View Full Version : [WIP] Antique Style World Map

12-20-2009, 04:17 PM
Okay first of all, I found this map (http://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/servlet/detail/RUMSEY~8~1~31510~1151092:-Composite-of--A-general-map-of-the?sort=Pub_List_No_InitialSort&qvq=w4s:/where/World/when/1804/;sort:Pub_List_No_InitialSort;lc:RUMSEY~8~1&mi=6&trs=26) quite a while ago and was absolutely blown away by all the extra information that's contained on it, beyond just a simple world map.

So I've blatantly borrowed the layout of that map, and I'm using it to create a map of my own world, which will eventually be similarly filled with charts of my own moon, solar system, descriptions of the tides, etc, etc.

Updates will be slow going, as I'm pretty much only working on this map while I'm at work :o but I have every intention of seeing this thing through to the bitter end. Currently, the latitude and longitude lines are only guidelines and will eventually be redrawn more appropriately to the style of the map.

I'm working in photoshop, and I've also used Hugin to convert my original map into a stereographic projection.


I've decided to also add a thumbnail of the current state of completion, so any newcomer to this thread doesn't have to wander through 10+ pages to find the most complete WIP ;)


12-20-2009, 04:19 PM
Oh yeah, and the copyright for the maps on davidrumsey.com allows them to be reused and adapted, as long as it's not for commerical purposes ;)

12-20-2009, 04:43 PM
Good luck my friend; you've just taken a bite of the most difficult type of map to make. Difficult because of the vast amount of text...naming all of that stuff will take quite some time. The style is also pretty difficult as well but you seem off to a good start. So keep on chuggin along :)

12-20-2009, 04:51 PM
Really looking forward to watching this one progress. :)

And I've never seen that map site before, what an amazing place.

12-20-2009, 05:39 PM
Thanks for the wishes Ascension, I do have a plan in place for naming, but it's still going to be a long time before I get any names on the map... I'm actually pretty excited about mapping the surface of a fictional moon. And actually figuring out what all the data on that map means so I can accurately reproduce it in reference to my world.

Ramah, hopefully I don't let you down ;) And yeah, davidrumsey.com is an amazing website, lots of fantastic stuff on there!

12-21-2009, 03:29 AM
this looks like an amazing approach to world building...

would you be able to post a blank template for folks to use for their own world mapping?

thanks for your work


Steel General
12-21-2009, 06:37 AM
Interesting...looking forward to seeing what you come up with.

12-22-2009, 12:20 PM
wow.. quite a challenging project but it looks like fun

12-22-2009, 05:05 PM
Figured I'd throw an update out, since I'm really pleased with how the continental outline turned out. I'm still only about 90% happy with the country borders - I'd like them to be a little less evenly spaced over the dotted borders, but they're still good enough for pancakes I guess.

@phillipstephen - I've already merged a bunch of layers in an attempt to my file size at a somewhat manageable level, but I'd imagine it shouldn't be too hard to borrow my first image and hit it with a magic wand a few time to get a serviceable template.

12-22-2009, 07:36 PM
That's coming along nicely...can't wait to see wjere this goes.

Steel General
12-22-2009, 07:37 PM
I think the national/country borders might be a bit thick/heavy - maybe reducing them some will make them more to your liking.

12-22-2009, 10:25 PM
Thanks Steel General ;) I shrunk the borders ever so slightly, and tweaked them some more with the selection tools and they're much less precise now.

12-23-2009, 04:38 PM
Next, you might want to lower the opacity on the borders...depending on what you want the final background paper color to be and how much labeling you're going to do. Good job so far.

12-23-2009, 06:58 PM
I've been planning on keeping the paper texture as is, though you can't really see it on the jpg from reducing the image size and saving it as a low quality jpg to be able to post it here :o

Do you know of a way to lower the transparency of a layer without losing all its saturation as well? I'd love to make those borders more transparent, but not if its going to turn the red into pink.

12-23-2009, 08:14 PM
Use blend modes, multiply should work well or hard light. The lighter colors might have to go on a different layer and use screen or overlay. But, for me, the saturation is the whole problem...the colors are very vivid. You might want that though so it's up to you.

12-23-2009, 11:55 PM
First, I decided to cut out the irrelevant parts of the map for this post, so I could post the relevant stuff at full size ;)

Ascension, I got a chance to look at my map on a different computer, and those borders look WAY brighter than they do on my laptop :shock: I toned them down a little, but I'm going to completely redo them after I've finished drawing the rivers, which I've started on up in the north east. I took a look at some of the tutorials here on tapering rivers, which didn't work for me, but led me to discover that I could fade opacity in the same way brush size can be faded, and I love it!

The main part of this update is to get thoughts on the mountains. They are quite small, but first and foremost, I'm attempting to recreate the style of the map I linked to in the first post, so it will take a lot of convincing to get me to make them bigger ;) I also put a Distort->Ripple 30% on the mountains to keep them from all looking identical. I'm not entirely sold on this yet and if anyone has any better ideas on that front I'd love to hear them.

