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RPMiller
05-08-2007, 11:35 AM
I'm currently considering buying a tablet to switch to for doing all my graphic and 3D "art" (I use quotes as it is a far cry from being worthy of the title), and I'm hoping to get some good advice and tips regarding the idea.

I've heard nothing but good things regarding using a tablet and so I'm pretty much sold on the idea however I am curious about a couple bad things I've heard that makes a mouse sound better.

The stylus wears out within a years time of use.
If you don't get the right size tablet for your needs it will frustrate you.
They are very expensive.
If you don't have the right calibration software they won't work right.

In addition I've heard that Wacom is "The" only tablet you should consider buying.

Now I actually have some experience with a tablet, but it used a puck not a stylus and I was using this full time as an AutoCAD draftsman for an engineering company. However this was a very specialized application and tablet and wasn't a stylus so I don't feel it is entirely accurate for my analysis.

So, what can folks tell me about the points and comments above, and does anyone know of any great deals out there that I might be able to take advantage of?

EDIT: I just wanted to mention a couple things as I've seen a couple posts directed at me. You'll notice that this thread was started many years ago. I bought an Wacom Intous a few years ago based on comments from back then. Please feel free to continue commenting on this thread to help others that may have similar questions. In fact, I've posted to this thread a few times in the past about various deals and specials that I've found. There are also some great pointers scattered throughout the comments about what to look for when you decide to get a tablet yourself.

ravells
05-08-2007, 03:32 PM
I bought my tablet after people swore by them. I don't use it as much as I should - mainly through laziness. It's generally when I need to use freehand strokes the tablet comes into its own, but for general menu selection actions, I'm more comfortable with the mouse.

I've got an A4 Wacom, but in terms of the amount of room it takes up on the desk, I think I would have got an A5 in retrospect.

Hope this helps.

Ravs

pyrandon
05-08-2007, 07:53 PM
I bought a Wacom tablet after giving myself carpal tunnel making my first PS map, and I absolutely love it! I now sketch, draw, map, etc. etc. etc. with it. So much more convenient.

I have not had really any technical difficulties--but I've only had the tablet for a few months now, so who knows about the future.

I did cheap out & bu the smallest, least sensitive tablet, & I have not been disappointed. It cost under $100 at Best Buy, and I really enjoy it. I say go for it if you can afford it. A neat toy!

Arcana
05-09-2007, 08:01 AM
I traded a double-bass pedal from my old drumset for a 9" Wacom Intuos 3...Its quite awesome, I agree with the minor inconvenience of having to plug it in occasionally and laziness preventing me from doing so sometimes...But when I REALLY need it its there for me and it helps...layout your desk properly switching from tablet to mouse for menu work isn't that big of a deal though...and remember the tablet often comes with a mouse that works on its surface you can quickly swap to.

I've never had a problem with tips personally, but I'm not very heavy handed, and the Intuos line comes with extras and multiple types...you can also buy replacements anyways.

The Intuos lines have a quick scroller that I use for zooming with a slide of the finger...it also has buttons that represent shift, alt, ctrl, and space...which makes a lot of photoshop functions pretty easy.

You can map the drawing area to portions of your screen so if you want to maximize yoru drawing space thats easy too. Overall I guarantee you that the benefits will FAR outweigh any drawbacks, and yes Wacom is THE only tablet to buy. I have a 12" at work and love it.

RPMiller
05-09-2007, 11:37 AM
Thanks for the info guys! If anyone else has anything to contribute, Keith I'm talking to you, :wink: , it will be a little while before I get one unless I can find a good deal on the 'net somewhere.

RobA
05-09-2007, 10:34 PM
I was inspired by this so I checked my local CraigsList ..... and found an unused Wacom Graphire 6x8 for $100CDN. I'll be picking it up tomorrow after work :)

It's no Intuos, but then I didn't have a double-bass pedal to trade :wink:

-Rob A>

RPMiller
05-09-2007, 11:30 PM
Congrats!! Now if only I can find a similar deal... I have a friend that has a digital drum set I wonder if he would miss it if parts started disappearing? ;)

No I wouldn't do that! Sheesh!

RobA
05-15-2007, 04:11 PM
Well I got my Wacom Graphire 6x8 and it works great.

I did have to play to get it working with my multimonitor setup, and I cant find a setting to use it in portrait mode like my LCD monitor (which rotates).

It is really neat, like for example I can take the GIMP random building brush and have it vary the size by the pressure I apply.

NOW.....Any suggestion on the best way to learn to use it? Is is definitely a different beast than the mouse, yet not quire as intuitive as drawing on paper. Guess I have to relearn my hand eye coordination.

-Rob A>

Latharion
05-16-2007, 05:34 AM
I owned a Wacom Intuos 9x12 tablet until recently. I bought a house and the desk I was using wouldn't fit through the doorways. The desk I use at the moment is much too small for a large tablet so I sold it. I loved the tablet though. I used it for photoshop projects, CC2 projects, and 3D Studio Max projects. I really found that I preferred the tactile feel of the pen much better than a mouse for those applications. I still used my trusty MS Wireless mouse for most Windows activities though. I do miss that tablet.

Congratulations on your recent aquisition.

For me, there wasn't a large learning curve. I'd say just pick a photoshop project and use the tablet with it till you get the feel of the tablet. The only thing that threw me was the need to "tap" the pen to "click". I kept wanting to drag the pen around on the tablet to move the cursor, but you only need to hover over the tablet. It takes a bit of getting used to, but I felt the payoff was worth it. Have fun with your new tablet!

pyrandon
05-16-2007, 09:06 AM
Ditto on Latharion's comments. I found it highly distracting for about 2 days, then (and now) it's like 2nd nature. You'll love it!

MittenNinja
05-18-2007, 01:06 PM
I picked up one of the smaller cheaper wacoms about 8 months ago and I have yet to find any problems with it whatsoever. The tip is still in nearly perfect condition, so unless these people are really pressing down hard on the thing I can't see it wearing down too fast. Picked it up for about $100 and now I actually use it for everything on my computer with the exception of gaming.

P.S. For a fun time try playing Counterstirke (or any first person shooter for that matter) with a tablet.

palehorse
05-28-2007, 09:22 AM
My wife and I picked up one of the first generation Graphire ET's back when they first came out. (I couldn't even tell you how many years ago that was, but it was before our son was born, so over 5 years.) They're great; we've never had any trouble with it. And we're still using the same stylus it shipped with.

RobA
05-28-2007, 10:08 AM
I only have one issue so far. I move the pen when clicking the tip down, so to use it as a "mouse" is a pain. i.e. clicking on a link in a web browser doesn't always work, as it is seen as a click-drag. There doesn't seem to be a way to adjust the sensitivity of that, either (that I can find).

I did map one of the buttons to a middle click, so I can use that to put application into "scroll mode" to pan about.

I think I have found a good way to work now. I have a dual screen configuration (notebook at 1400x1050) and LCD as an extended screen to he right at 1024x1280 (it is rotated). I have the graphire mouse set to be in mouse mode, and lets me cover the full to screens, and I have the pen set to map to my notebook screen only, to get better accuracy and control with it.

That does mean that I change between mouse and pen, depending on what I am doing, but it works for me so far...

-Rob A>

Arcana
05-28-2007, 12:26 PM
I have my pen buttons mapped to [ and ] which allows me to quickly change brush sizes while working. Its VERY convenient. I also make heavy heavy use of the scroll strip and the alt-shift-ctrl-space buttons...the space button makes panning around my work easy.

palehorse
05-28-2007, 02:01 PM
I have my pen buttons mapped to [ and ] which allows me to quickly change brush sizes while working. Its VERY convenient. I also make heavy heavy use of the scroll strip and the alt-shift-ctrl-space buttons...the space button makes panning around my work easy.

Yeah, I remapped the front-click on my stylus to the Space Bar, because I pan a lot but I pretty much never right-click in Photoshop. Then I can just Alt-click and Ctrl-click on the stylus to zoom in and out while I'm at it.

RobA
05-28-2007, 02:36 PM
Yeah -

Unfortunately there are no additional buttons or a scroll strip on the graphire series :(

Though I can use the scroll strip on my notepad touch-pad simultaneous to using the tablet.

-Rob A>

RPMiller
06-12-2007, 04:17 PM
For anyone that might be interested:

http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=WP5540

I'm not sure how good DigiPro is, but for $50 is it worth it?

Hoseman
06-12-2007, 07:59 PM
There is not a lot of info out there on the DigiPro (made by Taiwanese company UC-Logic) but what I found was positive. You won't get the tilt sensitivity of the Intuos 3 (the Graphire doesn't have it either) but other than that I've read they're functionally similar. Same sensitivity levels, etc. And unlike Arcana (he's a little trendy still...makes good money and no kids yet :wink: ) and some others, I DON'T think the Wacom is the only real choice. This seems to be put together pretty well. For the price, might be a perfect tablet for a beginner or hobbyist.

Dang, I think I convinced myself! I might buy one soon, just to see what you get for the money. However, I'll probably scour Ebay for a really good deal (although its cheap enough at retail prices to make that almost unnecessary). If it will quell the carps in my tunnels, then it might be worth it.

RPMiller
07-13-2007, 11:35 AM
Not necessarily a tool for our 2D needs, but as a 3D tool.... Woot!

It starts at $59 US.

http://www.3dconnexion.com/

RPMiller
12-12-2007, 12:34 AM
Ok, so I found out today that I am getting a sizable bonus from work. I think it is time to get myself a Christmas present. Let's just say that money is not really an object, but I don't want to get something I'll only use a couple features of.

So, what do all you experienced tablet users recommend model wise? I'm getting a Wacom so we don't need to worry about brand, but I need to know which model and also what dimension to get.

Basic usage guidelines:

There is a good chance I'll be mobile with the tablet, but I don't want to set that as a restriction yet.
I'll be using it with PhotoShop, Poser, Bryce, Carrera, MapTool and hopefully other standard applications.
I'll be using it for hand drawing stuff as well as using vector based programs.

The Cartographist
12-12-2007, 05:25 AM
I've had a WACOM for about seven months. My only suggestion would be to get as big as you are comfortable putting on your desk (or lap for that matter). I typically only pull it out when I'm drawing, and I typically re-arrange the desk slightly (by pushing the keyboard further away so that typing on it almost becomes irritating) in order to have the tablet right in front of me.

One comment: It takes some getting used to (hand-eye issues), but once that is resolved, you will never go back.

RPMiller
12-12-2007, 01:09 PM
I'm not too concerned about the hand-eye issues. I was a CAD draftsman for many years and used a puck for many of those so I'm expecting those old muscles to reactivate. ;)

RobA
12-12-2007, 03:02 PM
Well if prive is really not an option...

http://www.wacom.com/cintiq/21UX.cfm

at $2500USD MSRP.

-Rob A>

The Cartographist
12-12-2007, 05:16 PM
Well, right on, with that:

http://www.wacom.com/cintiq/21UX.cfm

at $2500USD MSRP.


...Now all I have to do is find one at 1/10th the cost.

RPMiller
12-12-2007, 05:57 PM
Well if prive is really not an option...

http://www.wacom.com/cintiq/21UX.cfm

at $2500USD MSRP.

-Rob A>


Well, right on, with that:

http://www.wacom.com/cintiq/21UX.cfm

at $2500USD MSRP.


...Now all I have to do is find one at 1/10th the cost.
While I could buy that, I don't think I will. As I mentioned, I don't want to go overboard and get something that I won't use all the features of. Even the next model down would be overkill I think not to mention I wouldn't want to lug that and a laptop around.

What I'm looking more for are recommendations of features and use. For example, if you have one, are you satisfied with it or do you wish you got a different model and why?

RPMiller
12-12-2007, 06:50 PM
After researching and reading for about the last hour and a half I think I'm going to go with this one:
http://direct.wacom.com/stores/5/Intuos3_6x11_Special_Edition_P1222C83.cfm

That way I can also get the new version of PhotoShop and still pay off my Christmas present debt.

Does anyone have an Intous3 and what do they think of it? Is it worth getting over the Graphire?

ravells
12-12-2007, 07:08 PM
I have an intuous (not sure if it's a 3) but as I've never had a graphire, I can't compare...sorry!

