View Full Version : *** January 2010 Challenge - Up and down the scales ***

12-31-2009, 08:27 PM
For this month, I am sponsoring the January Challenge with a copy of my ViewingDale (http://www.viewingdale.com) app to the top three places by vote. If you win you can get it by download, get a boxed set through the post or decline and take just the challenge glory.

I proposed this idea a long while ago but it seems that there has been some call to arms to implement it on a thread "A thought occurs" (http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?t=8443) so just to spice it up I thought some prizes and a challenge topic might give the idea more oomph and get more people in on the fun.

This months challenge is where you must make a map which fits into one or more other existing maps on the guild. The idea is to make either a small part of someone else map like a building in a city and map that building or to use the other persons map as a small part of your entry. I.e. you take somebody's village and make a regional map with lots of villages on it one of which is the reference map.

Ideally you could map something which has both an existing larger and a smaller map and bridge the two with your entry. I.e. find a house and a regional map and make a town in that region with the house somewhere in the town.

The challenge is not going specify which other maps you can use. You should have permission to use other peoples map tho. If your using something Creative Commons (CC) licensed or from our community world building project (http://www.cartographersguild.com/utilities/Indexes/CWBP_Index.htm) (The CWBP) then you don't need to ask as its all CC licensed too. I don't think it matters very much if more than one challenger uses the same reference map(s).

If your looking ideas I will suggest two; Ravells has mapped Tavor (http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?t=5396) and I mapped some of the surrounding area and called it Tavoronia (http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?t=5612) which is a map akin to what this challenge is all about. So it would be good to map some of the places in Tavor like Scant Castle, or the town of Malo for example. The basic layout of the castle and town should match that of Ravells existing map. Then there would be a sequence of at least three maps all at different scales.

In the "Thought Occurs" thread, IndustryGothica has a map of "Port Magalie" with some areas marked up which could be done in more detail (http://www.cartographersguild.com/showpost.php?p=95033&postcount=16). So take a house, a few houses or a street and make a map of that sticking to the same general layout of buildings.

Voting should be based on the general quality of the map but also should take into account the continuity of the reference maps too.

Note that my app is a windows only app and does need a good graphics card to run fast. It will run on one without but its a bit slow in that case unless you have a quick CPU. It can run under virtualbox if your on Linux or whatever but it wont be fast. There's a demo (http://www.viewing.ltd.uk/cgi-bin/viewingdale.pl?category=free_trial) on the website to try before committing to the cause if you want to check first.

I'm posting a touch early as I wont be available to post for just a short while.

Oh and Happy New Year to y'all. Most normal people would be drunk at this point. :)

12-31-2009, 09:00 PM
Awesome idea...and great prize for the winners!

01-01-2010, 12:00 AM
Oh boy! Now I'm really fired up. If only I was a mapping wizard with legendary skills instead of a troll with a heavy bludgeoning instrument.

I'm going to try and do this though if I can find the time this month.

Steel General
01-01-2010, 09:50 AM
@Jaxilon - I moved your second post to it's own thread in this forum as it was an entry in the challenge.

01-01-2010, 04:48 PM
Yes I should have mentioned to those doing a challenge for the first time. You should start a new thread for your entry. The thread title should read "January Entry : Your Map Title Here" kind of style then when it gets archived you can see the Dec and Feb entries separate from all the Jan ones.

As usual I will try to keep on top of the thumbnails page. When you post your new WIP images as the map progresses it would be helpful if you put a :

### Latest WIP ###

as the last line before your uploaded image and then the thumbnailer script will see that image as your latest for the thumbs page. You can get away without the tag but if you or anyone posts any unrelated image then the last in the thread is used as the thumb one. You should vote on the thread but many people vote by looking at the thumbs images. I urge people to look at the threads this time because you wont see the reference maps to see how close the entry is otherwise.

I'll try to end the challenge as near as I can to 00:00am GMT on the 27th of Jan with 4 or 5 days worth of voting. Post into this thread if you need an extra hour or so at the very end or at least post something just before voting starts not to miss the dead line. Its happened too many times to mention before I upgraded the thumbs updater !

01-01-2010, 07:21 PM
Thank you, Steel General. I thought about this after I posted here. I wasn't too worried because I wasn't sure if I was going to move forward with it. I should have made a new post just to be safe.

Sorry for making you do extra work.

Thanks again!

01-02-2010, 07:52 AM
Can we use our own maps as a starting point?

01-02-2010, 01:09 PM
Can we use our own maps as a starting point?

Ditto question here.