12-25-2009, 12:10 PM
I think the map is quite good so far, but the mountains are very, very small.

12-25-2009, 05:18 PM
That is great so far; I love that style! Am I right in assuming that the red/yellow/green represent different continents and/or ethnic/cultural groupings? Looks like red is Europe, while yellow = Asia and green = Africa.

I like the way you've done your mountains, but the only thing I would suggest there is that you put more of them in (it's hard in some places to follow where the ranges are) and then maybe lower their overall opacity so they don't overwhelm the map.

edit: PS, would you mind if I snagged your first image post for use as a template?

12-25-2009, 07:50 PM
You're 100% correct there Diamond ;) I've based it heavily off of our own Earth at the beginning of the 19th century.

I was actually thinking of putting a very subtle shading underneath the mountains - nothing that really stands out, but just enough to unify them.

And feel free to use that first image as a template :)

12-25-2009, 09:13 PM
I was actually thinking of putting a very subtle shading underneath the mountains - nothing that really stands out, but just enough to unify them.
That could work quite nicely.

And feel free to use that first image as a template :)
Thanks, man.

12-26-2009, 09:12 PM
Here we are with another small update. The rivers are killing me. Between the original drawings of the landmass and this work, I believe this is the 4th time I've drawn them, and they're gettting more and more tedious :((

But enough whining! ;) I'm hoping for some comments on the shading under the mountains in the north east section of the map (and so that I can easily look at them myself from a different computer!). The goal is for them to be very subtle, but I'm worried I may have gone way too subtle.

By the way, thanks to everyone who's given me comments through this so far, they're all very much appreciated :)

12-26-2009, 09:32 PM
Yeah, I would say that's way too subtle. I had to stare at it for a good five minutes before I could pick up the shading.

12-26-2009, 10:21 PM
Quick update, darker mountain shading.

12-27-2009, 12:23 AM
The shading looks good to me, I wouldn't go any darker. Rivers are always tedious to draw but on this type of map they really help to sell it...details and labels are what the antique style is all about. Have fun with that and my condolences because labeling this puppy is going to drive you to the brink :) It looks really good so far so it will be worth it.

12-27-2009, 12:39 AM
Thanks Ascension ;) I don't even want to think about how many hours I'll have sunk into this by the time I finish it.... :((

12-28-2009, 11:07 AM
I am actually very fond of Mercatur style maps. I look forward to seeing this one develop. With the old style maps, A cluttered look when it comes to names is a look I like. They used to be big in naming things and putting it on their map. Not only is that syle appealing to me, but its fund looking close to see all the names and places. Its almost like one of those where is ..... puzzles.

Sorry rambling a bit,
Prolly cauz I love this style


12-28-2009, 01:05 PM
Well I expect you'll be pleased with the finished product Davros ;) I fully intend to leave the blank spaces few and far between! Names are starting to come along slowly... but it's going to be quite a while yet :((

12-29-2009, 02:14 AM
Mountains and rivers are finished, political borders re-done, and hopefully a little more muted this time around :mrgreen: Started figuring out some names... just scratching the surface so far...

So barring any earth-shattering comments, it'll probably be a while until the next update - likely when I get absolutely sick of naming things and get start on a map of the moon, or constellations or whatever :lol:

12-29-2009, 02:54 AM
Huh. Amazing what printing off a section of your map will tell you about what you need to fix, as opposed to looking at it on a computer monitor ;) So I'm going to darken up the mountains a smidge, and reduce the opacity on the borders a little, and moutarde's a happy man!

Hell, I'm already happy, looks even better than I thought it would printed out :)

12-29-2009, 12:50 PM
Looking verra nice. That's an all around great-looking landmass; so much character.

12-30-2009, 05:59 PM
This is more of a teaser than an update I suppose. Names are coming slowly but surely. And yes, the smallest font I've used is quite small. Barely legible when printed out. Oh well. If those places were important, they'd have gotten a bigger font! :lol:

This area of the world is loosely based on Italy at the end of the 18th century, before that Napolean guy got it into his head to create the kingdom of Etruria.

12-30-2009, 09:32 PM
Silly Napoleon! What on earth was he thinking, anyway? xD

Looks great so far! I just love the whole idea of this, and as annoying as I find really tiny text on paper, its fine on the computer screen. xD

01-02-2010, 02:36 PM
First attempt at the map of the surface of the moon. Would love to hear some comments and/or suggestions, as I'm still not really sold on what I've done so far. Keep in mind I would still need to add some craters to this, and that I'm trying to emulate the selenograph from the map that I linked in the first post.

Fire away! :)

01-03-2010, 10:23 PM
Is this supposed to be our moon or "a moon"?

Because astro-physically speaking... our moon is a serious oddball.

