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Thread: 4e Core Rulebooks

  1. #31
      Brazenwood is offline
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    Post Don't judge the new book by it's old cover now!

    Quote Originally Posted by loogie View Post
    ugh dnd...

    i know its the most popular system out there, but its all a little bland for my taste... i find dnd to be to super powered and very directional... a lot like world of warcraft, but in the rping sense (eg.. if you a cleric, your job is to heal. you'll rarely get the chance to do anything else... and if your like me, and would like to make a character that isn't just a healer... your fellow companions complain for hours about how they think you should be healing them). I also prefer my battles to be a bit more then races to 0 hp. the system i play now has bleeding, broken bones, stun, penalties, all of which are in a series of tables that every hit uses... so it helps describe how combat is going much more...

    that being said.. dnd is better then nothing, and i find that it fits what many people like playing, and if so, all power too ya. i'm a bit more hardcore in my rping, and hack and slash isn't all i want out of a game... just like to tell people that there are more options out there... (i had no idea there were good options out there till my friends turned me on to iron crown enterprises, now i'm pretty stuck on their systems)
    I too got a hold of the new books via pdf, and they are amazing. Every Character gets to do three actions like a three act play during his turn, a standard action, a move action, and then a minor action. Clerics and Warlords do their healing (inspire healing surges) during their minor actions, so they don't just have to be the healer anymore, which is cool.

    The game also introduced stages of woundedness, when you get to half your hitpoints you are "bloodied" which has it's own set of ramifications both positive and negative.

    I love the new Warlord. My first character I just made yesterday was a Half-Elf Warlord, and I used my first feat to multiclass as a Warlock to gain the Star Pact power Dire Radiance (I can basically bring down the astrolgoy star power in the midst of battle), also as a Half Elf you get to be a dilatante which means you can choose another's classes At will powers and make it into a per encounter power for you. I chose another from the Warlock their Eyebite power which is like a mini mind blast and vanish for one round to the target you mindblasted! Then, also at first level you get your three main class features, plus two At will class powers, one encounter power, and one daily power. And these powers are not necessarily spells. For instance the warrior types have the martial power source, so their powers are called Exploits, like combat tricks, tactics, stunts. So it's cool. The Warlord is a master of getting everyone in position and gaining combat advantage through flanking. He is great at inspiring others to to better to, but only if he can kick arse in the first place. My daily power is Lead the Attack, which you would use against a boss character, cause if you hit you get tripple weapon damage and your allies are then +4 (I have a high Int and tactical presence) against the same target. At level two I'm going to get my first utility exploit which for me will be Knight's Move, which allows me to point and give my move action to an ally as a free action, more positioning.

    The cool thing about the game (even though it does seem like the battle rules are a glorified polished miniatures game) is that I can't wait to see how a party with all these weird and cool abilities learns to use them in concert...wow! It's going to make for some amazing combinations and team tactics for sure, something like no game has ever had before. And the actual role-playing, well the quality of that depends on the quality of the DM (his running of NPCs and adventure design) and the quality of the players to actually be involved, so that is system nuetral as far as I am concerned.

    And the new Skill Challenges are amazing for facilitating role playing too. The Dm can design Skill Challenges that have you making multiple rolls over time to gradually build success before failure strikes, should be great fun!

    Overall, from reading the books for three days now, I'm so psyched to play, and the new system has me buying a new computer and setting up CC3 to map the local campaign area, and it's so exciting again!

    Can't wait to play with my table top group, but also can't wait to play online with people like you through the new Virtual 3D game table with chat!

    Woo Hoo!

  2. #32
      NeonKnight is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by delgondahntelius View Post
    Welp... we began our first 4e game today .... can't say I was all that happy about it, but this might be due to just learning the rules. .... At will Magic Missle .... you can throw that thing all day long .... oh well... we'll give a few more goes and see what happens I suppose...
    I actually like the At Will magic missile. It never goes away, no longer is an 'auto hit' and gives the mage something to use when he has run out of his others powers in a fight.
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  3. #33
    Community Leader Facebook Connected delgondahntelius's Avatar
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    Ya, I guess it just takes some getting used to ... the magic missle ain't so bad ... it just seems that the whole game geared up into munchkin overdrive ...
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  4. #34
      NeonKnight is offline
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    I'm not sure so much if it is geared towards power gaming/munchkin gaming as heading in the direction of less paperwork gaming.