RPMiller
12-12-2007, 08:10 PM
I have an intuous (not sure if it's a 3) but as I've never had a graphire, I can't compare...sorry!
No worries. Just tell me what you think of your Intous. ;)

ravells
12-13-2007, 05:23 AM
I love it. Mine is A4 sized. If you want to do fine art stuff with long strokes then a bigger tablet is better. If not, then you can use a smaller one (e.g. A5 sized). As The Cartographist (whom I shall from now refer to as TC to save my poor typing fingers) said, if you get a bigger tablet you need space on the table for it and it means pushing the keyboard elsewhere. A smaller tablet is less of a problem.

RobA
12-13-2007, 08:32 AM
Does anyone have an Intous3 and what do they think of it? Is it worth getting over the Graphire?

Found this comparison site that looks good: http://graphicssoft.about.com/od/aboutgraphics/ss/intuosgraphire.htm

The I being considered a professional tool, and the G being a casual/prosumer tool, the big differences (I over G) are (picked from the referenced site):
- Higher resolution results in smoother, more precise cursor movements.
- Double the pressure sensitivity.
- Tilt sensitivity.
- 4 ExpressKeys (versus 2 on Graphire4).
- Touch Strip (versus finger-operated scroll wheel on Graphire4).
- A wide-format 6x11 size is available for multiple monitor and widescreen display users. (which would overcome my previous comment on the graphire)

-Rob A>

Valarian
12-13-2007, 09:33 AM
My wife has an A5 (Wacom) pad. I could never get to grips with it due to the pad controlling the cursor even at a distance from the surface of the pad. Personally, I'd like a pad that didn't have this, but only had cursor control when touched to the pad surface. Ideally, pen thickness would be controlled by pressure of the stylus on the pad. Are there any pads like this, or do they all work on the hover mode?

RobA
12-13-2007, 09:38 AM
Pressure sensitivity is a function of the software. AFAIK, all of the wacoms support this if set up. Only angle sensitivity is a feature of the higher end models. Though A5 is the size, not the model... is it a Graphire or an Intuos?

-Rob A>

Valarian
12-13-2007, 09:40 AM
I would think a Graphire, it's a fairly basic model. The major issue I had with it was the float over the surface control of the cursor. I hated it. I want a tablet that only works when pen hits the surface. I couldn't find anything in the settings to stop this.

ravells
12-13-2007, 09:57 AM
I think the problem is that touching the surface simulates a left mouse click and all the software that supports tablets uses that convention.

Valarian
12-13-2007, 10:01 AM
Sounds like I just won't get on with any tablet then. I just want something that works like pen and paper.

ravells
12-13-2007, 10:07 AM
I found the tablet really awkward for the first couple of weeks, but once I got used to it, it was just magic. I tend to use it when I need to do freehand work, but I'll still use the mouse when dealing with menus and such.

Valarian
12-13-2007, 10:18 AM
Don't think I've got the patience for two weeks, after two hours I was ready to throw the stylus through the screen.

RobA
12-13-2007, 10:55 AM
Really depends on the use - I never use the pen for vector work cause I can not come up with any way to make it NOT move when I click by pressing the tip down.

But for sketching type work, I honestly can't say anyting bad about it :)

-Rob A>

RPMiller
12-13-2007, 11:47 AM
Since I don't know the difference between an A5 or A6 size, I'll post the specifics of the tablet. Also, do you all think I need the extra tips and pen that come with the Special Edition? It is only $30 more so I figure it is probably worth it.

Intuos3 6x11 Special Edition
In celebration of Wacom's 25th Anniversary, the Intuos3 6x11 Special Edition offers a new metallic black color color scheme, additional Classic pen, additional transparant overlay, and a professional accessory kit. With a cool new look and valuable accessories, the Intuos3 SE promises to bring the work of digital content creation to a new level of enjoyment for the serious designer, photographer, and artist.

Each Package Includes:
Intuos3 SE 6x11 pen tablet
Grip Pen
Classic Pen
Transparent overlay
Pen stand
Professional accessory kit (includes: 5 Standard nibs, 5 Felt nibs, 5 Stroke nibs, 5 Flex nibs, an alternate Pen Grip without sideswitch holes, a nib removal tool, and a replacement side switch)
Five-button mouse
Application software DVD
Driver CD with electronic hardware manual
Quick Start Guide and access to Wacom Privileges for valuable partner offers

RPMiller
12-13-2007, 11:48 AM
My wife has an A5 (Wacom) pad. I could never get to grips with it due to the pad controlling the cursor even at a distance from the surface of the pad. Personally, I'd like a pad that didn't have this, but only had cursor control when touched to the pad surface. Ideally, pen thickness would be controlled by pressure of the stylus on the pad. Are there any pads like this, or do they all work on the hover mode?
Hm... That could be frustrating... Do the rest of you see this behavior as being true with your setups?

ravells
12-13-2007, 12:15 PM
That's how they're supposed to work, Rob!

As to the kit you're buying that's pretty much the kit I've got. Heavy users say that the pentips stop working or break after two years or so, so I think I'll get a least 5 years out of mine. One of the nibs is an 'airbrush' nib which is spring loaded. i didn't get the transparent overlay, but I suspect it's just a piece of acetate. They one you are getting is the A4 sized one which is the largest practical size (imo), the other one we are talking about (A5) is half the size of the A4.

RPMiller
12-13-2007, 12:43 PM
Got ya. It will definitely take some getting used to. My puck experience was it only worked when placed on the surface and a button pressed, but I don't think this will be a problem once I get used to the way the input works.

Regarding size, do you think the 6x11 might be too big? All my monitors are wide screen formats so I wanted to match that format with the tablet which sounded like good advice and I wanted to get something close to the size of a page so that I could do tracings and such.

ravells
12-13-2007, 01:12 PM
If you want to use it for tracing then get the big one.

RPMiller
12-13-2007, 01:28 PM
By big one, you are referring to the current 6x11 I mentioned?

ravells
12-13-2007, 03:04 PM
Yes, I'm assuming those are dimensions in inches? Although looking at mine, the tablet itself is about 10 inches by 14 inches and the 'active' area 6 inches by 9 inches.

RobA
12-13-2007, 04:18 PM
Professional accessory kit (includes: 5 Standard nibs, 5 Felt nibs, 5 Stroke nibs, 5 Flex nibs, an alternate Pen Grip without sideswitch holes, a nib removal tool, and a replacement side switch)
Five-button mouse


The extra nibs will be nice, as the softer ones do wear. (The graphire does NOT have replaceable nibs, AFAIK)

Consider also that you will use this as a mouse pad as well, using the 5 button mouse on it, so it will park in that location of your desk space.

My graphire is a nice size that fits in my backpack on top of my notebook, so that might be a consideration.

-Rob A>

RPMiller
12-13-2007, 05:54 PM
Very good! Yes, portability is definitely a consideration, and the one I'm getting has dimensions that will fit in my laptop bag perfectly so I think I'm good to go.

Now I'm just stoked as all get out and can't wait to get my check next week. I might just buy it this weekend and pay off the credit card with the bonus check... yup... that's what I'm going to do. I so can't wait to start playing with it. :D

Thanks to everyone who helped me make the decision even easier and focus on what I really needed. I appreciate the help.

ravells
12-13-2007, 06:31 PM
I've just noticed that the mouse has 5 buttons! I don't use the wacom mouse at all, I find it a bit slow.

RPMiller
12-13-2007, 07:00 PM
Hm... Part of the reason I really liked the idea of getting that mouse was because it is integrated, but I don't like slow. :( Is it battery free as well? I thought that was a feature of both the pen and the mouse that Wacom puts out which is another huge reason why I like that mouse. I'll definitely give you guys a review of the hardware once it arrives in my hot little hands.

ravells
12-13-2007, 07:28 PM
it is battery free.

RobA
12-13-2007, 09:09 PM
I'm not sure what he means by slow...I find it as responsive as the pen.

I just set the mouse to "mouse" mode though, so it tracks like a mouse, rather than mapping each tablet coordinate to a screen coordinate (which is how "pen" mode works).

-Rob A>

RPMiller
12-13-2007, 09:17 PM
Ah, very good to know. Thanks for the info!

ravells
12-14-2007, 06:06 AM
Ah maybe I've got the mouse set to pen mode, maybe that's why it's slow? If I could use the wacom mouse as the default that would mean one fewer wire on the table. I'll look into it tonight.

RPMiller
12-14-2007, 11:42 AM
I ordered it last night!! Woot! It is coming from Washington so I expect it early next week. I can't wait!

RPMiller
12-18-2007, 02:02 AM
The tablet was waiting for me when I got home tonight! Woot! He's a beaut too. I had it up and running with ease and started right in seeing what it could do. Office 2003, PhotoShop and Poser all proved to benefit greatly from the tablet. I had a ton of fun actually writing in Word and watching it get converted to text as I went. PhotoShop is going to take some configuring, but since I have two sets of buttons I basically have 10 different things I can record in plus the pressure settings. It was amazing how intuitive manipulating a 3d image is in Poser when you don't have to translate movements to the mouse and can use a more natural movement of a pen. All in all it was a great starting experience. I'm taking it with me to work tomorrow to get more comfortable with it.

The various issues that were stated above did not ring true for me which I was very relived to discover. It was very intuitive, and I now completely understand why folks were saying they loved their tablets.

Over the next few days, I'll be configuring it for each of the apps it will be used with. I'm particularly curious about Campaign Cartographer 3 and how that will work as the templates I've seen for it assumed a normal aspect ratio whereas my template is widescreen format. I'm hoping that it won't present a problem at all.

pyrandon
12-18-2007, 08:04 PM
Sweeeetness, RP. Now let's see those maps start flowing!! No excuses anymore, buddy! ;)

RPMiller
12-19-2007, 01:20 PM
Yea, but then that means I'll be subjecting you all to my horrible mapping skills. :(( Not to mention my mean and nasty critiques as I rip my map apart. ;)

RPMiller
05-14-2008, 06:14 PM
Here's some interesting news for those of you looking at tablets... They dropped the price for the Cintiq21UX by $500!! Sure... it figures... :( If you want to read the announcement go here:
http://recp.rm05.net/servlet/MailView?ms=MTA3Mzc0MAS2&r=NjEyMjE4NDQwNQS2&j=MTA3OTQ5MjE0S0&mt=1

Airith
08-28-2008, 09:21 PM
I finally bought a tablet, 6x8 and I think it's Genius. Can't wait for it to arrive, since it was off eBay.

loogie
09-02-2008, 11:54 PM
i got a wacom bamboo for my bday, and while sometimes i would like something a bit bigger, its never caused me a great deal of grief... and the size actually comes in handy when i bring it around with my laptop...

as for how it works... i find hand drawing is almost impossible with a mouse... and while i'm only a beginner or average in my artistic ability, i find i can draw things fairly well with the tablet (as accurate as they'd need to be for a map i'd say) i think for serious map making... its almost a must... even just for the pressure sensitivity... the "hand drawn" look its pretty impossible with a mouse, but with a tablet, its a piece of cake...

for you... i'd probably go a bit bigger then a bamboo (5x7) since for real drawing it's usefull to not have to move around to get things right... and if price is not that big of a deal, it'll be worth it in the long run

Airith
09-08-2008, 02:30 AM
Does anyone have any suggestions on how to get used to using the tablet+pen (oh yeah, it finally arrived :)). It's way stranger than a mouse. I've tried using it on a town map I'm making, but it just feels... Awkward? Anyways, a PM will suffice :P

delgondahntelius
09-08-2008, 02:38 AM
Yep. Use it for everything for about a week or two... all your browsing and applications... (you will miss your mouse wheel for sure) so you can get used to where ever the point of that pen hits your tablet ... it hits your desktop/screen .... don't try dragging the cursor like you would a mouse ... pick it up (up.. further) and then place it at the spot you want to hit.... after a while of doing it this way you'll notice you can put that pen tip just about where you want every time....

also... just open up gimp/ps or whatever you favorite application for drawing in, and just doodle away ... don't try to make anything specific (cause if you're like me, it won't start to look like anything recognizable anyway for another couple weeks) just scribble around ... draw some stuff... practice some techniques... get used to pen pressure and what not.... that helps as well...