01-03-2010, 11:42 PM
The idea is to make it a moon that's very similar to the Earth's moon. Basically what I've done is created a couple layers of parallel lines and a layer with the image of a random moon I made, and then just cut chunks out of the various layers of parallel lines with a color range selection from the original image of the moon.

I'm only kind of happy with how the image I posted here looks, I feel like it's missing something, but I'm not really sure what...

01-04-2010, 08:58 PM
Well our moon, unlike a lot of moons in general, has been colliding with asteroids on a regular basis for a LONG period of time. So most of its features are effectively circular, the only variation being based on which circles get layered over each other (the new asteroid strikes rub out the older ones). So you won't get as many of the "continent shapes" that earth has.

01-04-2010, 10:25 PM
I've actually started a new thread over in the scifi section of the forum, and have received a lot of good tips on mapping a moon with a lot more craters in it. I still havn't had a chance to put any of that into practice yet, but I'm hoping to a much better looking moon within the next week or so :)

01-05-2010, 03:44 PM
I think you have a fantastic project here and you have done some great work. The only thing I am not crazy about is how the map distorts colse tot he North and South poles. Thats just my opinion though and I think it still looks great regardless!

01-05-2010, 10:52 PM
I'll admit that I'm not a huge fan of it either, but my goal is to create a map that could have honestly been drawn and seen widespread use in 1800. Granted, the world I'm drawing isn't Earth, but it's very heavily influenced by it, and the Lambert azimuthal projection was created around 1775 or so, which I think is probably too close to 1800...

As far as the distortion goes though, just wait till I post the eastern hemisphere - it's much for severe for that half of the world...

01-10-2010, 03:46 PM
Yeah, I've been lazy lately ;) Tired of naming, frustrated with the moon, scared to start drawing rivers and mountains in the second hemisphere, daunted by drawing constellation maps and too lazy to learn the math to create realistic values for the other planets in the solar system! :((

Anyways, here's a look at the entire map as it currently stands, rather than the smaller bits I've been uploading recently.

01-10-2010, 06:40 PM
When I get tired of doing something over n over, whether it's drawing mountains or naming things, I take a lil tv break and then come back and force myself to do a little part, like a country, and then take another break. Or I come here and see what new posts are up :) Bottom line is that I force myself to work in little bits so it doesn't seem so bad and I still feel like I accomplished something. The map looks awesome so far and I hope you find the inner strength to finish it.

01-10-2010, 07:34 PM
I agree wholeheartedly with Ascension.

01-11-2010, 02:38 AM
Thanks for the encouragement :) I'll get it finished (unless a bus finishes me or something like that :D ), I've just got a little burnout going on at the moment. Maybe I'll work on the filler text for a while...

01-11-2010, 05:09 AM
This one is shaping up to be pretty amazing. :)

01-12-2010, 07:51 PM
Little update, started working on a small Mercator projection of the world that will be getting tucked away into the bottom left corner of the main map. Mr Cremere is this world's fictional inventor of the projection style we know as Mercator :?:

Of course, this tiny lil map still needs rivers and labels and political borders and a whole slew of other blechiness ;)

01-19-2010, 11:02 PM
Lookin' good, man. Keep it up!

01-19-2010, 11:51 PM
I like the shading style you gave your coasts. It looks very period.

Great map so far!

01-24-2010, 01:43 AM
Math is hard when you've been out of school for 10 years!!!

Not really a *mapping* update... but I just spent the last 5 hours scouring the internet for formulas relating to astromy, crunching number, and painstakingly creating fractions in PS.

If any of you are feeling seriously mathematically inclined, feel free to let me know if I've made any ghastly mistakes. Putting those decimals in the wrong spot is way too easy sometimes :(

01-28-2010, 02:22 AM
Update! Continuing on from the previous update, the map of the solar system. Of course, I couldn't call it the solar system, because there was never any deity named Sol... One of the ancient deities that represented the sun was named Occulus, as in the Eye of the Gods. How dare random etymologies intrude on my map!! :) This looks like the first part of my map that I'll actually finish. Just need to finish fleshing out the data for the comets and filling in the info for the moons of Crudis. Phew!

01-29-2010, 01:19 PM
Yay! 3 posts in a row! :P

I've stunned you all into speechlessness. Either it's amazing and beautiful beyond words, or a brown steaming pile. 8)

Or maybe "Wtf? Solar system? This is the Regional/World Mapping forum noob!"

But I've finally finished a small portion of the map! At least until 6 months from now when I finish the rest of the map and look back on this and say "Wow. I sucked back then." :D

Now I only have to finish a dozen more maps and a novel's worth of text and labels :((

01-29-2010, 01:41 PM
All I can say is WOW! Moutarde you have really taken on an ambitious project here, and I must say that I am impressed with the degree of precision and detail that your maps encompass. I really like the sort of "Renaissance/Enlightenment Steampunk" look and feel of your work (good choice on the font by the way). You're doing some terrific work here; thanks for sharing it with the rest of us.



