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TimPaul
07-08-2014, 11:52 AM
Been a while since I could work on this. It's nice to return to this and work on it. There's a lot of area to cover.



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Eilathen
07-08-2014, 01:51 PM
Looks nice! Looking forward to seeing this world come to life. Somehow i think novel or rpg when i see this map ^^
For me, the contrast between the broadleaf trees and the conifers is a bit strong. Somehow the conifers seem to stand out much more.

TimPaul
07-08-2014, 03:54 PM
I'm fine with that, as that's what I wanted.

Diamond
07-08-2014, 11:34 PM
You're a madman! That looks like an immense amount of work, but if it all looks as good as what you've posted, it will be a delicious map. Lovely mountains. While that bright red wouldn't have been my first choice for the icons, they actually look quite nice.

madbird-valiant
07-09-2014, 01:00 AM
Man, every now and then I drop back into the forum and it seems like every time I do you're still plugging away at this :P Looking fantastic mate.

TimPaul
07-09-2014, 06:33 AM
Man, every now and then I drop back into the forum and it seems like every time I do you're still plugging away at this :P Looking fantastic mate.

I had to take a long break from working on it.

I also have experimented with lots and lots of different options before deciding and then moving forward. At one point there was green. I considered just using symbols like circles and squares to show locations. Then more detailed drawing of buildings. There were lots and lots of options being put forth.

Normally I draw all the trees by hand, but this is way to much space to cover. So in the program Painter, I created a nozzle that allows me to draw a whole bunch of different trees, and then "draw" the trees in. And I can set it so that there is some size variance. Otherwise it would take forever with this level of detail. And if I need, I can also put one tree in a spot. I actually have two nozzles, one with groups of trees, and one with single trees.

I choose red because I wanted it to stand out, as if someone used red ink.

Eilathen
07-09-2014, 12:01 PM
I'm fine with that, as that's what I wanted.

Care to elaborate why you wanted the conifers to pop so much more?
Oh and is there world-history/background you'd be willing to share? I'm always a sucker for background infos on fantasy worlds :)

feanaaro
07-09-2014, 12:05 PM
Beautiful style.

Chashio
07-09-2014, 12:06 PM
I love it! The mountains are very pretty, and you've a nice handle on labeling. I think red is good for the icons - some of them are quite small and the color stands them out from the wilderness.
There is a bit much difference between the tree types... at least to my eye. I do like the darkness of the conifers though, and you could maybe use some more green in the map to go with the red inked labels and icons, so I'd like to suggest trying a broad, green or greenish ink wash to strengthen the presence of the leaf forests on the page. Somewhat like the old, hand-colored maps that don't always stay inside the lines. Or it may not be what you're going for. :)

Llannagh
07-09-2014, 03:16 PM
And another map to swoon over (for?).
Great mountains, VERY nice continental shape and I like the icons. The different trees are a matter of taste, I guess. The only thing I'm not a hundred percent about are the coastlines. I think the broad, double lines clash with the detailed geography.

Anyway, fantastic stuff.

TimPaul
07-14-2014, 09:32 AM
Why did I want the conifers to pop? I really wanted a strong difference between the the two trees styles. Not everyone sees the conifers as popping. I spent a lot of time trying many different options for trees. I finally decided on this approach, but it's by no means the final choice. I need to get everything in place first, and then evaluate the over all effect. Some forest area's are going to be big.

The benefits of working digital.

Adding green. Something else I worked with, and I just didn't like it.

This map is for myself and the game world I DM in.

- Max -
07-14-2014, 09:52 AM
I don't see the conifers as popping indeed. it's fine for me. Nice stuff so far.

Eilathen
07-14-2014, 11:57 AM
Let me elaborate a bit (i don't know if chasio also talks about this but at least i am not alone in the impression that it...detracts) : It is not only that the color of the conifers is much stronger than those of the other trees (i think i would have given the broadleafs a more green color than what they yet have) but it is also the density of the forests...the placement of the trees. Your broadleaf forests are much denser (more trees per square-inch or whatever measurement one has on a map like this) than the conifer forests...the conifer forests are indeed pretty sparse...which also adds to the pronounced difference of perception.