That's about all the advice I can give ya on it....
(Mine will ((Cross fingers)) arrive tomorrow !!! :) OH and how I've missed having a tablet this last month.... like my hand falling off!!)

Arcana
09-08-2008, 05:39 AM
What I did is worked specifically with images that require a lot of dodge and burn. Set the amount way low and just keep dodging and burning until it looks right...

Do it on duplicated layers so as you improve you can cut away the parts that didn't come out quite right, and build on the ones that did. These non-drawing tools will help you get a feel for the pen without actually doing any drawing...

Del's idea is pretty good sounding too.

RPMiller
09-08-2008, 11:12 AM
Just to toss another piece of advice in. There is a tablet preferences option window that allows you to set all the characteristics of the tablet and pens/mouse. I would encourage you to take a look in there and play with some of the settings to get the feel and action to your liking. Also, you can set the pen to act like a mouse in different applications/windows. I set my pen to be mouse like when I am on the desktop and then act like a pen when I am in certain applications. This allows me to easily work with the applications in a way that I am used to. However, the more I use it the more comfortable I have gotten with the point to point mapping as Del mentioned.

Really the best advice is to do as Arcana and Del said and just use it for everything. I would highly recommend using the "input training applications" that you already have. Solitaire, Mine Sweeper, Free Cell, etc. Games are excellent training tools for learning how to use input devices as you aren't that worried about the "outcome" and they use all the different features of the input device you are using.

RobA
09-08-2008, 11:13 AM
I had found a set of tablet training exercises that I can't locate anymore....

The gist was to render a series of:

horizontal lines, vertical lines, circles

and practice tracing them with the pen.

Then render a grid of dots and play:

1) connect the dots horizontally
2) connect the dots vertically
3) draw an X on each dot
4) circle each dot.

-Rob A>

RobA
09-08-2008, 11:13 AM
I had found a set of tablet training exercises that I can't locate anymore....

The gist was to render a series of:

horizontal lines, vertical lines, circles

and practice tracing them with the pen.

Then render a grid of dots and play:

1) connect the dots horizontally
2) connect the dots vertically
3) draw an X on each dot
4) circle each dot.

-Rob A>

jfrazierjr
09-08-2008, 11:44 AM
Echo, Echo, Echo!

RPMiller
09-08-2008, 12:08 PM
I had found a set of tablet training exercises that I can't locate anymore....

The gist was to render a series of:

horizontal lines, vertical lines, circles

and practice tracing them with the pen.

Then render a grid of dots and play:

1) connect the dots horizontally
2) connect the dots vertically
3) draw an X on each dot
4) circle each dot.

-Rob A>
Would you be referring to this:

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=3629421&postcount=3

Actually this link is better because it lists the other great tutorials and tips

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=199&t=369421

RobA
09-08-2008, 03:08 PM
I think that was it exactly!

Thanks RP!

-Rob A>

delgondahntelius
09-08-2008, 03:34 PM
yeah... great links RP ... you've been hit with the rep stick again :D

delgondahntelius
09-08-2008, 08:49 PM
YES!!!... my Wacom came in just now... (UPS took ALL freakin day!!) but it looks AWESOME!! ... sorry ... just so excited I had to say something to someone somewhere... I think I may be in love.... lol... :) I'll let you all know how its working in a few :D

delgondahntelius
09-08-2008, 09:59 PM
It is even better than I thought... works like a dream, I highly recommend a Wacom tablet if you are in the market for one... This Intous3 9x12 is the best thing since baked bread. The tablet buttons on the side ... indispensable. both the pen and the mouse are wireless, battery-less and the mouse is ball-free and optic free... you couldn't ask for a better product than this (Well, you could ask, but you are definitely going to spend some $$$)

Mouse people... Go buy a tablet now... NOW!... quit reading ... go buy it... we'll wait here for you :D

Arcana
09-08-2008, 10:43 PM
Better yet, go buy the Cintiq...thank me later ;)

delgondahntelius
09-08-2008, 10:46 PM
and if anyone wants to buy me a Cintiq... I'll draw you maps for free -- ForEVER ... a lifetime cartographer at your disposal :D NOW that's a deal!!

Midgardsormr
09-09-2008, 12:51 AM
Hmmm... I'm actually almost tempted to take you up on that. My games could be awesome with two cartographers churning out the maps, even if one of them is me.

delgondahntelius
09-09-2008, 01:25 AM
lol...I'd probably faint if someone actually took me up on that offer...

Steel General
09-09-2008, 06:54 AM
*hands Delgo a paper towel* Here, wipe up the drool :D

Glad to hear you finally got your tablet, maybe some day (if I'm a really good boy), I'll buy myself one.

RPMiller
09-09-2008, 11:27 AM
I have to agree with Del. Even a small tablet is better than no tablet. I love my tablet so much that I've begun taking it to work with me. I read an article just yesterday that convinced me that I was doing an exceptionally good thing. It appears that recent research is showing that even ergonomic mice and trackballs are causing long term damage and there is a growing push to move to pen based input devices. This made the Tablet PC makers very happy. ;) I've found that my productivity has gone up a bit since using it at work and the text recognition within M$ Word means that I'm able to scribble down notes and documents and have it all converted to text for me. Now I just worry about writer's cramp. LOL

delgondahntelius
09-09-2008, 11:33 AM
Word has text recognition? .... I gotta check that out .... I got msoffice 07... weeeeee :)

See... ergonomically correct to have a tablet... you all now have an excuse to buy one... it's almost like a doctor's order... :D

RPMiller
09-09-2008, 11:58 AM
Yup. It had text recognition starting in Office XP I believe. Works pretty good too. I had both my kids scribble some stuff as well as myself and it recognized everyone's writings with only 1 error for all three sentences.

delgondahntelius
09-09-2008, 12:12 PM
ya... but this is me we are talking about .... I think GP labeled it as 'scrawl' .... lol :D

RPMiller
09-09-2008, 12:35 PM
Hm... true... I wonder if there is a 'scrawl' translator? ;) Actually that brings up a good point. On Tablet PCs there is a "teaching" function that allows you to teach the Tablet PC what your scrawl really is. I wonder if there is such a beast for Office... I'll have to check into that later.

delgondahntelius
09-09-2008, 10:05 PM
all I can find is OneNote ... allows you to translate handwriting to text .... couldn't find anything in MS word itself... that I'm aware of ...

RPMiller
09-10-2008, 11:10 AM
Just make sure the language bar is on, and set correctly. Word will do it automatically. There isn't anything to turn on.

RPMiller
09-11-2008, 01:40 PM
Hey Del, did you get the handwriting recognition working yet? I thought about it last night trying to think of reasons why it wouldn't work for you and I remembered that Office SP3 broke the handwriting recognition. I have the fix if you think that might be the problem. Otherwise let me know and I can walk you through getting it working.

On a side note, I've been using my tablet at work as I mentioned and I have Vista. If you have Vista and connect a Wacom tablet it opens a whole new way of interacting with the PC. If anyone is interested, I can tell you about it, or better yet you can just give it a try and learn about it yourself. :)

delgondahntelius
09-11-2008, 04:49 PM
no i haven't got it to work yet... tried last night, found the language bar.. but, nothing so far.. and i was too tired to try and figure it out...

I have XP and MS office 07 .... my laptop has vista tho... but I prefer to use the pc, but i still couldn't find anything in the knowledgebase about word and tablets... just One Note.. which does work... I tried it out... so if that works .. then MSword should work too.. but I've had problems with word since I installed it.. I called MS when I had trouble with it... oh man.. that was a nightmare.. the guy gets on my computer from where he was at... starts editing the registry ... next thing I know he's not on the phone.. he's not hooked to my pc... and I whole lot of my files are missing... so I call back with my ref #... they can't find it... they don't even have a record of this guy having helped me... man I was so ****ed about that... they couldn't do nothing about it... but I got it working again ... so I might have some MS/XP issues... everytime I shut down Word, it gives me a error.. shuts down and sends a report to MS ... other than that it works fine.

Sorry to ramble... lol it was a long story and I was trying to make it short. anything you can help me out with would be great tho

RPMiller
09-11-2008, 05:40 PM
You're running Office 2007? That has better handwriting support than the previous versions. It sounds to me like you definitely need to remove Office and reinstall.

The way it works for me is I launch Word and then in the language bar I click the handwriting input and select Write Anywhere. With that selected I can then write directly inside Word and it converts as I go. Note that the cursor does not change unfortunately so you'll be writing with the I Beam cursor, but you'll see how it works. That is all there is to it. I actually prefer using it on XP in Office than in Vista because Vista insists on "helping" you by forcing you to use the Tablet PC Input Panel which is a bit more clunky than just writing inside Word, however Vista's translation algorithms are better.

delgondahntelius
09-11-2008, 06:09 PM
ya... maybe I will reinstall it... I just loathe to run into anymore problems with it... i was happy to get it working in the first place... or... second place actually

Steel General
09-12-2008, 08:19 AM
Sounds like ya might need to do a "brain wipe" on your PC... if that guy messed around with the registry and hosed any part of it up, uninstalling and reinstalling will most likely not fix the problem (but its at least worth a try). Had something similar happen to one of my PC's at work.

MadLetter
09-17-2008, 04:27 PM
Hey Folks!

The Question I want to direct towards you is about Graphic Tablets. I have recently celebrated my 24th birthday (6th Sept.) and now would like to buy myself a Graphics Tablet.

I never worked with one, but think it would greatly enhance my abilities in mapping. I'd like to ask you now, if you can recommend a specific tablet (I like Wacom!) which is good for a beginner with mostly mapping ambitions.

I have already one recommendation: The Wacom Bamboo.

So now... you guys have the expirience. Help me out please! ;)

ravells
09-17-2008, 04:39 PM
Hi Mad Letter, I've merged your post with this one which should give you more than enough information on tablets!

Cheers

Ravs

RPMiller
09-17-2008, 05:17 PM
MadLetter, it sounds like you are all set. A Wacom Bamboo is indeed the way to go, unless you want to jump into something higher end. Honestly there is no better company than Wacom as far as tablets are concerned. You can check Wikipedia, Consumer Reports, and Amazon to see some of the technologies and reviews of their products to get another opinion, but I couldn't imagine buying from anyone else.

MadLetter
09-17-2008, 05:37 PM
I know about Wacom having practically the monopoly. I just wanted to ask for further input and if/how good i can work with the bamboo. Do I need any added equipment? What would you recommend, if so?

RPMiller
09-17-2008, 05:48 PM
No added equipment. Just install the driver, plug in the tablet and go. It will take some getting used to as mentioned above, but it is a natural action you've been doing your whole life. You just have to get used to looking elsewhere to see "the ink". You might consider getting the felt tip nibs if you need more of a "feel of pen on paper". The felt tip nibs provided a better friction and prevents some of the sliding that others have trouble with.

Midgardsormr
09-17-2008, 06:45 PM
With regards to the Bamboo, be aware that it does not have the ability to sense the angle of the stylus or its rotation, but those settings may still appear in dialogues within Photoshop or other software. I don't have any direct experience with any models of that line--I splurged and bought an Intuos3 for my wife (ostensibly)--so I can't evaluate how good it is, but I am so happy with the Intuos that it makes me glad I got married so I could have an excuse to buy one!

RPMiller
09-17-2008, 06:49 PM
That is the most unique reason I've ever heard for getting married.

ravells
09-17-2008, 07:57 PM
Oh I don't know, my wife got me 22 inch screen for our anniverarry. Marriage definitely has its advantages!

MadLetter
09-18-2008, 01:47 PM
Thanks for the added info. Question again: If I am into mapping mostly, would it be better if I'd go for the Intuos3 myself? A friend of mine said I should go for the Bamboo because it would take me up to a year or two to wholly adjust and I should not immediately jump on the "Big One".

The thing about angle and rotation of the stylus seem interesting ^^

RPMiller
09-18-2008, 01:57 PM
I would say go for whatever you can afford. The Intuos features are pretty nice, but if you don't use those brush settings for what you do, and don't care about the programmable buttons I would save the money.