01-30-2010, 12:38 AM
Thanks for the praise Arsheesh :) The fonts I'm using are Baskerville Old Face, and Mistral.

All the text placement is taking forever though :( If I use the warped text tool it puts a heavy distortion on the letters and makes them look different from the rest, so I've been placing each word individually (and breaking long words into small chunks and placing each chunk) than manually rotating them into the proper alignment. Very painstaking. If anyone reading this has any suggestions, I would dearly love to hear them. A quick google search suggested using a large size, warping it, then reducing the size, and it sort of worked. No distortion, but it left the text looking as though it were bold-type. :(

01-30-2010, 12:47 AM
You said in the first post you're using photoshop - have you tried drawing out a path, and using the text tool to place the text onto the path? Assuming you're using a version that allows text on a path - I know ps7 but I'm not sure when it was introduced (I'm using cs3 and it's there)

01-30-2010, 01:03 AM
I'd save your final map then port it over to Inkscape/Illustrator/Xara Xtreme/Corel Draw or other drawing application - creating text on a curve is much easier and faster using a vector drawing app then from within Photoshop or other image editor. Even if you never used one, placing labels and curved text is a pretty easy process using those apps.

In most of those apps its a simple matter of typing out your text - resizing as you need after typing, then drawing a curve with the line/path tool, then selecting both text and line, use the Text to Curve feature and voilla, you've done it.


01-30-2010, 01:52 AM
Good lord. I didn't have the slightest clue that you could place text onto a path. It looks like you've just saved me dozens of hours Coyote! Thank you!! :D

Thanks also for the Inkscape/Illustrator suggestion Gamerprinter, but I'm a little hesitant to start learning another graphics program while I'm still just starting to get the hang of Photoshop :)

01-30-2010, 03:24 AM
Gamerprinter's suggestion is a good one. And if you're not using it for anything other then text (at least for now) it's incredibly easy to learn, I'd recommend giving it some time once you're done your project.

Myself, I do a lot of my text through photoshop since I typically don't have too many labels, but if i'm doing dozens of labels (like my transylvania map, there must have been 300 or more towns on that thing) I'll do exactly what GP suggested :)

If you end up using Illustrator, you can even import the text layers and further adjust if you need to do more work afterwards.

01-30-2010, 03:28 AM
I can tell you from experience it's worth doing. I beat on Gimp for hours trying to do names on a pathway. I went over to Inkscape (which I barely know) and was dropping names down lickity split, it is WAY easier in Inkscape than it is in GIMP.

I think there was an explanation in one of the posts or maybe a tutorial here. It might have been in my wip for my first map, I'll go check and get back to you here if it is.

01-30-2010, 03:49 AM
HA! I found it on page 2 of my first map WIP:

Sorry I could have been more clear (I have explained my workflow a couple times in other threads and forget some people may not have read EVERY post here ;) )

I make my entire map (or as much as I can) without labels, icons, etc in gimp.
I then do a save as to a jpg.
I import that jpg into inkscape, select the image, then size the canvas to fit the jpg. I lock the background layer (where the image is), and create new layers for things like city labels, rivers, titles, etc. I use layer visibility to reveal only the layer I want, and export it from inkscape as a png.
In gimp I use Open as Layer to bring in that png for final compositing (drop shadows/glows, etc.)

If I want to change text, I flip to my inkscape file and modify it there then delete the existing layer and again us Open as Layer.

When I know I'll do this a lot (like in my recent woodcut map) I used a linked layer set of scripts for gimp I reference here (http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?p=81481#post81481).

If there is interest, I can make a quick tut on it.

-Rob A>

Looks like Rob A might need to whip up a quick tutorial since this is at least the second time it's come up since I've been here. :)

01-30-2010, 11:45 AM
That actually doesn't sound too bad at all. I guess I'll have to give that a shot before I start going nuts on all the text. Thanks Jaxilon :)

01-30-2010, 01:15 PM
Another thing, once I type the text for the label, but before I create the curved line or the text to curve function, I usually duplicate the text (once you've scaled it to the size you want for a town label - for example), and even make multiple duplicates. Its a very easy matter to place your cursor into a duplicated text line, then backspace and type the next label. This way all your town labels are the same size and same font.

Sometimes I go around the whole map placing the duplicated text of the first town on all points where labels need placed. Then apply text to curve as I need them, as sometimes a label can be placed without needing to curve it. Doing it this way, you just have to ensure that you don't leave a label unchanged - I've done this and had two or three labels with the same town name, because I forgot to change it.

Its really a matter of how much time you want to spend labeling. I could probably accomplish CM's 300 label map in less than an hour doing the labels this way within a vector drawing app. Trying to do the same thing in an image editor like GIMP takes forever and can be very frustrating.

