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Cool as a Cucumber
07-12-2009, 05:19 PM
I'm looking for some sort of tool for GIMP, Photoshop, or PaintNET (that last one is unlikely) that will allow me to make a randomized line or perhaps even a randomized shape that looks like topography. I created a map in Fractal Mapper 8 (seen here (http://img3.imagebanana.com/img/zmmc8ab4/map.png)) that utilizes these sorts of tools which was great for my concept, but actually making it look pretty is something the program is not very good at.

Ideally I want to make the borders glow (like this (http://www.cartographersguild.com/feature/NarthaineMap.jpg)) as well, but I'm also going to need to put rivers on the map as well as make other modifications. I took a look at the GIMP tutorials, but none of them mentioned a randomized line tool like what I need.

Gandwarf
07-12-2009, 05:31 PM
So I can't actually help you... but welcome to the Guild. And your name rocks :D

Cool as a Cucumber
07-12-2009, 05:39 PM
So I can't actually help you... but welcome to the Guild. And your name rocks :D
Well since you liked my name so much I went ahead and put on my avatar too.

Gandwarf
07-12-2009, 05:51 PM
Well since you liked my name so much I went ahead and put on my avatar too.

Oh man. Please stay on our forum :D
Someone help him!

Redrobes
07-12-2009, 06:05 PM
Yeah that avatar is the best. Certainly now that Arcana changed from the Black Metal god... hah.

Right, well I am no Gimp expert but I think it can render a filter of clouds and then you just do a contrast stretch to black and white and that gets you a random shape. There is also my free app instant Islands which does this sort of thing...

http://www.viewing.ltd.uk/cgi-bin/viewingdale.pl?category=instant_islands

The brute force way is to create a small - say 32x32 bit of greyscale noise map and then upsample it to 64x64, smooth it slightly and then add a little bit more noise and then upsample to 128x128 and keep repeating that until its big enough. You can tweak it at any stage by hinting it lighter or darker as required.

In Gimp there is also supposed to be some kind of render random map mode too where it paints the land in green and the sea in blue too. All with one click.

To glow the border the usual method is to take the land and mega blur it. Then add back in the land again. So get the land in the glow color with sea being the same as the normal land map. Mega blur it and then select just the land from the original and paste over the blurred one at the same coords as it was in before.

Cool as a Cucumber
07-12-2009, 06:12 PM
I'm not sure I quite understand how to glow the borders like you described, but I'm guessing this mega blur thing yields bolder edges than other blurs and I need to use layers and opacity?

Anyway, pertaining to the terrain stuff, the issue I'm having isn't generating terrain - I'm already able to do that easily with Fractal Mapper 8. It's generating topographic lines (not shapes) for rivers and borders in GIMP or Photoshop.

Redrobes
07-12-2009, 06:21 PM
I was waiting for something so I knocked off a few images. This is for the rand terrain. Ok so its quick and dirty and the amounts of noise need to be tweaked down a bit cos its a bit over the top. I'll do the glow in a mo...

Redrobes
07-12-2009, 06:28 PM
Heres quickie steps. Start with some terrain, generate glow colored version, blur it a lot, select original land and paste on top. Again, this is my super quick attempt and probably needs more finesse but thats it basically.

Cool as a Cucumber
07-12-2009, 06:30 PM
Heres quickie steps. Start with some terrain, generate glow colored version, blur it a lot, select original land and paste on top. Again, this is my super quick attempt and probably needs more finesse but thats it basically.
Oh, I see. Actually, I was looking to make the glow to be inside the borders like in the picture I linked, not outside. That's why I was confused.

Redrobes
07-12-2009, 06:32 PM
Same process but cut out the sea and paste back on instead of the land so that the glow goes into the land instead.

I think you need to do this on layers and mask each region out one by one and add in the glow a little at the end. But yeah its basically take the shape, blur it, mask out off the shape so that your left with just the blur that went into it and put in as a layer. Maybe multiply it with a constant color like red to get a red glow.

Ascension
07-12-2009, 07:38 PM
This can be done in PS, and quite easily too. I stumbled upon it while experimenting in my secret lab last year. Filter-render-clouds (pic1). Filter-artistic-cutout. Filter-stylize-find edges. It produces what you see in pic 2; looks like contour lines. Even easier, is what's in pic 3, same clouds but then Filter-stylize-trace contour; makes a continent outline.

