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Thread: Telperion & Taramir - First Attempt w/GIMP

  1. #11
    Community Leader Facebook Connected Steel General's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by töff View Post
    Uh oh I'm busted.

    Sorry Steel General, I didn't mean to slam you on the Tolkien name. Sorry, it's a pet peeve of mine -- had a lot of trouble with people dumping Tolkien names into one of our online storyworlds.

    Seriously, though, the maps are looking good. I have a swamp style somewhere if you're interested.
    No harm, no foul - I came up with that name years ago, and I'm sure it was probably influenced by Tolkein. I didn't know it was one of his actual names though.

    And yes I'd definitely be interested in any ideas, etc. you may have to help me get better at this thing. Heck, I only started yesterday, I'm still a big noob!!
    My Finished Maps | My Challenge Maps | Ghoraja Juun, my largely stagnated campaign setting.

    Unless otherwise stated by me in the post, all work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial 3.0 United States License.



  2. #12
    Community Leader Facebook Connected Steel General's Avatar
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    Post Second Attempt - New map: Ravenor

    OK, here's my second attempt using RobA's tutorial. I tried using the alternative method of doing mountains that he created the video tutorial for, and experimented with some other stuff.

    I pretty much like the way they turned out other than there being to much space between them (I was worried about overlapping, and really didn't need to be ), and maybe some 'banding'.

    The off-colored moutains with the red at the peaks are supposed to be Volcanoes. The sandy-colored areas were done using the 'dunes' brush.

    The chasm and the crater were done using the same techniques as the mountains, only inverting the bump map. The crater isn't that great, but I think the chasm turned out OK.

    As always comments, critiques, etc. are welcomed.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Telperion & Taramir - First Attempt w/GIMP-ravenor1b.png  
    My Finished Maps | My Challenge Maps | Ghoraja Juun, my largely stagnated campaign setting.

    Unless otherwise stated by me in the post, all work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial 3.0 United States License.



  3. #13
      jfrazierjr is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel General View Post
    OK, here's my second attempt using RobA's tutorial. I tried using the alternative method of doing mountains that he created the video tutorial for, and experimented with some other stuff.

    I pretty much like the way they turned out other than there being to much space between them (I was worried about overlapping, and really didn't need to be ), and maybe some 'banding'.

    The off-colored moutains with the red at the peaks are supposed to be Volcanoes. The sandy-colored areas were done using the 'dunes' brush.

    The chasm and the crater were done using the same techniques as the mountains, only inverting the bump map. The crater isn't that great, but I think the chasm turned out OK.

    As always comments, critiques, etc. are welcomed.
    Pretty good SG. I assume this is still a WIP, so I will point out a few things that you may just not have gotten to.

    1) for my taste (ie my opinion), you might want to think about putting a bit more color variation on the water using a rendered cloud set to overlay. This is subjective, so if you don't want that no problem. Secondly for the water, if you have not thought of it, you may want to try a texture to simulate movement.

    2) I think the coastline might need a bit more randomness to it to really look it's best. Again, this is all subjective as there may be lots of erosion that might make it really smooth like that.

    3) The brown and tan colors for what I will assume are hills is really nicely done. It's not 100% "there", but pretty darn close. What did you do to get that look?

    4) now for the big one: The mountains look like they are floating above the land mass instead of part of it. One big reason for this (and I am assuming you used part of RoBA's simple mountains tutorial with the angular gradient trick) is the colors make a fake "shadow" that seems to raise the whole element above the underlying stuff. If this is the specific look you are going for, thats fine, but I don't think you are going for the relief map style right? If not there are a few things you can do to help them blend in more, with various levels of work involved. The simplest and least effective is to select your layer mask and spread and blur. This works to some extent and is fast, but is far from the most effective.

    Another thing you can do that I do, which takes little talent, but tons of time to get right is to use the smudge tool and draw the color down and away from the peaks. Also, one of the things I have adapted to the gradient mountains process is to instead of using black and white, use white and gray with gray being the "bottom" of the mountains. For my time, this produces a lot less of the whole floating shadow thing and then I also use the smudge tool to do a bunch of blending "down" the slopes before applying the color layer to the original to get my final bump map.

    Joe
    My Finished Maps
    Works in Progress(or abandoned tests)
    My Tutorials:
    Explanation of Layer Masks in GIMP
    How to create ISO Mountains in GIMP/PS using the Smudge tool
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    Unless otherwise stated by me in the post, all work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial 3.0 United States License.

  4. #14
    Community Leader Facebook Connected Steel General's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jfrazierjr View Post
    1) for my taste (ie my opinion), you might want to think about putting a bit more color variation on the water using a rendered cloud set to overlay. This is subjective, so if you don't want that no problem. Secondly for the water, if you have not thought of it, you may want to try a texture to simulate movement.