Last point - you mention you're just starting to get comfortable with Photoshop and not wanting to try a different application, but know this, for many of my maps, I am using 2 or 3 different applications to get the job done. Xara Xtreme gives me more capability to do all of this in one application, but using several apps for a single map is a very normal production work-flow for most projects. I almost never rely on just one application to create graphics.


01-31-2010, 04:18 PM
An Aſtronomical Latitude and Longitude Analemma!

Fun for the whole family!

I think I might finally tackle the constellation maps next.... Hopefully trying to draw pictures of fantastic creatures doesn't break me :)

01-31-2010, 06:35 PM
What you're doing here is far beyond me so with that in mind - I think it's a bit weird to have upside-down numbers. It might be the way this thing is supposed to be and if so then so be it. I don't know much about it, shrug. It still looks good and that funky old time S in your text up there is wicked cool. Keep up the nice work, man. :)

01-31-2010, 07:34 PM
You know, when I put those numbers in upside-down, I didn't really like them, but I figured I'd sit on em like that for a bit, see if I still didn't like them at the end... Then completely forgot all about them until you mentioned them! And I still don't like them :P I'm going to be changing them all to the same orientation, including the 90's.

Thanks Ascension :)

02-02-2010, 03:38 AM
Update! Can't let my own thread fall off the first page now, can I? ;)

Thought I'd post the upper left corner of the map, as it's actually getting close to being complete up there! That's at least..... 1/12th of the whole map! :lol:

02-02-2010, 04:10 AM
Holycrap, that is gonna be gorgeous when it's done. I am so totally jealous of this map, i wish I would have thought of all that.


02-02-2010, 07:05 AM
Geez, finally took the time to fully go through this thread. Didn't expect this! At first I was kind of confused as to what your purpuse was with this map, and what it should represent. When I discovered that, my jaw dropped. What an enormous project! I'll be staying tuned to this in the future, can't wait to see the result!

02-02-2010, 03:54 PM
Thanks for the praise :) I realized that I my updates for the last little while had just been bits of the extra stuff that fills the area around the actual maps. It feels really good to actually see it starting to come together as a whole.

02-02-2010, 04:05 PM
Wow, my eye balls are salivating! But shame on you moutarde for not posting the entire map, now you've left me in a state of discontented suspense! Guess I'll just have to stay tuned...I hate waiting.



02-03-2010, 02:41 AM
Sometimes I wish I was doing this map with Vectorworks instead of Photoshop :( That way I could rotate a line 0.9863 degrees, and it wouldn't just round it off and rotate it 1 degree... And yes, that's a very important distinction when you're trying to fit 365 little lines onto 360 degrees of circle :P

Arsheesh, next time I post an update, I'll post everything I have, scaled down to a size that the forum will accept :)

02-03-2010, 02:59 AM
Ha! Ha haha!

So I drew a curve, and put text on it. 31 capital 'I' in Arial, then adjusted the spacing on the font to make the 31 marks fit into 30 degrees! Bwahahahaha!

02-03-2010, 04:27 AM
sneaky smart!!

02-03-2010, 07:04 PM
Well, I was worried about drawing pictures for the constellation maps, but after drawing the Sun in this update with nothing but the touchpad on my laptop, I'm feeling a lot more comfortable about my drawing skills ;) This part of the map shows the Earth's progression through the seasons, as well as which Zodiac sign the Sun is in for any given day of the year. There's a whole boatload of accompanying text to go with it, but I'll get to that sometime whenever :D

My apologies for not posting a full state of the WIP yet Arsheesh, one's coming soon, I promise 8)

02-03-2010, 07:18 PM

you drew that with a touchpad and you actually doubted your skills? you're insane.

man, this just keeps getting better and better.

02-03-2010, 07:57 PM
Moutarde Posted: My apologies for not posting a full state of the WIP yet Arsheesh, one's coming soon, I promise

That's alright, as long as you keep feeding us these great lil tidbits all is forgiven.



02-03-2010, 08:05 PM

you drew that with a touchpad and you actually doubted your skills? you're insane.

man, this just keeps getting better and better.

Well, I've never had any success drawing with a mouse, so I just kind of assumed I wouldn't be able to draw with a touchpad either :P

02-03-2010, 08:08 PM
Isn't it great to find out when you're wrong on things like that? :)

02-03-2010, 08:19 PM
Sure is ;) It's opened whole new worlds of time-wasting possibilities :lol:

02-03-2010, 09:45 PM
Yay! An update showing the entire map as it stands so far! I removed the map of the moon from this file (bottom center), as I'm totally unsatisfied with how it looks right now. If you really want to see it, go back to page 3 or 4 or something ;) The Universal Scale (bottom left) is also waiting to be re-drawn, and there's another Analemma waiting to go into the bottom right. The top center will contain the drawings of the constellations.

I decided to break up the map into 4 files instead of scaling it down. Just cuz.