Cool as a Cucumber
07-12-2009, 08:51 PM
I really hate to sound like I'm beating a dead horse, but making continents was never a problem thanks to FM8. What I need is to be able to draw a line in GIMP or Photoshop, and then have it becoming 'fractaled'.

Ascension
07-12-2009, 10:12 PM
Don't know of any way to do just a line. The only thing I can think of is to draw a white shape on a black background. Yer gonna say, "I need a line" but hold on, we'll make the black and white edge become a line. In PS hit the filter-pixellate-crystalize, set the size around 24, then repeat this process at lower increments (12, then 6, then 3). Adjust the brightness all the way up, (image-adjustments-brightness/contrast)...this creates a random shape based on the rough white shape we started with. If it's too pointy or spikey then hit filter-noise-median and set that anywhere between 3-10 and this will round off the points. Delete the black (select-color range=black, hit the delete key). Now since we just have our white shape left we turn the opacity of the layer all the way down to zero and then add a layer style of stroke and there you have a random black line. It's kind of long but if you turn it into an action then it's way easy...draw a shape hit the button.

Cool as a Cucumber
07-12-2009, 10:54 PM
Don't know of any way to do just a line. The only thing I can think of is to draw a white shape on a black background. Yer gonna say, "I need a line" but hold on, we'll make the black and white edge become a line. In PS hit the filter-pixellate-crystalize, set the size around 24, then repeat this process at lower increments (12, then 6, then 3). Adjust the brightness all the way up, (image-adjustments-brightness/contrast)...this creates a random shape based on the rough white shape we started with. If it's too pointy or spikey then hit filter-noise-median and set that anywhere between 3-10 and this will round off the points. Delete the black (select-color range=black, hit the delete key). Now since we just have our white shape left we turn the opacity of the layer all the way down to zero and then add a layer style of stroke and there you have a random black line. It's kind of long but if you turn it into an action then it's way easy...draw a shape hit the button.
At that point I might as well draw it in Fractal Mapper and screencap it..

Greason Wolfe
07-13-2009, 08:53 AM
Not sure how much this will help, but you might take a look at RobA's "Creating an Artistic Regional Map . . . " tutorial for GIMP (original thread : http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?t=1142 ). With just a tiny bit of alteration, it might be able to accomplish what it sounds like you are looking for.

GW

msa
07-13-2009, 10:03 AM
At that point I might as well draw it in Fractal Mapper and screencap it..

Can't you save the FM screen as an image? My GM uses autorealms for mapping, which has a fractal line/shape tool like you describe. To pretty it up in gimp, I just took his landmasses and saved them as a BMP in the resolution I needed (7200x4800 and 3600x2400). Then I brought it into GIMP to do all the artistic stuff.

There isn't a GIMP tool like that that I know of. You might get some traction out of select->distort but I haven't been satisfied with it. When I need a fractal-looking line, I usually draw it by hand :(

jfrazierjr
07-13-2009, 12:01 PM
Ok, so you are trying to do two things correct?



Create you continent(done) with topography to indicate height
Create a country border region with an inner glow to differentiate each country(which might(will) cut across topography lines.)

Is that right? If so, step one... import your existing map into GIMP. Use the magic wand tool to select each country. Add a new layer and use the Stroke selection to create an outline of that section. Repeat for each country so you have each country on a separate layer.

Back in Fractal Mapper, remove all country borders(so you maintain the shape only) and add in your topographical lines and optionally, the colors. Export to png.


Open the second exported map, copy the layer and paste into your original map as a new layer. Now you have both. Now select each country layer and add the inner glow effect. Depending on how many topo layers you need this should take no more than 20 minutes or so.

Karro
07-13-2009, 01:14 PM
Ok, so you are trying to do two things correct?



Create you continent(done) with topography to indicate height
Create a country border region with an inner glow to differentiate each country(which might(will) cut across topography lines.)



As I understand it, he is also trying to do a 3rd thing:

3. Create a single, non-looping randomized, fractal-style line to represent a river on the continent he's already created in FM.

I would think you could use the cloud filters for this purpose as well, though it might be more trouble than it's worth. You could probably adapt some of the techniques used in RobA's various GIMP tutorials to do this (there's one that he uses to create a very stark, randomized black line on a cloud filter that could probably be used, but I'm not sure how practical it would be). However, the learning curve to do so in GIMP might be sufficiently steep that it could be better to draw the rivers in by hand.