Btw, no need to sound defensive, Tim. It's your map. So you're the one who decides what is best. But this is a forum and you asked for opinions...so here you got some. And it is just pure probabilities that you'll not like all of them ;)

And just to reiterate...the overall map is really cool. Or at least I do like it ;)

And i'll ask again - would you tell us a bit about the world itself? I'm a passionate roleplayer as well...and am always interested in the game worlds of other players and GMs :)

TimPaul
07-14-2014, 01:24 PM
Let me elaborate a bit (i don't know if chasio also talks about this but at least i am not alone in the impression that it...detracts) : It is not only that the color of the conifers is much stronger than those of the other trees (i think i would have given the broadleafs a more green color than what they yet have) but it is also the density of the forests...the placement of the trees. Your broadleaf forests are much denser (more trees per square-inch or whatever measurement one has on a map like this) than the conifer forests...the conifer forests are indeed pretty sparse...which also adds to the pronounced difference of perception.

Btw, no need to sound defensive, Tim. It's your map. So you're the one who decides what is best. But this is a forum and you asked for opinions...so here you got some. And it is just pure probabilities that you'll not like all of them ;)

And just to reiterate...the overall map is really cool. Or at least I do like it ;)

And i'll ask again - would you tell us a bit about the world itself? I'm a passionate roleplayer as well...and am always interested in the game worlds of other players and GMs :)

Thanks.

If I sound defensive, I'm really not. I'm just confident in my choices. They come after a lot of of experimenting. Because you are right, it's my map.

Sometimes people post feedback without realizing it comes across as, "This map would be better if you did it this way." While they may not intend to do that, it is how it comes across. It's a fine line to walk, giving feedback that doesn't end up really being personal preference. We all have them.

I have goals for this map, which I haven't explained, and might not, as it's still in development. One of them is a very limited color palette. The green just doesn't fit in with my vision. Every way I tried to add some, it just moved it farther from where I wanted this to go.

For example. You think the conifers pop, other don't. For me, that can't be a consideration, because everyone is going to see things differently. Again, it's really more personal preference at that point. I appreciate it though, because even when feedback is someone's opinion, there's always a chance they are right, or open your view to a different view.

As for the history of this setting. There's a lot, and I just don't have time to put it all here. It's a fantasy world. I use it in conjunction with the Dungeons and Dragons rules. The land has under gone a dramatic reshaping in the ancient past, which resulted in the seas between the two large land masses. But it was so far in the past, it doesn't have much impact on the current time.

The major conflicts in the world tend to come from other planes, trying to control or destroy the world, as it's the barrier that keeps the Astral Planes and the Elemental Chaos apart. Before the creation of the world, the two planes were connected.

TimPaul
07-21-2014, 12:16 PM
Here is an update. Filling in the Tundra and northern lands.

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Chashio
07-21-2014, 01:02 PM
That looks very nice. Do the red trees represent tamaracks or dead needles or is it just denoting a mixed type of forest? Curious. Also, how large is the map (noted the ruler in the screenshot)?

TimPaul
07-21-2014, 01:41 PM
That looks very nice. Do the red trees represent tamaracks or dead needles or is it just denoting a mixed type of forest? Curious. Also, how large is the map (noted the ruler in the screenshot)?

Print size is 50 x 37.5 inches, 300 DPI.

The reddish trees are more for texture when there are a lot of trees together. They are actually more brownish when printed and viewed at actual size. There's three tree indicators. Broadlead which I don't think you can see any on this map, and conifer, and dead forest areas. There are some blighted area's in the world.

Chashio
07-21-2014, 06:04 PM
Ah, well, I like the variation. It works well. And... that is huge.

TimPaul
07-24-2014, 06:40 PM
I got all the geographical features in place. I'm mostly satisified with this for the base.

I plan to do all the symbols and text with InDesign. One of my goals is to have a layered PDF that you can turn the names and locations on and off. So you can see different things. Like laylines, shipping routes, over land routes, and more.

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Chashio
07-24-2014, 07:56 PM
That's beautiful, Tim. One small suggestion, though... If I'm reading it correctly. The cliff that spans the southern continent to the south of the lake is difficult to interpret, at this size anyway, and it could perhaps use a slight shadow. Something to keep in mind at any rate.

TimPaul
07-25-2014, 05:25 AM
That's beautiful, Tim. One small suggestion, though... If I'm reading it correctly. The cliff that spans the southern continent to the south of the lake is difficult to interpret, at this size anyway, and it could perhaps use a slight shadow. Something to keep in mind at any rate.

It was meant to have a shadow, just missed it. Thanks for noticing. And thanks for layers.