02-03-2010, 09:48 PM
That is just a buttload of work, crikey. Good stuff, man.

02-03-2010, 09:49 PM

02-03-2010, 09:58 PM
Now that's what I'm talking about! This is a masterpiece in the making Moutarde, it's going to turn out to be one of those maps that others look to for inspiration. Consider yourself repped and rated.



02-03-2010, 10:03 PM
Careful, or all this praise is gonna go to my head! :)

02-03-2010, 10:08 PM
The challenge is living up to our expectations now.

Less posting more mapping!! :P (like I'm one to talk.. i keep taking breaks from shading my mountain ranges. it's hard on the hands!)

02-03-2010, 10:08 PM
Blimey this is looking good. Let it go to your head - you deserve it.

I'm going to sneak in a little rep just to keep you going...

02-03-2010, 10:28 PM
I'm going to sneak in a little rep just to keep you going...

Hee hee that's what I just did... :D

02-03-2010, 10:29 PM
That is looking great, there is a typo on the curved text, discoveries is spelled wrong.
Amazing work.

02-03-2010, 11:01 PM
That is looking great, there is a typo on the curved text, discoveries is spelled wrong.
Amazing work.

Actually, it's supposed to be spelled Diſcoveries. The long s ( ſ ) was falling out of favour at the beginning of the 19th century, but was still used very commonly. The long s was used in place of the short s in words when it was in an initial or medial position, but never used when the s was in a final position. In the cases of 'ss' the first s was actually a long s, and in cases where an f was adjacent to the s, short was always used.


Thanks though!

02-03-2010, 11:21 PM
Just to help explain what Moutarde means, I have a sample from the only old document I have handy.

Not trying to go religious on anybody, this is the oldest document I've ever worked on in my daytime graphics shop. This was a single page from an actual King James Bible, dated 1613 - its a true second edition printed page. Anyway, look at the text in the sample's center, notice the words with two S's, (like Moses) and notice the first "S" looks like an "f". The same convention is done to the ornate font in the body of the scripture.

(As an aside, not referring to Moutarde's map, but notice the latin "U" looks like a "V", and the "V" as a "U".)

After finishing the job I saved the file for myself, this is an exerpt from it - pretty cool!

I hope people now understand, the use of Moutarde's spelling convention.


02-03-2010, 11:38 PM

Besides getting historical jealousy (i would have loved to work on that!), I'm getting some interesting ideas on how to make spellings and such more antique feeling to go along with the graphics for my antique replica type maps :)

02-03-2010, 11:43 PM
Thanks for the example Gamerprinter. You seem to get to play with all kinds of cool things through your business :)

02-04-2010, 01:29 AM
Not to jack your thread, but 15 years ago when I started my business I took on whatever came into the door. The first time some elderly person came in with a damaged old family photo - I scanned it and photoshopped to look whole again, then inkjet printed it out. Word spread. Now I get work (rarely) from museums in Joliet, IL (50 miles from me), a railroad museum, all the historical societies in five counties, all the geneaological (sp?) societies, many private collections. So yeah, sometimes I get to play with some really cool (historic) stuff.

Sorry for the interruption, go on Moutarde continue to rock with this map!


02-08-2010, 11:47 PM
First map, plus massive enormous project, plus perfectionism, equals BAD. Well maybe just bad instead of BAD :) Over the last couple days, as I've been working on some of the stuff that I did right when I first started this whole thing, I've been fighting urges to scrap that old crap and redo it nicely :P For example, I drew the landmasses and warped them into stereographic projections, but then drew rivers and mountain ranges and borders on afterwards, so they don't quite seem to stretch just the right way near the extremes of the map. And the mercator projection has neither mountains or rivers or borders on it, which means I need to copy them from a stereographic projection and somehow transform them from there into a properly sized mercatorial version. Bleh. At least the text in the filler areas is still progressing nicely, though there's still a massive wad of it to go.

/rant off.

K. On a side note, I still need to come up with somewhere in the neighbourhood of 20 more constellations to draw, so any suggestions for those would be most welcome. Here's my list of constellations thus far:


Mythological Character
Mythological Character
Mythological Character
Mythological Character
Mythological Character
Mythological Character
Mythological Character

The first twelve are the signs of the zodiac, and the rest is basically just a bunch of random crap borrowed from real constellations and classical mythology.

02-09-2010, 06:17 PM
Well, I couldn't help myself. I've decided to re-draw the mountains, rivers and political borders. Yay! So, just for fun, I figured I would post my crappy reference sketch, so y'all can see how awful I can make something look before I start to make it look nice ;)

02-09-2010, 06:27 PM
Your map is looking great!!! I wish I had your talent!!

02-09-2010, 06:29 PM
That's a good planning map and a good idea for making things how you want them. I tend to just make it up as I go instead of planning it out. I do my rivers and roads and nations like that, though.