Midgardsormr
09-18-2008, 08:53 PM
To be honest, I've not yet developed the skill to use those features on my Intuos, but I know I will eventually since I'm going into art school now. So far, there's nothing I've done with my tablet that I couldn't have accomplished just as easily for far cheaper by buying the Bamboo.

MadLetter
09-19-2008, 05:17 AM
After seeing the price on the cheapest Intuos3 I decided that I do not yet have the money. I'll probably go for the Bamboo, then.

Question now is: Which one? There are three: Bamboo, Bamboo3 and Bamboo Fun.

The Fun Version can become more costly but also bigger. Is the size worth the added 100€ ?

RPMiller
09-19-2008, 12:44 PM
I think that depends on the personal preference and need. I personally like the bigger surface because it feels more comfortable and logic (if that makes sense) to me. That is why I got the wide screen format for the one to one mapping. With the smaller tablets you have to "'write' over your previous movements" a lot and it feels weird to me.

However, if you are going to be going mobile with it a lot I would say definitely stay smaller. Mine is the same size as my widescreen laptop which makes it a little unwieldy when I'm moving around a lot, but if I'm staying in one place for a while it isn't bad at all.

Again, I think it comes done to affordability and what you are comfortable with. Just out of curiosity, do you have any computer stores near you that might carry tablets, even non-Wacom ones, just so that you can try one out and see what feels natural to you? That would be the best way to go.

jakeforddaniels
09-19-2008, 04:53 PM
I bought a Wacom Bamboo Fun a couple weeks ago and have been using it since for general computing as well as mapping, Photoshopping and such. I went with a cheapie because I'm not a hardcore artist (I'm a photographer, though) but I really liked the idea of a stylus instead of the cramp-inducing mouse. Also, I was mourning the end of a romantic jaunt, and new tech is always a good picker-upper.

The Bamboo Fun is small, the name's a little silly, but it fits my needs and it's really been encouraging to see the stuff in my head come out on the screen. For me, it's made that kind of intellectual transfer a little faster, a little more fun, and a little more instinctive.

Absinth
10-22-2008, 03:36 AM
Hello folks, I'm also thinking about buying a Wacom Bamboo, but first I have a few questions:

What is your experience using the tablet with GIMP? On several GIMP boards, I read about the problem that the Pen "freezes" for a few seconds from time to time. Did you come across this problem too?

How long does it take to get used to drawing on the tablet but only seeing the result on screen? I haven't tried it yet but I imagine it to be weird. I'm drawing for nearly thirty years now and am so used to see the drawing on the surface I'm working on. I really can't imagine how it feels to see it different. Any problems with this?
Out of this reason, I'm toying with the idea to buy a Cintiq with a built in screen, so that you can see the drawing on the tablet. These tablets are far more expensive than the Bamboo and I don't know if it is worth the money. Please tell me about your experiences getting used to unfamiliar hand/eye-coordination. Thanks!

RPMiller
10-22-2008, 10:41 AM
For me, I was able to get comfortable with the tablet within only a couple days. There are a couple tutorials posted in this thread with some simple exercises to get you used to it pretty quickly. As for the Cintiq, Arcana is the only one that I know of that has one so you'll need to ask him. From what he has mentioned so far he loves it.

Absinth
10-22-2008, 11:30 AM
Okay, I guess I'll just try it. I don't really want to buy a Cintiq, because it's nearly ten times as expensive as the Bamboo. I have no doubt that it's really nice, though! :) But I guess so many people are using tablets without screens and get used to it. Why should I be an exception? And, if possible, I'd like to prevent the discussion with my gf about the need to spend thousand euros for a graphic tablet...:D

RPMiller
10-22-2008, 12:11 PM
Just noticed your location when you said euros...

Ja, das heißt nicht artig zu versuchen zu auslegen jene Betrag über Draht als "ein Baumfalke" (is Baumfalke the right word?), aber falls Sie anfertigen Draht.

Hopefully my German wasn't too painful to read. Hopefully you are German. LOL

Absinth
10-22-2008, 03:10 PM
:lol:
RPMiller, you just nearly caused me to die a painful but rather funny death! Yes, I am german and german is my first language, but what the hell did you try to say? Please, don't feel offended, but I have absolutely no clue what this was supposed to mean. It doesn't make any sense! (Hopefully my own posts don't cause confusion like this among the english speaking users!)
A baumfalke is a falcon! What does this have to do with graphic tablets?! Oh, wait, maybe you tried to translate the word 'hobby'? :lol:
There's no german translation for 'hobby'. The word is used in germany as well. But even if I replace 'hobby' with the translation for 'pastime' (Zeitvertreib), I'm still clueless.

This whole conversation reminds me of the killing joke from Monthy Python's Flying Circus. Cool, you just made my day! Awesome! :D

torstan
10-22-2008, 04:24 PM
:)

As for the freezing issue, I know that it was an issue with the graphire as well but that you could work around it by going in and editing some of the Gimp files. The other option for the graphire was that you go back to an older driver - which is what I ended up doing. That's probably not an option for the Bamboo. As a result I'd guess that there will certainly be a workaround by now for the Bamboo with Gimp. How painful it is, I don't know.

RPMiller
10-22-2008, 04:37 PM
:lol:
RPMiller, you just nearly caused me to die a painful but rather funny death! Yes, I am german and german is my first language, but what the hell did you try to say? Please, don't feel offended, but I have absolutely no clue what this was supposed to mean. It doesn't make any sense! (Hopefully my own posts don't cause confusion like this among the english speaking users!)
A baumfalke is a falcon! What does this have to do with graphic tablets?! Oh, wait, maybe you tried to translate the word 'hobby'? :lol:
There's no german translation for 'hobby'. The word is used in germany as well. But even if I replace 'hobby' with the translation for 'pastime' (Zeitvertreib), I'm still clueless.

This whole conversation reminds me of the killing joke from Monthy Python's Flying Circus. Cool, you just made my day! Awesome! :D
Yes, I couldn't remember a word for hobby so depended on babble fish to translate... :oops: Now that you say Zeitvertreib, that sounds more familiar. You would think that after 5 years of learning German I would be better at it, but as they say use it or lose it. :) I'm glad I was able to give you a chuckle at least. :) And for the record your English is very good.

jfrazierjr
10-22-2008, 05:00 PM
:)

As for the freezing issue, I know that it was an issue with the graphire as well but that you could work around it by going in and editing some of the Gimp files. The other option for the graphire was that you go back to an older driver - which is what I ended up doing. That's probably not an option for the Bamboo. As a result I'd guess that there will certainly be a workaround by now for the Bamboo with Gimp. How painful it is, I don't know.

I have used the Bamboo on two laptops, so I am constantly unplugging the USB tablet. On my old machine, I used to get the freeze ups when lifting the pen from the tablet surface quite often. On my new machine (a more up to date driver), I have seen no such problems. GIMP still "looses" the tablet between runnings of GIMP if I have unplugged it, but even that problem seems to be less than before.

jfrazierjr
10-22-2008, 05:03 PM
Yes, I couldn't remember a word for hobby so depended on babble fish to translate... :oops: Now that you say Zeitvertreib, that sounds more familiar. You would think that after 5 years of learning German I would be better at it, but as they say use it or lose it. :) I'm glad I was able to give you a chuckle at least. :) And for the record your English is very good.

That's pretty darn funny(umm nonsensical) even when you translate it back into English. What WERE you trying to say?

RPMiller
10-22-2008, 05:19 PM
Based on what I wrote I was trying to say, "Yes, that is not good to try to explain spending that much money for "a hobby", unless you are making money..." or something to that effect... and I realized just now that I was using the wrong word for money. *smacks head* It should have been Geld not Draht. Draht is a telegram I think. Yea, German isn't easy especially when you try to go off memory... :(

jfrazierjr
10-22-2008, 10:16 PM
Based on what I wrote I was trying to say, "Yes, that is not good to try to explain spending that much money for "a hobby", unless you are making money..." or something to that effect... and I realized just now that I was using the wrong word for money. *smacks head* It should have been Geld not Draht. Draht is a telegram I think. Yea, German isn't easy especially when you try to go off memory... :(


Heh...too funny

Absinth
10-23-2008, 04:37 AM
:D 'Draht' is 'wire'! It's not a synonym for a telegram (which would be also called 'telegram' in german).
What I find really funny is that 'hobby' is also an ornithological term for a subspecies of falcons. :)
Well, I think Babelfish is one of the worst translators ever. I don't know if there are good ones at all, but Babelfish is definitly not among them. A friend from california tried to translate one of the articles on my homebrews Wiki and did send me the translation. It was crazy! And the worst was, that he claimed that Babelfish would be a good translator and thought that the translation was accurate! The program turned my article in a text you would expect of truely cracked up madmen from the Arkham Asylum! Totally senseless and crazy as hell! :D It took a while to convince him, that I'm not crazy... I guess the program isn't aimed at aiding in communication, but to spread confusion and alienation! :D The name of it seems to be a hint at this too; Babel is the german name of Babylon, where god "invented" the different languages to separate the peoples from each other! That's exactly what Babelfish does! :D Okay, I'll stop ranting now and add this to my growing list of conspiracy theories... ;)

Jkaen
10-23-2008, 05:14 AM
I think the problem is it looks at each word in isolation, which means it can get the wrong translation quite easily. I always thought babelfish was from hitchhikers guide to the galaxy while we are on the subject.

(I won't even try my german, it was bad after I finished school 14 years ago so will be awful now, I just about managed to get the taxi driver to get to my hotel a couple of months back when in germany, everybody else spoke english to me!)

Absinth
10-23-2008, 06:47 AM
JKaen, I guess you're right about the word coming from HGttG, but I like my theory! :D

jfrazierjr
10-23-2008, 11:25 AM
JKaen, I guess you're right about the word coming from HGttG, but I like my theory! :D

Well.. your both right. Adams stole the idea for the babelfish directly from the bible when he made up HGttG.

Absinth
10-23-2008, 06:53 PM
I was in a shop today and tried a Cintiq tablet! Waaaahhh! This is awesome! Gladly, I made my saving throw, but I don't know how much longer I can resist to go out and spend 960 € on it... *shudder*

Iliyan503
10-25-2008, 09:44 AM
I've got a question for people owning a tablet.
Thing is, I've been trying to decide weather to get it, and which one to get and I'm becoming slightly worried about the size of the thing.

Wacom Bamboo One ( A6 Wide 147.6 x 92.3 mm)( pic (http://www.links.hr/photo/big/102.100.009.jpg))
Seems a bit small, and I am unsure weather it would be enough for my use... I don't plan on doing it professionally or anything like that, just personal use.

Your thoughts?

RPMiller
10-25-2008, 12:54 PM
It really depends on how you draw and if you plan on doing any tracing. For me, I have to have room when I draw as I'm not that artistic to begin with. In addition, I do some tracing from time to time and need the larger space. Finally, I use my tablet with CC3 and so need the larger space for the customized template for all the macros and such.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that one benefit of the smaller tablet is the portability. If you will be moving around a lot a smaller tablet is much nicer. Also, I wanted to recommend that you get yourself a piece of paper that is the same size as the drawing area of the tablet and try drawing a picture on it and see how it "feels" to you. That will go a long way toward making the decision regarding size.

torstan
10-25-2008, 01:15 PM
I bought a large tablet initially and hated it. It takes ages to move the pointer around the screen and it took up a huge amount of desk space. I then got an A6 wacom and haven't looked back. I have never felt that the size was too small when working on it. I have absolutely no regrets about going for the smaller model and it comes with me in my laptop bag wherever I go.

Absinth
10-26-2008, 11:05 AM
That's interesting. I thought about the size issue too. When I'm drawing in the old-fashioned way, I'd never use anything smaller than A4, so I thought a smaller tablet wouldn't make sense for me. What do you mean when you say that it "takes ages" to move the pointer around the screen?

RobA
10-26-2008, 11:57 AM
Big arm movements.

The tablets map to the screen, so to move from one side to the other using the stylus requires moving from one edge of the tablet to the other.

If you are used to a more sensitive mouse setup, say 2 inches of movement across the whole screen, this change takes getting used to as you arm has to move, not just your wrist.

