PDA

View Full Version : Map of Serth



mad_computer_user
09-25-2008, 07:34 PM
Hi

I have recently started work on my first map made entirely in photoshop. It is a map of Serth, the world that my horror RPG takes place in.

What iv done:
drawn outline
put on parchment

Still to do:
add mountains
add forest
add places
add labels
add measure
add compass

Image:
http://i357.photobucket.com/albums/oo11/Deadly-Poison-Studios/V-WoH.png

Any C&C on what i can change/improve would be appreciated

thanks
Keeghan

Steel General
09-25-2008, 08:28 PM
The weathered parchment is fantastic, and it looks like the paper is sitting on a slightly tilted blotter or something. Looking forward to seeing more.

Vernon
09-25-2008, 08:38 PM
The paper is top notch.

mad_computer_user
09-25-2008, 09:02 PM
thanks guys, im a bit worried about the coast lines, they just look a bit, odd, what do you kind people think?

Patrakis
09-25-2008, 09:26 PM
The coast lines is on apr with the fact that it's sitting on an old, weathered piece of parchment. One could deduce that it was done in a time when knowledge of cartography was at it begining. This would be a very nice handout to the players i think.

Pat

mmmmmpig
09-25-2008, 09:30 PM
I think the coast lines could use some smoothing. They seem to be almost pixelated and blocky. Zoom way the hell in and smooth the buggers out. Also I would suggest some line width variation as well. That might authentic it up a bit as well.

Great parchment texture though.

mad_computer_user
09-26-2008, 03:36 AM
smoothing... yes, good idea, ill try that, and its pixelated, because... i enlarged it, about 300% from its origanal to put it onto parchment :) and ;line width varyation, as in, make some parts of the line thicker? ok, i guess that would make it look for like it was drawn with a calligraphy pen, i have a reall dip pen blah blah thing, so ill spend a bi of time drawing lines, and see what they look like, and try recreate it :) thankls everyone for the encoraging words

MountZionRyan
09-26-2008, 12:03 PM
It almost looks "stretched" left-right. I think this is because all the long lines are horizontal.

Some suggestions
-Turn the peninsula in the upper left corner 90 deg. so that it has a vertical orientation
-Do the same with some of the islands.
-Or, scale the whole thing down so that it is narrower.

Or do what your creative inner eye tells you to do and ignore this stranger. ;-)

Jkaen
09-26-2008, 12:17 PM
The only thing that strikes me as a bit odd is that really long canal to the east of the mainland, I can't think of what sort of plate movement would have formed that.

Karro
09-26-2008, 05:00 PM
I agree with the pixelation issue... smooth it out, but I'd suggest also finding points to blur it a little, have it fade into the parchment. On something with ancient (and great) looking parchment like this, the writing on the parchment would be very weathered-looking as well. Probably some bleeding of the ink, if you can manage it, as well.

mad_computer_user
09-26-2008, 06:59 PM
It almost looks "stretched" left-right. I think this is because all the long lines are horizontal.

Some suggestions
-Turn the peninsula in the upper left corner 90 deg. so that it has a vertical orientation
-Do the same with some of the islands.
-Or, scale the whole thing down so that it is narrower.

Or do what your creative inner eye tells you to do and ignore this stranger. ;-)
Iv edited the map, spun 2 islands round, and the peice of land, nice quick job :) thought it would be harder than it was


The only thing that strikes me as a bit odd is that really long canal to the east of the mainland, I can't think of what sort of plate movement would have formed that.
Played The Elder Scrolls, or looked at its map? heres the map:
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t261/crpggeek/TamrielMap.jpg
i got the idea from there


I agree with the pixelation issue... smooth it out, but I'd suggest also finding points to blur it a little, have it fade into the parchment. On something with ancient (and great) looking parchment like this, the writing on the parchment would be very weathered-looking as well. Probably some bleeding of the ink, if you can manage it, as well.
I have blured some parts, made it fade(heaps in some areas) and im working on a technique to create bleeding ink, but im not sure how to smooth/get rid of pixelation, any ideas?