TimPaul
07-28-2014, 10:54 AM
Ok, started naming all the things over the weekend. Got this far. So much more to go.

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Chashio
07-28-2014, 12:05 PM
Thoughts that came to mind looking at your newest picture: I like the font... simple, effective. The smaller labels with the white outlines are hard to read... Forest and Woods labels are especially difficult... maybe change/thicken the base color, get rid of the white outline. The Karmorth Valley label in white on top of the evergreens stands out nicely. I had to look at the lake to guess at the Kettermoor R. label. I'm not sure why you decided to slant some of the labels of localized terrain features (Reybrook Marsh, Rymoor Hills). It's easier to read the black Reybrook Marsh label than it is the Moaning Quag. Hmm... Maybe instead of outlining the forest labels, fade/scratch out the trees beneath them (and any overlapping labels: Blencathra, Moressley, Shoreham Castle). Some things to think about, anyway.

TimPaul
07-28-2014, 12:15 PM
You aren't seeing it at full size and resolution. I can't post it that big, as there's a file size limitation. And nothing is 100% final yet. I stylize things, then go back and re evaluate.

Chashio
07-28-2014, 03:58 PM
You aren't seeing it at full size and resolution.

Ah. That does indeed change things somewhat.

TimPaul
07-28-2014, 05:00 PM
Ah. That does indeed change things somewhat.

But thanks for the feedback.

J.Edward
07-28-2014, 07:53 PM
Wonderful work Tim. I personally really like the subdued color palette as it allows the chosen colors to pop that much more.
I think what you're doing with the conifers and deciduous forest is great. I like the spacing with the conifers. If they were as close together as the deciduous trees then they would be too hard to see.
I do agree with Chashio about the stroke on the smaller lettering. Are you working in Photoshop? If so, what setting do you have on the font - none, sharp, crisp, strong, smooth. Sometimes changing that on smaller text makes a big difference in clarity. Also, going with a bit smaller stroke number can help. Another thing is the strong contrast between the two makes the difficulty more pronounced. An off white with a bit darker charcoal grey may read better.

One other question, do you foresee doing some slight texture on the inland bodies of water? Lakes and such? It would look good.

All that said - I love your work here. Really great stuff. :D

TimPaul
07-30-2014, 09:33 AM
Wonderful work Tim. I personally really like the subdued color palette as it allows the chosen colors to pop that much more.
I think what you're doing with the conifers and deciduous forest is great. I like the spacing with the conifers. If they were as close together as the deciduous trees then they would be too hard to see.
I do agree with Chashio about the stroke on the smaller lettering. Are you working in Photoshop? If so, what setting do you have on the font - none, sharp, crisp, strong, smooth. Sometimes changing that on smaller text makes a big difference in clarity. Also, going with a bit smaller stroke number can help. Another thing is the strong contrast between the two makes the difficulty more pronounced. An off white with a bit darker charcoal grey may read better.

One other question, do you foresee doing some slight texture on the inland bodies of water? Lakes and such? It would look good.

All that said - I love your work here. Really great stuff. :D


Thanks. Keep in mind, this is all a work in progress, and nothing is ever final at this stage.

Looking back, I agree some of the white outlines aren't working, so I went in and changed them. I formalized the size of text and made everything bolder, so it read easier.

In some area's I'll be softening the details behind the text, but that comes later, once I have made choices. There's no sense in doing a lot of extra work that I'm going to have to change or remove later.

I have experimented with texture on the small inland lakes and decided against it. It ended up looking to much like a hole in the land. Maybe some slight texture would prevent that, but for now, I think i'm fine with how they are.

TimPaul
08-18-2014, 02:23 PM
More work, and some background on my large fantasy world map (http://www.timpaulmaps.com/the-kingdom-of-gyles/).

Click on the link to see and read more.

Diamond
08-19-2014, 12:06 AM
Looking awesome, dude. You've got a typo in 'Valley of the Wyvern'.

TimPaul
08-19-2014, 05:37 AM
Looking awesome, dude. You've got a typo in 'Valley of the Wyvern'.

NooooOOOOooOOOOOooo

Well, time to start over then! :P ;)

Diamond
08-19-2014, 11:29 AM
I know, it's all ruined now. :D

syris
08-19-2014, 07:34 PM
Beautiful map...lots of detail, but plenty of space for everything to breathe. Love the frozen region with the icy island perimeters...(note to self, do that when I get to the frozen areas of my own map).