-Rob A>

torstan
10-26-2008, 12:44 PM
Well I use my tablet to draw images that are A4 and larger. The point really is how often you draw one stroke from one side of an A4 page to another? If you are not doing large strokes like that then you don't need your whole image up on the screen. You zoom in on the area you are working on and the tablet will map very well to that region. You then move the window to the next piece of the image and work on that. I've found no issue with working like this. It just allows you to zoom out on the image for doing the rough sketching and then zoom in when you work in the detail.

The one issue I can see with the smaller tablet is that you can't really trace anything that is larger than the drawable size without some careful jiggling but I don't trace stuff so its not so much of an issue for me. Hope that makes sense.

RPMiller
10-26-2008, 12:55 PM
Regarding the large arm movements, don't forget that you can turn off the point to point mapping and have the stylus behave exactly like a mouse moving further the faster it is moved. For navigation stuff I have the configuration set to mouse, and for drawing and other precise work including text conversion I have it set to stylus. One of the greatest strengths of the Wacom tablets is their configuration ability.

torstan
10-26-2008, 01:05 PM
That's a really good point. The large tablet I had before was a nisus and I don't believe it had that level of configuration. I have tadmit that I haven't looked that deeply into the Wacom configuration. Can you set it up so that it switches automatically between modes - or do you have to go into the settings every time you want to change between stylus and mouse behaviour?

RPMiller
10-26-2008, 01:50 PM
That's the cool thing! The configuration recognizes the different styluses and mouse as well as the applications. So you can actually configure each input device and each application to have their own settings. So if I'm primarily doing typical "mouse stuff" I just grab the mouse or my second stylus depending on the application of course. The primary stylus (the one with the padding) is configured as a pure stylus in all applications so it always behaves like a stylus when I use it.

It sounds kind of complex I know, but once you have it set up, you are set and it works great. It isn't hard to set up either, but I do recommend reading the documentation before you do it so that you understand the options and the configuration set up.

Korrigan
11-05-2008, 12:55 PM
I recently found an older wacom model (volito 1) that was sold blistered on eBay for only 14€ (yes I said 14€, not 140 !) so that made something like 20€ (around $25 or something like that)... and I'm so happy with it ! It has only one stylus that has only pressure recognition, no additional stuff but is highly sufficient for my needs. Plus, my new laptop automatically set up the built-in Tablet PC options (built-in every Packard Bell model, even non-tablet pc)...

I now use it with Photoshop, Illustrator, Blender and the like and it's almost a must have for any would-be graphic designer...

Definitely no problems with it. I have my mouse and tablet plugged in and found no conflict between them. I only disabled the "click animation" that goes with the stylus in Vista, because it caused lags... but now I did that it's perfectly fluid.

Plus, shipped in two days (Belgium is far smaller than the US ^^).

Clearly, 20€ was worth the expense ;-)

Edit : I think they still have some for sale, in case someone would be interested ;-)

MarkusTay
11-21-2008, 05:32 PM
I bought a tablet a couple of years ago, but I couldn't get the hang of it and stopped using it almost immediately.

So I'm a mouse-man myself

RobA
11-22-2008, 12:22 AM
I bought a tablet a couple of years ago, but I couldn't get the hang of it and stopped using it almost immediately.

So I'm a mouse-man myself

Dig it out! Seriously. I love my mouse (well, trackball) and it is what I use for much of my work..... but you can't beat the combination of a pressure sensitive tablet and software that can use the pressure/angle, etc sensitivity.. for "natural" painting/touch-ups/ dodge and burn, etc.

-Rob A>

MarkusTay
11-22-2008, 01:20 AM
I tried a few months back, and the same thing happened.

How the heck do you know where your 'drawing point' is going to start on the screen? :?:

RPMiller
11-22-2008, 10:42 AM
That would be wherever the cursor is just like if you were using a mouse. It sounds like maybe you are not hovering the stylus to move the cursor and are just putting it down on the tablet. You should be able to hold the stylus near the surface and have the cursor move around. Once you have it where you want you can then press it to the pad and draw.

Or is it a different problem?

Ascension
11-22-2008, 02:08 PM
Yeah, I had the same problem...that hovering messes me up so I quit using my tablet as well. I'm sure, though, that just like anything else it just takes getting used to...I just never had the patience to get used to it :)

RPMiller
11-22-2008, 08:18 PM
Interesting... I am curious why they would be a problem. Is it actually when you go to move it to the tablet or is it actually the hovering part?

Ascension
11-22-2008, 08:59 PM
Well, the additonal problem was that when hovering the cursor would be in one place and then when I put the pen down it would jump to the right place and hence any lines would get all screwy. Too much for me.

RPMiller
11-22-2008, 09:43 PM
Really? That is odd. Is it a Wacom tablet? I've never seen that behavior with mine. I think you can set sensitivity and I know you can set application specific behavior. Have you made sure you have the latest drivers and all that?

I actually took mine to work and have been using it all week for PhotoShopping some stuff for our service manager, and the behavior was the same as at home so maybe drivers aren't the answer.

I definitely think that behavior is not typical though... Oh! One other thing to take a look at. If you have any other styluses on the tablet that could cause a jump as would if you move the mouse while you are using the tablet. The basic rule is "one input device at a time". I have had it jump when I had been using the tablet mouse and set it aside, but it was still close to the tablet and then I used the stylus. Now I make it a rule to always only have one stylus or mouse on the tablet at a time.

MarkusTay
11-23-2008, 12:18 AM
I don't know - I think maybe the learning curve is too steep or something.

I'm used to putting my hand down with a pen (stylus) and drawing while looking down at it, not looking up at the screen. I can't get the hang of not watching where my hand is going.

Also, that 'hover' thing seems to be an issue as well. When I put the stylus down it snaps to the new position... and draw a line across my work. I hated the damn thing.

Besides, I need the mouse to click on stuff with photoshop, and I can't be switching back and forth all the time - it sounds like way more trouble then it's worth.

Maybe when I can afford a touch-screen I can have my cake and eat it too.

RPMiller
11-23-2008, 12:34 AM
You don't need you mouse to click on stuff. Just use the stylus. The not looking at what you are doing thing really isn't that difficult. Aren't you doing that with the mouse anyway? Take a look earlier in this thread for the tutorials/exercises that are posted. They should really help you as well.

MarkusTay
11-23-2008, 12:47 PM
Yes, but I learned to draw maps WAY back when by hand, and use pens, pencils, crayons and all manner of stylus-like tools to do so.

When I learned to use photoshop, I was used to a mouse for computing, and although it took a short time for me to get used to, I was laready used to using my mouse while working a computer screen.

I know it sounds weird, but after drawing for more then thrity years, I simply CANNOT hold anything shaped like a stylus in my hand and draw without looking at my hand - it's ingrained. I want the tip of my 'thingy' to be where the drawing is occurring, not two feet away in another direction. I just can't get past that.

You can use the stylus to click on stuff? See that? I can't get past that either - I HAVE to use my mouse to click on stuff (and if you think thats bad, you should see me trying to work a laptop-touchpad).

Another question, though, in case I give it a third try - can you buy replacement stylus? I knew exactly where I stuck my tablet, but I'm not sure if I can find the Stylus again. Here's the thing - I don't think I used the stylus the second time I tried it - can any pointy object work? THAT may be why I was having such difficulty. I wasn't getting that 'hover' thing you guys are talking about - I never saw anything resembling a cursor on my screen; I went from no-touch to drawing instantly, without any visual reference.

RPMiller
11-23-2008, 02:48 PM
No, you have to have a stylus. The stylus has circuitry inside that breaks the electrical field of the tablet. Assuming it is a Wacom of course.

You can get replacement styluses from Wacom, but you would have to contact them.

Yes, you click with the mouse when you press the stylus down. There are a lot of old school artists that successfully transitioned to digital media so maybe you could do some searching through artist blogs and find someone that walks through the process they used to retrain themselves.

RobA
11-23-2008, 02:52 PM
I wasn't getting that 'hover' thing you guys are talking about - I never saw anything resembling a cursor on my screen; I went from no-touch to drawing instantly, without any visual reference.

That sound like some sort of touch-pad rather than a modern standard tabled...

-Rob A>

MarkusTay
11-23-2008, 03:37 PM
Its a UC-Logic, and it's got to be at least five years old now, maybe six.

I hate admitting defeat, so you guys have me looking for the Stylus again....

Arkkeeper
12-08-2008, 05:34 PM
Am I the only one who actually prefers my touchpad over a mouse... maybe's it's just because I haven't used a mouse for digital mapping.

RPMiller
12-08-2008, 05:55 PM
Yup. You are the only one. :)

Sagenlicht
12-08-2008, 06:03 PM
Just to throw my few cents in here.

I got the smallest Wacom (Bamboo) and never had a problem that it is too small. In fact I dont think I wanna have a bigger one...

Though I use the tablet only for drawing, nothing else. Not because I wouldt like my tablet - I really love it - but I am used to my mouse for browsing etc.

Arkkeeper
12-08-2008, 06:38 PM
Now if I had a tablet I would love it but because I've gotten so use to the touchpad and it responds alot faster (for me at least) than a mouse I prefer it until I get a tablet.

RPMiller
12-08-2008, 07:06 PM
Just remember a tablet uses a stylus and not a finger so it may not "feel" the same at first.

Asharad
12-14-2008, 01:23 AM
I'm looking at used Wacom's on Ebay. What kind of trouble could I expect buying used?

RPMiller
12-14-2008, 01:37 PM
Hm... Good question. Honestly the only trouble I can see is that it doesn't work. There aren't really any moving parts or anything. Oh, here's one - you may have to buy replacement nibs for the stylus if the previous owner either lost them or ground them to nothing. Ugh... just realized that would be really bad. If the current nub in the stylus has been worn away to nothing you'll have a tough time removing it. I would suggest having the auctioner put up a picture of the stylus tip so show that it is in decent shape.

Asharad
12-14-2008, 03:25 PM
I'm thinking for $25, a 4x6 Intuos3 would be a good buy, nibs or not. Here is the ebay description.


Tablet has only been uses a few times and is in perfect working order. it does have a few hairline scratches due to use. Sorry but I no longer have the box and you can get all the information and the download software for it at Wacom. Feel free to email me with any questions and good luck with the bid!! What is included: -Tablet -Pen -Pen holder

RPMiller
12-14-2008, 03:31 PM
If it has only been used a few times than there is little to worry about regarding nib wear, and as that is an extremely good deal, yes, you should jump on it. A pack of nibs don't cost that much at all.

Asharad
12-14-2008, 03:57 PM
I doubt I'll win this bid. I'm getting hammered, lol.

Asharad
12-17-2008, 06:46 PM
I won a bid on a new condition Graphire 4x5 for $25. I know it's not an Intuos, but hey! I have a tablet coming!

RPMiller
01-06-2009, 12:21 PM
If anyone is still considering a tablet there is currently one being offered by Tanga for $49 US (includes shipping). It's not a Wacom (its a 8"x6" DigiPro), but if you don't care this looks like a decent deal.

http://tanga.com/products/3287-DigiPro_8x6_USB_Graphics_Tablet_w_Cordless_Pen_

Be aware that Tanga offers do not hang around long, so jump over there if you are interested.

MarkusTay
01-12-2009, 03:53 PM
Finally found my stylus - that was weird in itself (it just 'appeared' on my desk right in front of my monitor about a week ago), so I plugged in the old tablet... and nada.

My computer didn't even recognize an input device had been plugged in. I'm hopping it's just a bad USB port, but the light came on on the tablet so I doubt it.

I finally decided to bite the bullet and learn how to use the damn thing, and NOW it's not working. <le' sigh>

Treslo Kresha
01-16-2009, 12:34 PM
For those interested I suggest you snag this deal while it exists:

http://www.adorama.com/WAI368USBR.html?searchinfo=wacom&item_no=4

Wacom Intuos 3 6x8" Refurbished Tablet for $209.95. That's $100 off for a tablet that is manufacturer refurbished, meaning it has a warranty from the purchase date of 1 year (as opposed to the 2 year that a brand new tablet has).

This is the best deal I've seen, even some Intuos2 are bidding up in the $1##s on ebay right now.

Not to mention free shipping, got mine this week - great, factory sealed. Amazing product and steal.