    I know as the DM, I HATE having to wait the 30 minutes at the start of a session for the spell casters to choose spells, and then at the next session to remember how many HP, Spells etc each PC had remaining.

    Now, end/start each session with an extended rest and bingo-bango-bango yer off to the races!
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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeonKnight View Post
    I actually like the At Will magic missile. It never goes away, no longer is an 'auto hit' and gives the mage something to use when he has run out of his others powers in a fight.
    Glad I saw this before I responded.

    I think I like the new Magic Missile too. The spell has always been a wizarding staple anyway, and I think they did a good job of incorporating that into the new build. I think it is definitely more useful now, even though the spell itself is significantly less powerful; all the damage die go into one bolt now instead of multiple bolts, and there is a miss chance - so you won't go around dropping three or four 1hp minions every single round with it (which is actually the very first thing I thought of when I learned about minions).

  6. #36
      GlennZilla is offline
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    The Magic Missile example is a good one for both how much it's changed and how it's not broken. Yeah it's now available as an attack option every round without fail, but it also doesn't break the system at higher levels.

    Oddly I envision it now more like the Harry Potter movies with wizards flicking thier wands toward the enemy and blasts flying back and fourth in the battle.

    Then again if you want a low magic setting, it'll be tough to deal with.

  7. #37
      jfrazierjr is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by GlennZilla View Post
    The Magic Missile example is a good one for both how much it's changed and how it's not broken. Yeah it's now available as an attack option every round without fail, but it also doesn't break the system at higher levels.

    Oddly I envision it now more like the Harry Potter movies with wizards flicking thier wands toward the enemy and blasts flying back and fourth in the battle.

    Then again if you want a low magic setting, it'll be tough to deal with.
    I don't think it would be that hard to deal with. For example, you could change the scale so that you don't get any at will arcane powers until level 4, 8, 12... and just give one or two extra encounter powers or even make it so the at will powers start the first few levels as only encounter powers and then after a time, become at will. I think there is more than enough flexibility to modify this fairly easily for low magic settings as long as most of the monsters are likewise modified.

    In some way, this modified idea is how I have used Spell point rules in the past (2nd ed custom rules) where by spells costs spell points instead of slots, but at certain levels you could learn a specific spell of a specific level and not have to pay the cost (ie, at will with drain.) to simulate 4e at will spells. This kind of reflects the fact that as you go up in levels you are better able to harness magical energy. But I digress....

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  8. #38
    Guild Artisan industrygothica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GlennZilla View Post
    Oddly I envision it now more like the Harry Potter movies with wizards flicking thier wands toward the enemy and blasts flying back and fourth in the battle.
    Funny, that's the same thing I thought of as well.

  9. #39
      Torq is offline
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    If you wan \t a low magic campaign (as I do ) just say no Wizards or Warlocks. Its all ober. Add a ban on magical healing, making players rely on healing surges, and you're away.

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  10. #40
      GlennZilla is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torq View Post
    If you wan \t a low magic campaign (as I do ) just say no Wizards or Warlocks. Its all ober. Add a ban on magical healing, making players rely on healing surges, and you're away.

    Torq
    Clerics would need a little tweaking also. Maybe just drop them for the Warlord and Paladin.

    But I was thinking you could drop wizards and warlocks only to replace them with Scribes. These Scribes/Arcanists/Sorcerers (name very much open to change) are students of the arcane and while they have tons of skill focus feats to replace the lost powers/spells they also can cast rituals.

    That way the evil sorceror could still black out the sun or destroy the city with an army of undead. He just can't cast fireball on a whim.

    There are rules already covering the alternatives for magic items in treasure.
    Last edited by GlennZilla; 06-05-2008 at 05:50 PM. Reason: typos suck

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