02-09-2010, 10:19 PM
Your map is looking great!!! I wish I had your talent!!

Thanks Davros, though I'm more of the opinion that my map is taking more patience (and trial and error!) than talent so far. But it's still really great to hear :D

That's a good planning map and a good idea for making things how you want them. I tend to just make it up as I go instead of planning it out. I do my rivers and roads and nations like that, though.

Yeah, I figured that in addition to drawing everything on the eastern hemisphere, and then drawing EVERYTHING all over again on the mercatorial projection, I could just plug this image into Hugin and do the transformations on it, and then just trace everything out on each of the different projection, and have them all looking appropriately warped as well. Though by doing the western hemisphere over again, I'm probably losing all the time I'll save anyways :P Oh well, it'll look better in the end for it...

02-14-2010, 10:13 PM
I've always loved these style of maps, I was wondering how long it'd take me to stumble upon the thread of someone mad enough to try one. It didn't take long and it didn't disappoint, it's an inspiration already and I can't wait to see the finished article.

02-15-2010, 02:09 PM
Haha, yeah you could certainly call me mad ;) I've been working at somewhat slowly, but steadily, and I've almost finished re-drawing all the physical and political aspects of the landmasses. I don't think I can put off those constellations much longer either. I expect to have about 12 hours at work tomorrow with nothing to do, so hopefully I'll be able to put in a monster naming session and possibly finish the main maps! But no promises, I'm lazy ;)

02-15-2010, 05:49 PM
Well, here is the almost completely re-drawn western hemisphere! Yay!

"But Moutarde!" you might say. "That looks exactly the same as the last one!"

Not so! The differences are subtle, but it looks much better than the original one I posted so many years (-weeks-) ago.

Eastern hemisphere to come tomorrow morning probably.

02-16-2010, 02:13 PM
As promised, here's the eastern hemisphere.

02-16-2010, 02:24 PM

you realize of course, that this is going to be totally amazing when it's finally done? :)

02-16-2010, 03:35 PM
Thanks Coyotemax ;) I realized those two maps aren't actually completely drawn yet, as I still need to draw naval exploration routes on them still. Sigh. I'm starting to look forward to getting this finished and moving on to something new. Good inspiration to work faster :P

Probably won't get a whole lot of labelling done today after all, between olympic hockey and lost tonight, I'm not getting much work done :P

02-18-2010, 12:47 PM
Going to be taking a little bit of a burnout break from the map for a little bit, and work on an entry for the lite challenge. The entry is related to the same project as this map is for, although it's not actually going to be a part of this map at all. Then I should be able to come back to this with a nice fresh burst of inspiration (and naming) and energy (and naming). ;)

03-19-2010, 10:05 PM
Woohoo! I only fell to the 4th page while working on my lite challenge entry :) Started putting my new tablet to use on the images for the constellations, and realized that this part is probably going to be a lot of fun after all! At least for the first 10-20 constellations :P I've only finished the first one so far, and havn't even really placed it, I mostly just wanted to save my thread from the deepest black depths of page 4 8)

03-22-2010, 10:31 AM
that looks really good moutarde - can't wait to see more :)

03-22-2010, 11:19 PM
definitely like this map. great ideas, layout and my god the details... wanna trade skills? cause i'm getting tired of being the community unfinisher of projects :)

03-23-2010, 03:10 PM
Yeah, you've got to admire Moutarde's perserverance...

03-25-2010, 01:11 AM
Well, there's a lot of work left there, but I like the dragon. Off to a good start on this section!

05-16-2010, 12:44 AM
What's this? An update after almost two months??? I got sick of the dwarf fortress map (not that I made much in the way forward progress on it at all :) ), so I've been working on drawing the sketches for the constellations. Only 35 or so more to go!!!

The top rows are the zodiac constellations, and below that will be the remainder of the constellations. The little warrior guy is absolute crap, though I don't know if I'll redraw him. His first sketch looked pretty good, but when I finished him up, he turned all brown and smelly.

05-16-2010, 01:03 AM
Moutarde! Great to see that you're still working on this map, it's well worth finishing. Nice sketches by the way. Here's a lil bit of rep to encourage you to see this one through.


05-16-2010, 01:15 AM
Thanks Arsheesh :)

I also forgot to list off some of my reference material from flickr :o So I better get that posted ;) So the following flickr users (so far, and more to come) deserve some thanks for posting pictures under a creative commons license: HVargas, Alan Vernon, robot-girl, Walraven, Arno & Louise, exfordy.

05-16-2010, 01:38 AM
I'm getting an "Invalid Attachment specified." message when I click on this update.

05-16-2010, 01:41 AM
And now I don't. Now that I can see them, I like them. Although the centaur and griffin could do with thicker horse legs.

09-17-2010, 03:42 AM
I missed this the first time around...are you still working on this? Because I really want to see the finished result. :)

09-17-2010, 03:58 AM
I'm not actively working on it, but I also havn't abandoned it either :) I have a section of it set as my desktop wallpaper to constantly remind me that it's not finished! So it will be finished, but it might be a long time yet...