Bedwyr
02-03-2009, 10:02 PM
Considering taking the plunge. 4x6 doesn't do it for me (I remember writing itty bitty print to get formulae on an index card for exams :P). So it's going to either be the Bamboo medium in black or the Intuos 8x6. $150 refurbished or $300 or so depending on whom I purchase from. The only differences I see are: 1024 pressure levels, extra buttons on pen and tablet, and that tilt thingy.


Questions:
I'd be interested in getting better sketching skills so what would this do or not do for me? Is a 6x8 large enough to start practicing better strokes? (generally I like the idea of messing up a line and re-trying it without using up a kneaded eraser.) So what's this "wacom brushes" thing I see as part of the software package?

gorkamorka
02-04-2009, 01:59 AM
Just went ahead an bullied my employer into buying me one for work.

So Now I'm the proud user of a Wacom intuos3 (A5 size). So far it's working out alright. I do have a problem. The GIMP will not let me change the setting for the pen. If I go into the main setting applet for the table and tell it to change the pen settings for GIMP it will tell me it's changed it, but when I go into GIMP it won't listen to what I told it and jut behave like it's on default setting. But the funny thing is that it's only the pen that does this, not the quick buttons on the tablet.

Any idea why?

RPMiller
02-04-2009, 10:45 AM
Considering taking the plunge. 4x6 doesn't do it for me (I remember writing itty bitty print to get formulae on an index card for exams :P). So it's going to either be the Bamboo medium in black or the Intuos 8x6. $150 refurbished or $300 or so depending on whom I purchase from. The only differences I see are: 1024 pressure levels, extra buttons on pen and tablet, and that tilt thingy.


Questions:
I'd be interested in getting better sketching skills so what would this do or not do for me? Is a 6x8 large enough to start practicing better strokes? (generally I like the idea of messing up a line and re-trying it without using up a kneaded eraser.) So what's this "wacom brushes" thing I see as part of the software package?
The Wacom brushes are PS brushes created to duplicate various artistic brushes better than the default ones. I would suggest you definitely try out each of the stylus nib types to find the one that feels the best to you. There is definitely a difference between them and you may find one that works better than the others.

RPMiller
02-04-2009, 10:48 AM
Just went ahead an bullied my employer into buying me one for work.

So Now I'm the proud user of a Wacom intuos3 (A5 size). So far it's working out alright. I do have a problem. The GIMP will not let me change the setting for the pen. If I go into the main setting applet for the table and tell it to change the pen settings for GIMP it will tell me it's changed it, but when I go into GIMP it won't listen to what I told it and jut behave like it's on default setting. But the funny thing is that it's only the pen that does this, not the quick buttons on the tablet.

Any idea why?
I don't know enough about the GIMP to help, but I can say that I have two styluses and a mouse and PS knows which one I put on the tablet without fail. I have to believe that GIMP does the same. Do you have to save the setting as a different brush before you use it perhaps?

Bedwyr
02-04-2009, 11:04 AM
The Wacom brushes are PS brushes created to duplicate various artistic brushes better than the default ones. I would suggest you definitely try out each of the stylus nib types to find the one that feels the best to you. There is definitely a difference between them and you may find one that works better than the others.


Given my needs, do you think the Intuos is worth $100 more? (I get pretty price sensitive over $30 difference). Basically I'm trying to figure out my opportunity cost. What future "learning" or "ability" am I sacrificing to get the Bamboo? Not necessarily the cool functions I get out of the Intuos, but whether I'd be losing something as an artist if I spring for the cheaper model and keep it for 5 years, gaining artistic skill.

CBDroege
02-04-2009, 11:07 AM
I have a WACOM Bamboo, and I love it. I only use it for the things I would have used colored pencils for on paper, but that's really what it's for, right? I tried using just the stylus to create a map, but the strokes don't look realistic enough when attempting to fill an entire area, so I switched styles.

I tried using the WACOM "mouse" as my mouse for awhile, but I quickly went back to my G5 for everyday applications. Does anyone actually use the mouse that came with their WACOM pad? Mine is now collecting dust on a shelf :/

I didn't read the whole thread, so sorry if this has been answered:

I see mention of these WACOM brushes, and it makes me curious. Where can I get my hands on them?

I've seen people use their WACOM to make very realistic looking "paintings", but when I try to do it, the brushes in PS just don't look realistic. Are these WACOM brushes the missing link in my attempts?

RPMiller
02-04-2009, 11:24 AM
Personally I am glad I went with the Intuos. I haven't yet grown into the "additional features", but having them has allowed me to push myself to getting skilled enough to use them. I viewed the purchase as a long term investment that I would never have to upgrade (until the come out with some out of this world super tech ;) ).

The brushes are very artistic so if you are looking for actual "paintings" you probably want to find the Wacom brushes because they are extremely close to using actual brushes.

gorkamorka
02-04-2009, 05:55 PM
I don't know enough about the GIMP to help, but I can say that I have two styluses and a mouse and PS knows which one I put on the tablet without fail. I have to believe that GIMP does the same. Do you have to save the setting as a different brush before you use it perhaps?

That is my guess as well. But I can't find any simple way to set it in GIMP. Does anyone have any experience with this? Please?

jfrazierjr
02-04-2009, 06:01 PM
I have a WACOM Bamboo, and I love it. I only use it for the things I would have used colored pencils for on paper, but that's really what it's for, right? I tried using just the stylus to create a map, but the strokes don't look realistic enough when attempting to fill an entire area, so I switched styles.

I tried using the WACOM "mouse" as my mouse for awhile, but I quickly went back to my G5 for everyday applications. Does anyone actually use the mouse that came with their WACOM pad? Mine is now collecting dust on a shelf :/

I didn't read the whole thread, so sorry if this has been answered:

I see mention of these WACOM brushes, and it makes me curious. Where can I get my hands on them?

I've seen people use their WACOM to make very realistic looking "paintings", but when I try to do it, the brushes in PS just don't look realistic. Are these WACOM brushes the missing link in my attempts?

Not sure of the style you are going for, but using the smudge and blur tools can help with blending to a great degreee. Play with the rate and even the brush shape.

jfrazierjr
02-04-2009, 06:03 PM
Just went ahead an bullied my employer into buying me one for work.

So Now I'm the proud user of a Wacom intuos3 (A5 size). So far it's working out alright. I do have a problem. The GIMP will not let me change the setting for the pen. If I go into the main setting applet for the table and tell it to change the pen settings for GIMP it will tell me it's changed it, but when I go into GIMP it won't listen to what I told it and jut behave like it's on default setting. But the funny thing is that it's only the pen that does this, not the quick buttons on the tablet.

Any idea why?

I am not sure what you mean by this. Where are you changing the settings that are not sticking?

RobA
02-04-2009, 06:34 PM
All I can suggest is reading through this thread at Gimptalk:
http://www.gimptalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=17992

I never had problems with my (older) wacom graphire under windows in gimp.

-Rob A>

Asharad
02-04-2009, 10:44 PM
Considering taking the plunge. 4x6 doesn't do it for me (I remember writing itty bitty print to get formulae on an index card for exams :P).

I found the 4x5 to be plenty large enough. If you think about pencil and paper sketches, you rarely make large strokes. The same is true using a wacom. Your strokes are confined to a few inches (usually much less than that). I'm glad I didn't get a bigger, bulkier unit.

jfrazierjr
02-24-2009, 08:05 PM
For those who are super cheap and are electrical engineers (or just very good with electronic stuff) and have some time an around $200, this guy (http://www.bongofish.co.uk/wacom/wacom_pt1.html) has made a Cintiq style tablet/screen combo. I REALLY wish I had the electronically know how to cobble together something like this....

Also, for those who might be in the market for a tablet, you could try Circuit City in the next few weeks since they are going out of business. You might get lucky and find a tablet for 40% off. Just make sure you verify the contents if the box is open since floor models may not have everything(and they CANT haggle with the price). They were would not work with me on the price of a Intous 3 (229 regular) they were selling for 129, but it was in a bag (scratched up a bit since it was the floor model) with no software or drivers and no pen. I would have snapped it up if it had everything for the price, but not if I have to spend more money getting a pen for it....

delgondahntelius
03-04-2009, 10:16 PM
Intuos is the way to go :D

btw RP, I recently got a laptop that I upgraded to Vista Premium and you are right .... a tablet opens up a whole new world that ROCKS~! :D

RPMiller
03-04-2009, 10:34 PM
Intuos is the way to go :D

btw RP, I recently got a laptop that I upgraded to Vista Premium and you are right .... a tablet opens up a whole new world that ROCKS~! :D
Good to hear! Have you tried the ink game yet? It is a great way to get comfortable with the stylus, but I have to warn you that it can be addicting. :)

jfrazierjr
03-04-2009, 11:12 PM
Good to hear! Have you tried the ink game yet? It is a great way to get comfortable with the stylus, but I have to warn you that it can be addicting. :)

VERY addictive, even with a mouse(trackball really)

Kingbreaker
03-18-2009, 06:12 PM
Best Buy has reduced prices on Intuos tablets.

I picked one up this afternoon - the 6x11 model. $250 including tax. Down from a list price of $370. Score!


:)

RPMiller
03-25-2009, 11:43 AM
So, Wacom released their new Intous today... It is absolutely beautiful... *sniff* Is it wrong for me to want one?

http://intuos.wacom.com/

Midgardsormr
03-25-2009, 12:26 PM
No. No, that's not wrong at all. I think I'm falling in lust.

Benarius
03-26-2009, 01:28 AM
...but not that one...lol.

I did order the cheapest there is. The Bamboo. Just the Bamboo. Not the one, not the fun. And the smallest one. (A6)

If I find that I will use it as much as I think, then I will invest in the Intuos A4 model. I know the one I ordered is very small, but I beleive I will use it mainly for small graphics to use as stamps or textures. Basically I just wanted to test how well the pressure sensitive option applies to my needs. A few more days...can't wait.

megahunter
03-26-2009, 07:32 PM
I've been lurking quite a lot recently since I don't have time to map right now, and I'm starting to get really tempted to buy a tablet. The problem is that I don't have much money to spend and that they are pretty expensive.

Within my price range, I found two tablets that looked good.
Wacom Bamboo One
Genius G-Pen F610

The Wacom is cheaper and from a reputated brand, but the Genius is almost twice the size. What do you advise I get? If you have other suggestions, my budget is about 70€ maximum (around 70$ the way things are taxed here).
I use Vista 64 bit and XP, on a 22" screen. I want it for Photoshop and drawing (my sister draws a lot so she might want to borrow it).

jfrazierjr
03-26-2009, 08:38 PM
To be honest, size is not so important for mapping I have found. I have the medium Bamboo and just got the small one for my wife and playing around with it, it's not that much difference even though it's half as large active area.

torstan
03-26-2009, 09:40 PM
I have an A6 and would actively avoid going any larger. I can get extremely fine control with it as is and I can take it anywhere. If I were to spend the extra money I'd go up in quality (number of pressure levels, extra features and so on) rather than up in size. I had an A4 Nisis, and it was a nightmare. I'm more than happy with my A6 Wacom graphire.

megahunter
03-27-2009, 03:50 AM
Well, I heard that it was better on big screens to have big tablets because otherwise you lose precision, that makes sense to me but I never used a tablet either...

torstan
03-27-2009, 08:31 AM
I use a widescreen monitor and have had no problems so far, but if it's a concern go for the A5.

RobA
03-27-2009, 11:38 AM
I work zoomed in (200 or 400) for real detail work anyway, so not sure how a bigger tablet would give more precision, just a larger working area.

The resolution of even the small tablets is much higher than screen resolutions.

-Rob A>

megahunter
03-27-2009, 07:18 PM
True, I hadn't thought that I'd zoom in anyways, besides the Wacom seems much more sturdy and has function buttons that seem more useful. Well, I have two weeks until I have the money and another two weeks before I can buy it, so I have all my time to think about it :)
Thanks for the input.

NymTevlyn
03-29-2009, 08:19 AM
I had an Intuos 9x12 tablet, 'til my cat knocked over a can of Mt. Dew all over it. I'm thinking about replacing it finally with a 4x5 Bamboo Fun. Much cheaper and good enough.

CBDroege
03-30-2009, 09:15 AM
For serious: I don't see how anyone needs more than 256 levels of pressure sensitivity. No matter how 'professional' they may be, I don't think anyone can tell the difference.