mad_computer_user
09-26-2008, 07:24 PM
oops, forgot to post image of the map, here it is:
http://i357.photobucket.com/albums/oo11/Deadly-Poison-Studios/V-WoH3.png

NeonKnight
09-26-2008, 08:05 PM
Google-fu............HeeeeeeeeeeeeYAH!


http://images.google.ca/images?hl=en&q=antique+maps&btnG=Search+Images&gbv=2

There are literally hundreds of excelent images and styles of antique maps there for perusal.

If you are going for that ancient/antique view those would give you a good start.

The next set of images (except for the clothing :roll:) are some examples of some ancient nautical charts.

http://images.google.ca/images?gbv=2&hl=en&q=ancient+nautical+chart&btnG=Search+Images

and

http://images.google.ca/images?gbv=2&hl=en&q=antique+naval+map&btnG=Search+Images

One of my personal favs is this one:

http://www.fomar.org/235E.jpg

Gamerprinter
09-26-2008, 10:49 PM
i enlarged it, about 300% from its origanal to put it onto parchment

Never do that. If that's a hand-drawing you started with, just scan it at higher resolution, so you don't have to enlarge to fit the parchment. You can always reduce from a high resolution down to a lesser one. You'll only get problems doing it the other way around.

Otherwise, I see a nice start and no ones given you any "Rep" yet, so I did.

GP

mad_computer_user
09-26-2008, 11:01 PM
YAY rep :) thanks man. and its not hand drawn, i made it in photoshop, but made it to small, i wanted a larger map, so i just enlarged it. I think i still have the ORIGANAL psd file, which if i enlarge, wont matter... though, ill need to then redo the:
blur
fading
rotating of land

but that will only take about 20 mins, ill do that.

EDIT: BLURGH!!! i dont have the file any more :(:(:( not fair... hmm, what shall i do? i could redraw, but i like it the way it is, what do you people think?

mmmmmpig
09-27-2008, 12:04 AM
I think you want to be careful about the blurring of the lines in random areas. The reason I say this is now you have established areas that need to be aged as you set about each task on the map.

I like the parchment background, but I would make my map as close to what it would have looked like "new" and then age the entire map.

You are correct, "Line variation" is basically the width of line. To get a consistent feel to it, select a slightly oval brush in PS to do your line work.

I am interested in seeing where this goes

mad_computer_user
09-27-2008, 12:17 AM
good point :( BLURG im doing it all wrong :( i should probably just, start again, step one, and not do any blurring etc. Then just once its done, add bluring/aging etc

mmmmmpig
09-27-2008, 12:38 AM
good point :( BLURG im doing it all wrong :( i should probably just, start again, step one, and not do any blurring etc. Then just once its done, add bluring/aging etc

Nope, not doing it "wrong." That is being rather hard on oneself for their first PS map. Are you very familiar with PS? Do you do tons of other work with the raster beast and have just now decided to try out a map? I shudder to remember the number of times I had to start over in PS for the first graphic I did on it.

Unfortunately, with PS, I have found the best way to learn is to screw up and start again.

mad_computer_user
09-27-2008, 01:18 AM
Are you very familiar with PS? Do you do tons of other work with the raster beast and have just now decided to try out a map?
thats me, apart from the tonnes part, i do do a fair amount of stuff though

i could just start again :( but that would be so PAINFULL

mmmmmpig
09-27-2008, 01:34 AM
Well... if you are familiar with it... I would suggest only erasing the line areas that need to be re-worked, create a new layer and have a merry old time of it. :) I only see seven areas that needed re-touched. Easy Peasy Lemon Squeezy. If you have already merge down onto the parchment, just copy and past the parchment image into a new background layer and threshold select the blacks to be painted on a new layer.