Cool as a Cucumber
07-13-2009, 03:08 PM
As I understand it, he is also trying to do a 3rd thing:

3. Create a single, non-looping randomized, fractal-style line to represent a river on the continent he's already created in FM.

I would think you could use the cloud filters for this purpose as well, though it might be more trouble than it's worth. You could probably adapt some of the techniques used in RobA's various GIMP tutorials to do this (there's one that he uses to create a very stark, randomized black line on a cloud filter that could probably be used, but I'm not sure how practical it would be). However, the learning curve to do so in GIMP might be sufficiently steep that it could be better to draw the rivers in by hand.
Yeah, what this guy said. I guess I'm just going to have to do the rivers in Fractal Mapper.

RobA
07-13-2009, 03:32 PM
I find it easiest to do rivers in Inkscape, as it is vector based and does have functions like fractalizing lines/shapes.

There is a tutorial on the site on using fractalize and inkscape to cerate rivers.

-Rob A>

Hai-Etlik
07-22-2009, 06:36 PM
Yeah, what this guy said. I guess I'm just going to have to do the rivers in Fractal Mapper.

Ah rivers: http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?t=5823&highlight=inkscape+river

It's Inkscape rather than The GIMP but that might help.

RobA
07-28-2009, 04:00 PM
I wrote you a gimp script, CaaC!

http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?p=71913

-Rob A>

JingJang
04-09-2013, 03:39 PM
RobA,

New User here so forgive any nOOb ignorance. :)

I'm really interested in your Fractalize Path Script. I got as far as installing the .scm file into the script directory. I restarted the script server, drew a quick line using the pencil, converted the line to a path. Now is where I'm stuck. I click on the Path tool and then right-click on the selected path - but I'm not getting the dialog box.

What am I missing? I'm betting it's something really simple. I looked around online for a video but of course all of the videos are for drawing "fractals" not using your script to convert a path to a fractalized line! I mean it sounds really simple - I'm just not seeing it.

Thanks for the script and thanks to anyone who can provide me with an answer.

RobA
04-09-2013, 04:40 PM
Now is where I'm stuck. I click on the Path tool and then right-click on the selected path - but I'm not getting the dialog box.

You need to have the Path Dialog open:
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and right click on the path in there to get the Path menu.

This page 2.3.*Paths Dialog (http://docs.gimp.org/en/gimp-path-dialog.html) describes how to get that dialog open and docked somewhere.

-Rob A>

JingJang
04-09-2013, 05:29 PM
Thank You sir!!

That's exactly what I needed - figured it was simple.

Now I'll need to experiment with getting the result back into a normal layer but I'll figure that out later.

I'll be using your script to make some dungeon maps, (Specifically the walls). I work in GIS but true cartographic design is something I've only toyed with. Still learning GIMP and all it can do. Thanks for this script though - it's going to make for much better looking walls!

Thanks Again!

jello195
06-14-2013, 08:50 PM
Yeah, what this guy said. I guess I'm just going to have to do the rivers in Fractal Mapper.

Well if you are open to using illustrator you can do this:

1. You draw a form vaguely ressembling the shape of whatever you want
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2. You select the part want (in this case it's the whole shape) and you go to filter→Distort→Zig Zag, then you set the intensity of the effect (generally you only need a small percentage).
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This should give you an altered shape that is more like what you initially wanted
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3. You copy/past it in photoshop, there are many options you can choose depending on the result you want. I usually paste it as a path.
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4. Then you fix the latest details and stroke the path. Here is an example of a map I made today for a game of D&D using this technique for the room 57-58-59.
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wisemoon
08-10-2014, 07:36 PM
Yeah, what this guy said. I guess I'm just going to have to do the rivers in Fractal Mapper.

I know I'm responding to an old thread, but in case anyone new checks this thread, I found a random fractal line generator online:
FractalMaker_exp (http://www.dangries.com/Flash/FractalMakerExp/FractalMaker_exp.html)

you can generate lines with varying numbers of segments, change the coordinates of the segment ends (for example, I made a zig-zag line to represent a winding river), etc. When you have a line you like, you can export it as a BMP or JPG file. You could then import that line into GIMP or Photoshop to use as a river.

I haven't yet tried the Inkscape fractalized line method, but I figure this is a quick fix for those who want a reasonably randomized, fractal river but aren't too terribly OCD about the details.
--wisemoon