09-17-2010, 04:24 AM
I for one will wait patiently. Because this will be made of win and awesome when it's finished.

12-10-2010, 03:53 PM
Well, I've been actually doing some consistent work on this lately, so I think it's probably somewhat safe to post an update. I expect to have at least a few more before something else sidetracks me again :P I finally got around to completely redrawing the universal scale (which was one of the first things I drew, and looked like crap), and I've done some more work on the northern constellations. I've also done work on the mercator projection at home, so I'll get an update of that posted soon as well. Most of the work that I've done in the last week is fixing up stuff from a long time ago, that just didn't quite look good enough. Oh yeah, added more filler text too. At some point I'll update the complete wip image also.

12-10-2010, 11:35 PM
Added political borders to the mercator projection, started labelling, and redrew the rhumb lines.

Steel General
12-11-2010, 01:33 PM
Looks like it came right from a book...nice job!

12-11-2010, 08:56 PM
I'm really glad to see you've returned to this piece Moutarde.


12-11-2010, 09:15 PM
Beautiful :)

12-21-2010, 01:09 PM
Finally finished the names of all the countries in the western hemisphere! Now I just have to name all the cities, and rivers, and islands, and bodies of water, and probably a half-dozen other things I havn't thought of yet ;)

12-21-2010, 03:27 PM
looks great! Makes me see a lot of things i could do better on my world map :)

12-22-2010, 01:13 PM
Thanks Slylok :)

Redrew the political borders for the northern part of the eastern hemisphere and started throwing the first labels down over there as well.

12-22-2010, 02:19 PM
Gave you a little bit o' rep to keep you enthused. :D

This is going to be so awesome when it's done...

12-28-2010, 12:03 PM
I think I've finally got a map of the moon that I'm satisfied with.


I'd been trying to find a good way to emulate this style of map,


and I'm finally happy with the results of I've gotten :P

12-28-2010, 12:56 PM
Absolute fantastic!!!!!!

Which font did you use for the labels on the moon?

12-28-2010, 01:41 PM
Ooops, I think you mistook which one is mine Sapiento :O Mine's the plainer looking one, with no labels as of yet...

12-28-2010, 01:45 PM
That said, here's a half-size jpg of the entirety of the map as it stands as of this moment. I feel like I'm actually starting to close in on finishing! There's still a lot to be done, a whole lot of little details, but most of the big stuff is done :)

12-28-2010, 01:47 PM
Sap: I believe that map is hand-labeled. Look at the differences in the 'R' in "TERRA" near the top and the alignment of the letters in "SICCITATIS"

12-28-2010, 02:00 PM
Yes, the one with the labels is hand-labeled, it was published in 1790 or thereabouts.

12-28-2010, 05:16 PM
Moutarde, I think I may just be looking at your magnum opus! I tip my hat to you sir.


12-29-2010, 01:58 AM
Hand-labeled!? If I would hand-label my maps you could hardly read anything! ;)

12-29-2010, 03:46 AM
I'm about to go Hand labeled myself. Inkscape keeps crashing while I'm positioning things. Sometimes it goes for hours and other times it just blows up. I have enough problems deciding on my labels at the moment that I don't need to keep loosing what I'm doing. LOL, I guess it's one way to get faster though. One of these days I'll do a hand labeled map though. I took drafting for a bit back in school and still have nice print. It is hard to make every letter exactly the same size though. I probably should learn how to make a font.

This is shaping up to be excellent moutarde, keep going!

Mark CMG
07-04-2011, 05:08 AM
This is the sort of map, albeit in much simpler form, I'd like to create. Well done so far and keep it up! :)

07-05-2011, 09:39 PM
Thanks Mark :) The map is currently on hiatus while I'm working on some commissions, but when I get started again I'll be reworking the landmasses - there's some pretty significant problems with their shapes, around the poles especially and somewhat around the equator.

07-07-2011, 06:20 AM
Moutarde, this map is terrific! I can't wait until you've finished it! Really stunning work.

07-09-2011, 07:00 AM
Sir, you are indeed nuts, still brilliant :) .


09-06-2013, 02:28 AM
ouch... i was searching google for stereographic maps and came across this which i'd honestly never seen before and is so similar to mine (in fairness, were both basing our maps off that amazing real-world example). just thought i'd say congrats on doing this before me and doing a might fine job of it too. Hope this gets finished one day.

09-08-2013, 05:29 PM
Yeah, this has always been one of my "unfinished favorites". A shame it has never been completed.


09-12-2013, 02:39 AM
I hope it gets finished too! ;) I've got a nice big piece of that map as my desktop background, so that every single day I'm reminded that it isn't finished. So while I havn't made any progress on it in years, I'll get back to it sooner or later (more likely later).