NymTevlyn
03-30-2009, 09:47 AM
The pressure levels are useful for creating smoother transitions from strong to light touches.

guyanonymous
03-30-2009, 04:19 PM
Apart from pressure, I know that some tablets feature tilt sensitivity. Are there, really, any other features besides those that differentiate?

jfrazierjr
03-30-2009, 05:01 PM
Apart from pressure, I know that some tablets feature tilt sensitivity. Are there, really, any other features besides those that differentiate?


Many come with some number of quick keys, as well as a scroll type device. The quick keys can come in very handy for doing all sorts of operations, but not really required. The scroll device however is very nice in being able to move the map or zoom in an out quickly, depending on how you map the input.

guyanonymous
03-30-2009, 05:32 PM
What is the least expensive tablet out there these days with tilt?

I have the original USB Graphire, which still works nicely, but am always curious about my options.

ravells
03-30-2009, 05:57 PM
I think it's the Bamboo...but I could be wrong on this.

jfrazierjr
03-30-2009, 07:54 PM
I think it's the Bamboo...but I could be wrong on this.

Unless I missed it somewhere, the Bamboo does not have tilt. The easiest way to check is to go to Wacom's site. For the visual people out there, they even have video demos of each model.

cancerlad
04-02-2009, 09:29 AM
A tablet is one of the things on my shopping (luxury) list. I used to be a talented young artist, but that was a long time ago, and I haven't done anything remotely similar to painting in nearly twenty years (note that I'm a shade below thirty). I'm getting back into it, and I'm excited about the prospect.

Ascension
04-02-2009, 05:06 PM
The same applies for me, to some extent, as well cancerlad. I can honestly say that since I've found my long lost tablet that I haven't had as much fun since I was a kid and it has definitely brought it all back to me. No need to get some big expensive one, just one to get the juices flowin again and you will love it.

RobA
04-03-2009, 10:43 AM
Speaking of tablets---

Anyone seen this: http://usb.brando.com.hk/prod_detail.php?prod_id=00855

Watch the video of the "tablo" in action.

I don't think it has pressure sensitivity, and not sure of the accuracy, but it could be neat...

-Rob A>

RPMiller
04-03-2009, 11:42 AM
Very interesting... That might be a purchase for my next bonus check... which means a few years. I wonder if it might have pressure sensitivity of some sort. When you watch him draw the lines appear to have thickness differences, and the color is not always solid.

cancerlad
04-03-2009, 11:50 AM
No tax return for me. Bamboo Fun going on birthday wish list...

Midgardsormr
04-03-2009, 03:21 PM
Very interesting... That might be a purchase for my next bonus check... which means a few years. I wonder if it might have pressure sensitivity of some sort. When you watch him draw the lines appear to have thickness differences, and the color is not always solid.

I rather doubt it. Since you're applying the stylus to the notebook's LCD screen, I'd think increasing the pressure would be a Bad Idea™.

It looks like it probably works in a fashion similar to that interactive whiteboard hack for the Wiimote we saw a while back: http://johnnylee.net/projects/wii/

edit: watching that video again, I wonder if it uses distance from the screen as "pressure" and a button for clicking rather than surface contact like a drawing tablet.

RPMiller
04-03-2009, 03:40 PM
Yes, I agree. He uses it on the pad of paper at one point as well. I think you are correct about it being "height" from the "surface" rather than pressure. That would definitely take some getting used to.

Ascension
04-03-2009, 04:25 PM
Drawing on thin air might take a whole heckuva lot of getting used to for me since I have a slight jitter in my wrist.

CBDroege
04-04-2009, 01:08 AM
The pressure sensitivity may be in the pen.

RPMiller
04-04-2009, 01:55 AM
I don't know... that would require pushing on the LCD screen which as previously mentioned is a Bad Thing.

waldronate
04-04-2009, 10:57 AM
The product documentation mentions "Perfect brush effect by speed pressure technology" which implies that it's speed cued for pressure. Generally you're applying less pressure as you move the stylus faster. My biggest concern for laptop use would be wearing out the plastic screen cover because they're not designed for that sort of use. You'd need to get some sort of hard surface to cover your screen, I'd think.

I'm not sure if it's capacitance or optically base but it's still a cute little beastie, on par with the projection keyboards for PDAs that were developed some years back.

The batteries would likely be a big expense in the long term.

RPMiller
04-04-2009, 11:22 AM
Since he uses it on a pad a paper, I'm thinking it is optically based. Yea, I agree about the batteries. I continuously look at battery expense now whenever looking at any sort of portable device for both reasons of expense and environmental impact.

Ascension
05-12-2009, 12:23 AM
Well, from a carpal tunnel point of view I'd stick with the pencil scan...you can never really beat that in my opinion. Once you develop some proficiency with a tablet it's just as good and saves you from having to scan things in and adjust the contrast...more of a time-saver kind of thing there. With the vast amount of custom brushes available for the software there are countless things that you can do with a tablet that you cannot do by hand. So I'd say, get one and be sure to take the time and force yourself to get used to it (they can be kind of quirky at first).

RPMiller
05-12-2009, 01:27 AM
Jerry was a spam bot...

Ascension
05-12-2009, 01:44 AM
Really? I thought his few posts at least made sense. Oh well.

RPMiller
05-12-2009, 09:29 AM
The post to this thread was the only one that came close to making sense except for all the typos and then the tell tale links in a "sig block" that wasn't in the signature area, but in the post itself. That is a dead giveaway.

PixelFish
05-23-2009, 01:16 PM
My experience: I have had three Wacoms and none of their pens ever wore out. (The reason I had three is because the first (the first Intuos) was a gift from a friend, but it wasn't a USB tablet. The second was a graphire to bundle in with my laptop--it was OK, but I prefer the Intuoses. And my current tablet is a USB Intuos 3. Oh, and once somebody gave me a crappy no-name tablet that didn't work with mostly everything and which stopped being supported driver-wise after about six months. I used the thing maybe half a dozen times. So yeah, call me a Wacom fangirl.

Now, I did without a tablet for a number of years, so I can paint with a mouse, and will, depending on what I am doing. If I am doing anything that requires a lot of paths, I'm actually much better and quicker with the mouse. I use a mouse when I'm in Illustrator (icons, base shapes for decorative elements) and a tablet for textures, inking, etc.

I know some people who use the tablet for everything except actual keyboard strokes, and they swear by it. (They also swear it reduced their carpal tunnel.)

cmnmd
05-24-2009, 12:57 PM
This is a good topic.

I personally swear by my Wacom tablet. I do ALL of my work with it. I first got introduced to one in 1993 during my internship and it was amazing working on 2 screens having a 12" x "18 workspace to draw with. I have since moved to a 6" x 8" Intuos 2 and it has been a champ for 8 years. The tip has never worn or needed to be replaced and this is even a refurbished model.

Granted there are a ton of new features with the new tablets and they are very appealing. The ability to twist the tablet and have the screen react is amazing. The interactive/programmable button are good for shortcuts and often used actions (see the online videos). I have not used these being that I am a quick-key freak in PS. In short, it is an invaluable addition to anyone's workspace.

lynx_child
06-15-2009, 06:38 PM
Does anyone notice any differences in how various programs work with tablets (other than the feature in Gimp that has different default tools for different input devices)? It's been awhile since I used Photoshop, but I seem to remember it being easier to use the tablet in Photoshop than Gimp.

RPMiller
06-17-2009, 03:48 PM
I don't have any experience with GIMP so I couldn't comment on its differences, but PhotoShop can be set to use different tools for different devices. In fact, I believe most apps can, because each device is set in the Wacom software manager.

lynx_child
06-18-2009, 12:43 AM
I don't have Photoshop, though I used to (I used it at school). I remember loving using my tablet with Photoshop. It seemed to work perfectly. I have recently tried using it with Gimp, and find that the tablet suddenly feels unwieldy and the drawing is not as easy as I seem to remember. It doesn't seem to be malfunctioning in any way, though. That's why I wondered if they behave differently in different programs.

I also don't have a Wacom. To be honest, I don't know what brand my tablet is. It was given as a gift (from a friend who received it as a gift and never used it). I can't find the box it came on, and it doesn't look like either the pen or the tablet has a brand name on it.

Here are the details if anyone knows what it is:
There's a sticker on the back that says WP5540(U), but image searching that pulls up a bunch of tablets that don't look like my tablet. It's dark blue, the screen is not perfectly rectangular but is more of a curved inverted trapezoid and has a grid sheet overlaying it. There is an upraised semi-circle at the top with a hole for a pen, and the bottom of the tablet is artistically curved outwards at both ends and in the center.

RobA
06-18-2009, 01:02 AM
It is known that the tablet is "slower" to respond in gimp than in photoshop. This especially a problem with large (or scaled up) brushes.

Ideally, use the ink and airbrush tools with the tablet, as they are optimized for it.

-Rob A>

lynx_child
06-18-2009, 12:13 PM
Awesome, thanks for responding!

misteradam
06-21-2009, 10:36 PM
I find using a tablet increases workflow exponentially for me. Not only can I draw with it, it's easier to erase with, and the shortcut keys on the intuos3 are really useful.

I'm speaking for photoshop and autocad here, not sure how it interacts with GIMP.

CBDroege
06-25-2009, 09:21 AM
it's easier to erase with
this x 1000

ScriptKitty
07-13-2009, 02:22 AM
I've had an old Wacom Graphire (no, not Graphire2, or Graphire3, just an original, ancient Graphire), and I believe it's the smallest size they make... And for Photoshop, I've never felt as though I've needed more. When it comes to cartography, I probably use stylus and mouse about 50/50... There are some precision things I'd rather use the mouse for, and 'organic' things I can accomplish more naturally with the stylus.

When it comes to my artwork, I always used my stylus just for coloring. Now that I've begun to work in vector, I do wish I had a bigger tablet, but it's still really quite usable. Again, I find myself drawing at first with the stylus, then making corrections and tweaks with my mouse (or touchpoint in the case of my laptop).

Photoshop's use of pressure-sensitive tools with a stylus is awesome, and I've heard good things about styluses with tilt-sensitivity too. And yes, erasing is as easy as flipping the stylus around, just like a pencil.

Alfar
07-13-2009, 02:31 AM
I enjoy working with my tablet in the Gimp. I was silly and bought an a4 oversized tablet, though, and that's giving me a bit of grief in that I can barely reach the far right corner.

Gimp doesn't like it when I switch the tablet to mouse mode, however. That is a bit of a limitation, but it's still good.

ScriptKitty
07-13-2009, 10:01 AM
Oh yeah, that reminds me... The mouse that came with my tablet was pathetic, I used it only a year, maybe year and a half tops. I wore the darn thing out clicking with it. When my dad pried the lil bugger open to see if he could repair it, we found that it wasn't a matter of a piece of plastic wearing... The circuit board on the inside actually warped on one corner. So, for the last... I dunno... Five years or so, I've been using my wacom stylus in addition to a normal, USB optical mouse. I prefer it to the one that was limited to my tablet actually, because it gives me considerably more range of movement.

Alfar
07-13-2009, 01:14 PM
I don't use the wacom mouse either. The tablet can be in pen mode, where each point on the tablet corresponds to the same point on the screen at all times, or in mouse mode, where I can lift the pen off the tablet and put it back somewhere else and I'm still pointing at the same point on screen - like I can do with a mouse. "Mouse mode" just doesn't seem to work well with the Gimp, it's like it keeps thinking I'm in pen mode, so I'm drawing somewhere where my cursor isn't pointing. Could be my config of old tablet and Vista, tho, haven't dug too deep into the issue.

CBDroege
07-13-2009, 03:46 PM
I used the mouse that came with my tablet for about five minutes, and it has sat on the back of my electronics shelf since then. I don't think anyone uses those things.

Aidan
07-14-2009, 05:40 PM
mice in the form of pens have been around for several years. Has anyone tried them for drawing and how do they work compared to tablet and a regular mouse?