anytime you are doing mapping in Illustrator or PS (most likely with GIMP or Inkscape as well) layers are your best friends, while my maps are still WiP's I can easily have 20 to 30 layers going on. I always copy layers and preserve an un-touched version until I get the effect I want. I also end up having multiple versions of files. Typically I save with a new file name at critical moments. Only when I am "done" do I delete and merge all the redundant crap. Saves a bunch of heartache in the end. These days I rarely have to re-start from scratch.

mad_computer_user
09-27-2008, 06:16 PM
everything is on layers, and i have saved different files(thank fully) ill go through and retouch up some areas, or, this map i could just do small, i do have a file of it small

mad_computer_user
09-27-2008, 09:00 PM
ok, well, i have just decided that the map will have to be small, i have plotted everything now, except for places, but all the rivers, and mountains, and forests, and swamps are there. Plus i added the measure and the compass, next i shall make all the colour plots actual images, then add towns, then labels, then age it, and its done, YAY. Heres the map:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3271/2896809208_361a6e192e_o.png

mad_computer_user
09-28-2008, 07:12 PM
here we go, i have now added in the symbols, all i need to do now, is add places and labels, and age it. image:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3292/2896818764_8a581dd6c2_o.png

mmmmmpig
09-28-2008, 07:36 PM
keep them coming

mad_computer_user
09-29-2008, 02:09 AM
thats a bit hard... now that i FINISHED THE MAP! ok, maybe the exitment level is a bit high, but it is my first PS map, so it may be allowed, lol. Anyway, enough of my rambling, im kinda still in blog (http://my-cartography.blogspot.com/)ing mode(the link goes to my cartography blog) so im rambling alot. heres the map:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3010/2898034178_113868e981_o.png

please post your thoughts and constructive critiscism on the map and what i can change/fix

delgondahntelius
09-29-2008, 05:13 AM
looking good for a first PS map :) better than any of my first time PS maps could have been...

mad_computer_user
09-29-2008, 06:45 AM
thanks, its really appreciated

Karro
09-29-2008, 02:57 PM
It does look pretty good. You did a great job of cleaning up the pixelated lines. And the ink-bleed is pretty good effect.

Points of mild criticism: I think the blurring is a bit much (I know, I also suggested you do some blurring!)... I'd try a narrower range on the blur, and supplement it with a few extra very narrow range ink-bleeds. In other words... have the blur and ink-bleed only go out a handful of pixels.

Also, a hand-drawn style map would probably have more variety in the types of symbols used for mountains and trees. This can usually be accomplished in some easy way, both in PS and GIMP, but I'm not positive on the method used for PS. Basically, there's some way of using a brush that alternates between several different tree symbols, for instance, to provide variety to a forest or several mountain symbols to provide variety to a mountain range. If you have enough symbols (I'm thinking about 5-ish, but this is only a gut instict), it truly amps-up the hand-drawn look.

Anyway, great job!

delgondahntelius
09-29-2008, 03:19 PM
It does look pretty good. You did a great job of cleaning up the pixelated lines. And the ink-bleed is pretty good effect.

Points of mild criticism: I think the blurring is a bit much (I know, I also suggested you do some blurring!)... I'd try a narrower range on the blur, and supplement it with a few extra very narrow range ink-bleeds. In other words... have the blur and ink-bleed only go out a handful of pixels.

Also, a hand-drawn style map would probably have more variety in the types of symbols used for mountains and trees. This can usually be accomplished in some easy way, both in PS and GIMP, but I'm not positive on the method used for PS. Basically, there's some way of using a brush that alternates between several different tree symbols, for instance, to provide variety to a forest or several mountain symbols to provide variety to a mountain range. If you have enough symbols (I'm thinking about 5-ish, but this is only a gut instict), it truly amps-up the hand-drawn look.

Anyway, great job!

Unlike Gimp, PS doesn't have a way to actually alternate through several brushes, one of the GIMP features I really wish that PS had. But you can get an effect similiar, it just uses the same brush.