01-02-2010, 06:04 PM
Good question. Yes I would think so. The usual challenge proviso of not having done the challenge entry before the start of the challenge applies so I think the ref map could be your own previous one so long as you haven't made the entry map yet.

01-02-2010, 09:06 PM
Ok, so since I posted my first wip @ 11:25pm 12/31 when I was trying to figure out how to scale up an image do I need to change what I'm doing so I'm not disqualified?

It's not a problem, I just want to keep things fair.

01-03-2010, 02:11 PM
The rule is there to stop people submitting a completed map with days and days worth of effort put into it thus giving an unfair advantage to people who otherwise have only 25 days to do it. I posted a map once which I had worked on but not completed and we have had others who got a small way in too. Its happened before and I think its no problem. Also people use premade bits of art like mountain tokens, or dungeon gear and other bits and pieces too which we normally try to declare where we got them. Its more about making an honest attempt at doing the map in about a month than being super strict about the exact second it started. If you had done two weeks already then it might feel bad to others but a few hours... I don't think anyone can claim that they are going to spend every minute of their month on a map so that one or two extra hours would have made all the difference. Your efforts were one of the strong reasons I asked to put this challenge forward to this month so that what people are naturally trying to achieve can be made into a challenge with possible gold compasses or prizes to gain from it.

01-03-2010, 03:07 PM
Agreed with Redrobes, it's not a problem. The rule is mainly there to make sure noone is submitting maps that were made long before a challenge.

01-03-2010, 04:03 PM
Hmmm... this could be a good occasion to make a small contribution to the CWBP... I'll have a look at the tiles...

01-03-2010, 04:10 PM
This is prob the easiest link to get at them:


01-03-2010, 04:22 PM
Thanks. I was thinking about doing a regional map which would have a size of around 1/9th of a tile. I don't know how useful it would be to the project, but I'd like to give it a shot.

So a tile is approximately 600 miles in width, depending on latitude?

01-03-2010, 05:26 PM
For me, I don't work well in curved space so I took all the tiles to be 600x600 miles but they are more than that south and smaller up north. On the project page there is some text at top and a link in there is to the original set up for the CWBP. Neon did the world in Fractal Terrains and it had some stats about exactly how wide each of the tiles were per latitude.

The thing is tho that if we really go with the curved space thing then all the icons for houses and stuff need to be bigger as we go to more northerly tiles and smaller for more southerly tiles (up to equator of course...). As far as I know it never made the slightest difference to anybody's tile and might only really affect anyone roleplaying a boat journey around Ansium. And as people mapped smaller regions they usually put in their own scale for that map - which I would hope was close enough to be about right whatever scale you chose.

So if making a map where you wanted to map something which say Ansium as a whole fitted into then I think it would be prudent to consider the curvature but for a map of a tile size or less then its easier to approximate it to being rectangular and run with it ignoring the slight error. You can go with 600x600 or A x 600 where A is whatever that tile checks out to be from Neons world stats.


I don't know where the 600 number came from but it seems that to be exact the top tiles are 270miles across and the bottom ones are 523 tho 600 has been used a lot since the start.

Also, this post is supposed to tell the region being mapped as degrees in lat/long

and this one has stats about the world that was used as the starting point in Fractal Terrains:

so the two together should also give all the values for sizes as required.

Actually this one is killer for the answer if using earth sized sphere which is a little off of the CWBP sphere:

so as you can see quite a lot of disparity all round. Neons stats are the fact but interpreting them has been shown to be more difficult than you would have thought. Again, I don't think it makes for much difference, so you call it as you like.

01-03-2010, 06:10 PM
Thank you for your quick and detailed answer.
After reading all that, I think I'll just run with the general rule of a tile being around 600 miles across, somewhat less for the northern ones. Most maps seem to apply that rule, more or less, even if it makes the planet larger than initially planned.
I'll open a thread for my WIP.

01-03-2010, 09:41 PM
Ok thanks for the clarification. I'm not going to have any guilt either because I will not have any real time for this for at least the next week or so....

Besides, everything will have to work perfectly for me to pull this off. Meaning I'll probably run into issues with something that will kill my creative flow at some point just due to my not knowing how to make my software do what I want.

It'll be fun anyway!

01-23-2010, 08:41 PM
Theres about two days left now before challenge closes Tues Night 0:00 GMT (approx) and I like one of those nagging exam adjudicators just wanted to remind about the close time and also to request that if anyone has not posted what their map scale is or what the reference map is then you need to put that in even if its just text in a post.

01-26-2010, 07:31 PM
Voting board is now up !