Alfar
07-15-2009, 05:43 AM
I've tried a couple of pen mice, but only very cheap ones (I guess price would be the only reason one would buy one of those over a tablet in the first place). Those sucked. They control worse than a normal mouse because they have a smaller ball, and they don't feel at all like a pen because it doesn't have pressure sensitivity, only click or not clicked. Also, with the tablet, I can hover the pen quite a bit above the tablet and move around the cursor, while the "pen mouse" has to touch the surface to actually move the cursor. I didn't use them for very long, and in the end just waited till I had the bucks for a tablet.

len
08-10-2009, 09:08 AM
I bought a Bamboo a couple of days ago and i love the thing, i was affraid that he size would be to small (had an older Intuos A3 before) but the bamboo is so much better the smaller sice is way more practical, the drawing surface wich has a paper feel is so much beter that that plastic on plastic feel on the old intuos. and i love the that its smaller i almost never used the bloody intuos simply becouse it was to big, it took half my desk and i felt like a world explorer going from one side of the thing to the other, i really did not like it. and then im not even bringing up the price of both tablets...

i say, anyone who is considering buying a tablet, go for the wacom Bamboo medium.

Tear
08-10-2009, 10:05 AM
I know exactly what you mean.
I also had a really old Intuos A3 that I got really cheap. I rarely used it though, because it was too unwieldy to get out for a quick sketch.
Now I use an A5 Wide. It's always plugged in and usually rests on top of the scanner right next to the monitor, so I can simply grab it when I need it.
It's the perfect size for me. Anything bigger would be too cumbersome.

wally-d-feed
08-12-2009, 07:37 PM
I guess I am a little bit lucky for I am left handed so I can draw with my left hand on the tablet. Because most other people use their right hand for the mouse, and because I started computing with other peoples machines I am used to using my right hand for the mouse. therefore I have a stylus in the left hand and a mouse in the right hand ... this is most of the times quite awsome except when i subconsciously start trying to use both at the same time :D

sightpress
08-26-2009, 04:12 AM
I use the mouse, but i have used a tablet for some other softwares like zbrush. It is pretty easy to handle.

RPMiller
10-21-2009, 10:24 PM
For anyone interested in a really inexpensive tablet there is one available right now on Tanga, but it is likely to go quick.

DigiPro 4x3" USB Graphics Tablet w/Cordless Pen
$19.99+$6.99 shipping

http://tanga.com/products/digipro-4x3-usb-graphics-tablet-w-cordless-pen

vernontwinkie
10-22-2009, 08:47 PM
Hi guys, sorry for my absence. I've been a bit busy lately. I was curious if anyone else has a digipro tablet? I just got mine today and LOVE it. I'm doing just about everything with it so I can get used to it. One problem I'm having-there's the tip, two buttons on the side (programmable one is right-click, other is double-click) and then there's a button on the eraser-end. I can't find out how to program it to be the eraser, but I've seen online that's what it's used for... any clues?

Gidde
10-22-2009, 09:35 PM
It depends on which program you're using it in. I use gimp more than anything else, and gimp remembers the eraser and pen tip tools you've chosen separately. Very handy when sketching :)

Ramah
10-23-2009, 07:18 AM
I have a bamboo and my pen also has an eraser on the other end. With that all I have to do it turn it around and use it like I would an eraser on a pencil. It just uses the setting to which your eraser is set up in the software, even if eraser isn't currently selected.
I didn't have to change anything in the software to get this to work.

vernontwinkie
10-23-2009, 11:10 AM
I think the software is my problem. It's a Digipro T-6000U. There's the disk that came with it, and no other drivers available for it. All I find are page after page of people complaining about the lack of drivers. When I open up the Control Panel for the Tablet, it shows the pen: tip is gray as it's not customizable, side buttons are highlighted in blue and can be customized, and the eraser button is lit up as blue too-only I can't click it to change it, and there isn't even a drop-down box TO change it. The eraser does nothing when flipped over to be used and nothing when I press the button. I've even tried holding it down to while sketching to see if that's how they wanted it used and nothing. I'll Screen Shot the window for the control panel when I get home and post it so you guys can see what I mean. Not a huge problem, as it's only an extra click to erase, but still, I'd like it if stuff worked like it should. lol.

Edit: I've done some research and found that Digipro is owned by UC-Logic but they don't even feature it on their site! The only drive update they have is a generic "Tablet Driver" that doesn't resolve the problem.

http://www.uc-logic.com/products/products.htm

drswanz
11-10-2009, 04:02 PM
I want to buy DigiPro T6000U, but as i see there are some problems with driver for this tablet. I spent some time in the web, and I think that drivers for this tablet is avaible not from UC-Logic but from AIPTEK http://www.aiptek.com/drivers/hp6u/ for HyperPen 6000U .
And I want to ask the owner of DigiPro T6000U will this drivers resolve the problem, or not?
P.S. Sorry for my bad English :)

vernontwinkie
11-17-2009, 08:34 PM
Actually, the problems don't really lie with the driver. The problem with the Digipro T6000U (that I have) is that the "eraser" button isn't an actual button. Past that, the tablet works great. You've found that Digipro is owned by UC-Logic and no doubt you've seen that they don't even acknowledge that they make the T6000U. The driver that they offer is a generic driver for ANY tablet. It's not a bad deal for a tablet, but you may want to go with another model and get the full driver support. FYI: my tablet still works great!

And your English is just fine.

Immolate
11-21-2009, 08:57 PM
I just received a Bamboo pen and touch from my wife for my birthday. So far it's been quite interesting, but I've just gone through the tutorial and haven't done anything with PS just yet. I'll let you know what I think. This is my first tablet.

Ascension
11-21-2009, 11:48 PM
Congrats Imm.

Coyotemax
11-22-2009, 03:46 AM
congrats! i hope you have as much fun with it as i ended up having with mine :) It really is a whole new world :P

mearrin69
11-30-2009, 12:09 PM
Here's what my wonderful wife had waiting for my birthday (Saturday)! Couldn't use my old Intuos(1) anymore because my new computer lacks a serial port so I've been rolling with my Graphire for a while now. The Intuos4 medium is sheer beauty. Also, it came with some PS brushes, and my choice of PS Elements, Corel Painter Sketchpad, or Autodesk Sketchbook Express 2010. I went with the latter two and both are pretty cool.

I highly recommend this guy. The feel is very different and it comes with variety of nibs that I haven't had a chance to try out yet. Some say that the nibs wear out more quickly because of the surface of the pad. Can't comment on that until I use it a bit more. IMO, paying for more nibs is worth the improved feel.

Oh, yeah, she also got me CS4 but I suspect that eats into my Christmas budget :) Hopefully it'll arrive someday soon...eager to try out that 64-bit thing to see if it's any more efficient.
M

Ascension
11-30-2009, 05:01 PM
When you're done with her can you send her my way so that she can buy me a cool new tablet? :) Kidding. Great stuff, you lucky guy.

mearrin69
11-30-2009, 09:16 PM
Heh. Well, I've got to keep her at least until the box with PS4 arrives :) After that? We can negotiate. LOL.
M

N.B. I can joke about this here because I am absolutely *sure* that she does not come to these forums. :)

Coyotemax
11-30-2009, 09:46 PM
I can confirm that the nibs appear to wear down quicker than one might expect them to on the Intuos4. I thought maybe it was just a manufacturing flaw or something, the first nib was noticeably worn after less than a week. I swapped them out to see, and the second one went as well (though a bit slower, I'm learning to use a much lighter touch now, heh).

I still haven't tried the other nibs yet.


[edit] Ok, just tested them. the grey ones that are suppose to feel like pencil don't really seem any different to me. perhaps if I overlayed some paper over the tablet. The black one with the white tip is nice though - has a very smooth light feel to it while drawing, lots of control over the pressure.

I fell in love with the light grey soft one with the spring in the nib. it's very responsive. I'll have to see about tracking down those ones as replacement nibs, hopefully they're not TOO expensive :)

[edit again] I take back what I said about the felt tip. After leaving it in and working with it for awhile, I did notice a subtle difference, enough that I won't be going back to the standard nibs again unless i have to :) And the nibs themselves are decently priced. the felt ones are $5 for a 5pack, same price as the standard nibs. The Stroke nibs (with the springs) are about twice that.

mearrin69
11-30-2009, 10:47 PM
Cool. Thanks for the info on the nibs...was wondering about that. Will try out some of the other ones and order some replacements of the ones I like.

I had to turn up the pressure sensitivity because I was bearing down so hard to get a stroke. Reckon that'll make my nibs last a little longer at least.

Did yours have a mouse? I find using mine is sort of like painting with a stone for some reason. It just seems really heavy or "stuck" to the tablet or something. Maybe a sensitivity adjustment would help there too.

Finally, anyone tried out the other tools? That airbrush looks cool but I never use airbrush brushes in paint programs so I don't know if I even want to open that can of worms.
M

Coyotemax
11-30-2009, 11:42 PM
I haven't tried any other pens, so yeah.

The mouse.. I don't really use it. I just use the pen now. I suppose i could turn up the sensitivity (I did notice it seems unwieldy) but what's the point if I'm using the pen for everything anyhow :) Typically I'm on the laptop when i'm using this, and because of my injury (yes, still having issues, it just flared up again, i think the second disc finally ruptured)) I'm laying on my back most of the time. I have the tablet on the bed next to me at about hip level where it's comfortable for me to reach with the pen, and to be honest I haven't been using the buttons on the pad much. I use the scroll thingy to zoom in and out on occasion but that's about it. I'm still using the key shortcuts from the laptop for the most part.

I will say that once I got used to the pen, I hated the mouse. It felt like I was working with a curling stone :)

Really, I found the best way to train yourself for the pen (besides the drawing), go to albinoblacksheep.com and head into the flash games section. there's a few that work really well with the pen.

By the way if you're using Firefox, there's a plugin you can get called Grab and Drag. I ***highly*** recommend it if you browse with your tablet :) Works with mice too, but it really shines with the pen.

mearrin69
11-30-2009, 11:45 PM
The buttons are great (maybe not for your situation) and I've been able to mostly replace my "hand on the keyboard" working style with them. Think I'll change the display toggle/precision mode buttons to something I use more frequently.

I really like being able to change brush size with the ring control. Looking forward to CS4 as I think the rotate canvas setting works in it...doesn't seem to in CS2.
M

Midgardsormr
12-01-2009, 01:45 AM
There is no rotate canvas in CS3 or earlier; it was introduced with CS4 and its OpenGL acceleration feature. Unfortunately, that particular feature has been one of the biggest sources of problems with CS4. An awful lot of users don't even have the option of rotating their canvas because their video cards slow things down instead of speeding them up.

Anyway, I, also, am very jealous—my (wife's) Intuos3 is terrific, and it's so well-made that I can't quite rationalize an upgrade.

mearrin69
12-01-2009, 01:51 AM
Well, Intuos3 is a heck of a lot better than my Graphire or my ancient Intuos(no number) so I probably wouldn't have upgraded either. :)

Scary news about CS4. I'm hoping my card is good enough - GeForce 9600 GT. I think that's only one generation old so maybe it's got enough juice.
M

Midgardsormr
12-01-2009, 03:59 PM
Don't worry, even without the acceleration, there's enough new stuff in CS4 to be worth the upgrade. And I'm not sure that video card power has much to do with it; I've got a top-of-the-line Radeon, 64-bit Photoshop, an i7 CPU, and 12GB of RAM, and I have trouble from time to time. I don't need the rotation feature or 3d painting for what I do, though, so I just turned OpenGL off.

pickaboo
12-13-2009, 03:23 PM
I just finally got myself to buying a Bamboo pen&tablet because there's been a long break from cartography and I'm sure that I'll be mapping more on the holidays. It feels great to feel really drawing with that pad.

Jaxilon
12-25-2009, 03:39 PM
This thread goes on forever. Do we have a quick breakdown for someone looking to buy a tablet?

I have it in mind to pick one up in the next month or so but no good idea what I need. I do not have thousands to spend on one so are there some tablet "rules" I should look for when I go to purchase? If need be I will save up for it.

I am just beginning to get into art on the PC and do not know how far I will go with it. If I really like it I may eventually try to make some money from it but for now it's more hobby. I guess I can upgrade later but I would like to get some good mileage from my first purchase if possible.

Maybe we need a survey of what tablets folks use and how happy they are with them? Then again, this might be an easily answered question for those of you in the know.

Thanks all!