Since those are ISO forests and Mountains, you mainly just have to keep loading brushes over and over.... the easiest way to do this is when (for example) you do your forest, load only the brushes you want to use for it, 4 or 5 should do. In brush tip shape, set your spacing out so that your symbols spread next to each other but not overlap. In Shape Dynamics set your Size jitter to about 65% (set it to pen pressure if you have a stylus. If not, just leave it off) Set the minimum up to where you feel the smallest you want the trees (around 25% should do). Now, LOCK the lock next to Shape dynamics. These settings will keep as you rotate thru brushes. You can play around with the scatter as well, but it isn't necessary, if you do, make sure you lock it too.

Now, go to the map and start brushing in your trees, as you go you can easily switch brushes by using the last brush hot key "," and next brush "."

If you don't want them to bunch up together and you prefer to 'place' symbols like in CC3, just set your dynamics to Fade with a value of 1, and set your minimum diamater to 0% ... They will jitter through the sizes still as you tap your brush down.

Hope that helps :D

mad_computer_user
09-29-2008, 06:05 PM
i have actually worked out how to use multiple brushes in PhotoShop, its quite simple, i can make a tutorial for it if you want... and i tried making the mountains and forests slightly varied by using the size and roundness jitter settings already, maybe its not enough though...

ravells
09-29-2008, 06:41 PM
This is great! Now the next step is to try your hand (using the same techniques and perhaps a couple more) at a more intricate map.

Think you're up to it?

I think you are!

Ravs

Redrobes
09-29-2008, 06:58 PM
Hi Mad,

I wrote a big tutorial about resampling and why its a good idea to do maps big and resample down to final size. I also wrote it leaving a space for a topic that comes up time and time again but I never had time to fill it in so I just did as its about how to resample images that are just B&W up - say by 300% or so ;)

What you need to do if you have lost the original is to separate the dark from the paper which is not so hard to do with some judicious use of brightness and contrast and that should leave you with black on white line art.

See #13 of this thread...
http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?t=2596

for what to do to get that 300% bigger with no jaggies. But the better way is to resample down from a big original.

Hope that helps.

mad_computer_user
09-29-2008, 08:18 PM
This is great! Now the next step is to try your hand (using the same techniques and perhaps a couple more) at a more intricate map.

Think you're up to it?

I think you are!

Ravs

i dont think im really up to it, but its good to hear others do :D so im going to try. In fact, im going to try redo this map, and make it bigger(alot) and better(hopefully).

thanks redrobes for that

delgondahntelius
09-29-2008, 08:40 PM
i have actually worked out how to use multiple brushes in PhotoShop, its quite simple, i can make a tutorial for it if you want... and i tried making the mountains and forests slightly varied by using the size and roundness jitter settings already, maybe its not enough though...

Sorry.. didn't mean to give ya a tutorial on how to use a brush. Sometimes its hard to get out of STEP>BY>STEP mode....

You could always sketch a forest (or mountains) out and create a seamless pattern, then use your masks to brush them into/out of the areas you need. Even using a couple on different layers, this can work to great effect on parchment maps....

mad_computer_user
09-29-2008, 09:01 PM
no problem about the step by step tut thing, i wasnt trying to give you a hard time or anything, i actually appreciated your small tut, i didnt know about the lock feature, i always was having to reset it, which got annoying, i was just saying what i knew. I did do a tut on making those patterns for both mountains and forests and any other symbol that needs to be like that, it was on YouTube, i would do that, except i have NO artistic ability whatsoever :( which is sad

mad_computer_user
09-29-2008, 09:39 PM
I have decided to remake this map, alot bigger, and, hopefully, alot better, this time i have made my own custom parchment, and redrawn the outline, thats what iv done sofar on it, ill post a new thread soon for it

EDIT: here is the version 2 thread link (http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?t=3045)