and lets things move around the page more, so this might be going in the right direction.

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Triskelion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triskelion)

Ilanthar
05-01-2014, 10:29 AM
The triskelion are pretty. As for the buildings, my personal preference would go for the "hatched ones", with an opacity between your grey and the full black.

Tracker
05-01-2014, 03:00 PM
Hello:
I agree with the buildings fading away. It looks good. I like the index and the legend. It looks good. I also like that in the dense area of the town that the buildings are a different shaep and not cookie cutter. It does look too large for a town and should be a city. Then again that is an arbitrary size thing.

Tracker

pionono
05-01-2014, 04:41 PM
It's definitely not an OS map, but I doesn't have to be, as you've taken it to a whole different level. There's a logic and a functionality that makes it stand on its own. I liked the checkboard border (with its fully-working coordinates to help the reader locate the streets you have listed below), though it might be worth exploring a grey-white version instead of the black-white, if you think it is too overpowering rather than removing it altogether. For the buildings, the black stripes really work well (though the grey stripes work too). The rail tracks could stand out better against the dashed grey boundary lines if you colored them black instead of grey, I think.
When I look at your map with the details in the parks and the layout of the blocks and intersecting streets and all, it totally reminds of Nolli's famous map of Rome (interactive version here: The Interactive Nolli Map of Rome Website (http://nolli.uoregon.edu/default.asp)).

lostatsea
05-01-2014, 04:46 PM
WOW ! That looks like alot of work. Is it hand drawn or Digital hand drawn ?

RedKettle
05-02-2014, 04:25 PM
...As for the buildings, my personal preference would go for the "hatched ones", with an opacity between your grey and the full black...


...I agree with the buildings fading away...


...I liked the checkboard border (with its fully-working coordinates to help the reader locate the streets you have listed below), though it might be worth exploring a grey-white version instead of the black-white, if you think it is too overpowering rather than removing it altogether. For the buildings, the black stripes really work well (though the grey stripes work too). The rail tracks could stand out better against the dashed grey boundary lines if you colored them black instead of grey, I think...

One of my weaknesses in design has always been an aversion to bold contrast, so I appreciate you guys not letting me retreat into my pleasantly drab and dreary world of gray. I will take this all into consideration moving forward.


...it totally reminds of Nolli's famous map of Rome...
Interesting link, and a very interesting example of that bold, dense hatch! Certainly another source of inspiration now.


WOW ! That looks like alot of work. Is it hand drawn or Digital hand drawn ?
Thanks! I am drawing this digitally.

hissa
06-06-2014, 05:20 PM
Awesomeness

RedKettle
06-18-2014, 03:09 AM
Awesomeness
Thanks!


The client has opted to end with the original layout I have shown, so in one way Blackross is done.
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I feel a little bad for the other layouts explored though, so I have secured permission to pursue a few more 'finishes' for Blackross which will (eventually) be:

1. The first style talked about in the thread, something like a surveyor's map with much less border (maybe even no border), distressed linework and matching distressed (maybe typewriter?) fonts. I remember Lingon (I think) capturing a little bit of that distressed/aged feel in an island map a few months ago.

2. Cartouches! I liked how the empty space felt when I started adding cartouches, so I want to see where I can take the idea to help balance the layout.

3. Maybe a fun direction, like color on a black background similar to the heatmap of building ages linked earlier in the thread. The question then is what information do I show? I am still not sure on that, but here is a rather garish proof-of-concept showing building use and that I can at least add color in a relatively quick fashion...
65032

pionono
07-20-2014, 04:50 PM
So, what is the total population of Blackross, would you estimate?



3. Maybe a fun direction, like color on a black background similar to the heatmap of building ages linked earlier in the thread. The question then is what information do I show? I am still not sure on that, but here is a rather garish proof-of-concept showing building use and that I can at least add color in a relatively quick fashion...
65032

I really like the idea of a heatmap, Redkettle, though, if you are using the Netherlands map (linked to earlier), I think the colour red signified the oldest buildings and blue is the newest constructed.
If you'd allow me to help with dates in terms of age of construction periods, the town center (and the Norman Keep on the island in the river) would be pre-1800's (colour Red), while the neighbourhood of Coldridge would be the next to be constructed (1800-1900, Orange), when the Victorians moved out to a new area (but still close to the town's conveniences) to build their fancy houses with large gardens, ornamental parks, cemeteries and Church to cater to their spiritual needs (a feature not possible in the cramped-for-space old town center).
The neighbourhoods of Aughnacross and Padraig Hill would be next to be constructed (1900-1920, Light Orange), as these would be the new educated professionals moving into the town and setting up their businesses and establishments, like dentists and doctors surgeries, barbers, hardware stores, etc. etc.. The Train Station would also be built in the very early years of 1900.
The Great Depression would have stopped construction completely and the rural town probably didn't expand until well into the 1940's after the Second World War. Places like Shannagh and Fairview would only have begun to be built after the war (1945-1965, Yellow). These would be the first housing estates, where each house is built exactly the same as its neighbour with equal sized yard or lawn (plus, with the invention and widespread ownership of the automobile, it means these houses all have driveways for parking a family car, a notable absence in former housing styles). The owners who have shops and businesses on Main Street and principal side streets, would move out to these new "modern" housing estates leaving the rooms and floors above their shops empty or used for storage purposes.
The High School, Garda Station, Community Center and Sports Grounds, would be relatively late constructions (1965-1985, White), while the Business Park, Cinema, restaurants and park amenities, would be the most recent additions (1985-2000, Gray).
The 2000's would see a boom in the economy and the old town center would be refitted with new store fronts for new shops like expensive clothes boutiques, novelty gift shops and small Fast Food joints. Apartments and rooms (above these refitted ground floor shops) would be modernized and let out for rent to the young new business people (2000-2008, Light Blue).
New housing estates (like in Fairview) would be constructed on the fringes of town in plots of 10 or more houses before the economic "boom" collapsed and the estates left half or unfinished, where the construction firms went bust following the credit crunch (2008-14, Dark Blue).
Hope this little history narrative helps you in creating your really awesome heatmap. 8) Cheers!

natcase701
12-05-2014, 06:06 PM
Very nicely done. One concern i have is that the linework, especially the hatching, is too mechanical. Printing would cause some variation in the spacing and thickness in the line. Consider running hatching through photoshop for a minute amount of variation in a tile that can be reused in the original. Also, consider a less mechanical type for the street lettering: though very precise, it was hand drawn in the era being depicted.
But: very cool. thanks for sharing.