    2) I think the coastline might need a bit more randomness to it to really look it's best. Again, this is all subjective as there may be lots of erosion that might make it really smooth like that.

    3) The brown and tan colors for what I will assume are hills is really nicely done. It's not 100% "there", but pretty darn close. What did you do to get that look?

    4) now for the big one: The mountains look like they are floating above the land mass instead of part of it. One big reason for this (and I am assuming you used part of RoBA's simple mountains tutorial with the angular gradient trick) is the colors make a fake "shadow" that seems to raise the whole element above the underlying stuff. If this is the specific look you are going for, thats fine, but I don't think you are going for the relief map style right? If not there are a few things you can do to help them blend in more, with various levels of work involved. The simplest and least effective is to select your layer mask and spread and blur. This works to some extent and is fast, but is far from the most effective.

    Another thing you can do that I do, which takes little talent, but tons of time to get right is to use the smudge tool and draw the color down and away from the peaks. Also, one of the things I have adapted to the gradient mountains process is to instead of using black and white, use white and gray with gray being the "bottom" of the mountains. For my time, this produces a lot less of the whole floating shadow thing and then I also use the smudge tool to do a bunch of blending "down" the slopes before applying the color layer to the original to get my final bump map.

    Joe
    Joe,

    Again thanks for your feedback. This one is really not anywhere near done. It was more of an experimental thing. In response to your points;

    1) Not sure what happened to the water, maybe I accidentally turned the "texture" off and didn't realize it.

    2) For some reason I had lots of trouble with the coastline on this one, obviously I must've been doing something wrong. Probably missed a step in RobA's tutorial, or did something in reverse.

    3) Not sure exactly but if I remember correctly I initially swapped the color maps for the grass and dirt layers (I wanted more of a 'rough terrain'), then I think I reduced the opacity down to about 75% (not at the same PC now, so can't be sure) on those 2 levels. I can't remember which level the dunes are on.

    4) I totally agree about the "shadow" on the mountains, needs more blur and spread, and I think the large "gaps" between them doesn't help either. Maybe I'll save an alternate version and try your "smudge" suggestion as well.

    So, I'll keep plugging away and putting them out here.
    My Finished Maps | My Challenge Maps | Ghoraja Juun, my largely stagnated campaign setting.

    Unless otherwise stated by me in the post, all work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial 3.0 United States License.



  5. #15
      jfrazierjr is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel General View Post
    Joe,

    Again thanks for your feedback. This one is really not anywhere near done. It was more of an experimental thing. In response to your points;

    1) Not sure what happened to the water, maybe I accidentally turned the "texture" off and didn't realize it.
    No problem. Of course, sometimes it's hard to see all the little details when the map is so small (hint, hint)


    Quote Originally Posted by Steel General View Post
    2) For some reason I had lots of trouble with the coastline on this one, obviously I must've been doing something wrong. Probably missed a step in RobA's tutorial, or did something in reverse.
    Yea.. I have found that the other stand alone coastline tutorials Rob produced created much better results in my opinion, so I just combine the two methods.


    Quote Originally Posted by Steel General View Post
    3) Not sure exactly but if I remember correctly I initially swapped the color maps for the grass and dirt layers (I wanted more of a 'rough terrain'), then I think I reduced the opacity down to about 75% (not at the same PC now, so can't be sure) on those 2 levels. I can't remember which level the dunes are on.
    Cool. once you figure it out, be sure to let us know. Its a really good take, and like I said, while it needs a bit of something (though I can't think of what right now) it is very nice!

    Quote Originally Posted by Steel General View Post
    4) I totally agree about the "shadow" on the mountains, needs more blur and spread, and I think the large "gaps" between them doesn't help either. Maybe I'll save an alternate version and try your "smudge" suggestion as well.
    If you do the smudge thing, try checking out the "Playing with Mountains" thread that Karro started. I but some basic directions on how I did it over there, but again, it takes some time and with the number of mountains you have, will take quite a bit of time.


    Joe
    My Finished Maps
    Works in Progress(or abandoned tests)
    My Tutorials:
    Explanation of Layer Masks in GIMP
    How to create ISO Mountains in GIMP/PS using the Smudge tool
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    Unless otherwise stated by me in the post, all work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial 3.0 United States License.

  6. #16
      Karro is offline
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    Joe pretty much covered most of the points I would make.

    One thought I would add, based on another tutorial I saw here (one that was technically for photoshop, but might be useful here, too) regards the volcanoes.

    At an earlier step, when you still have the B&W gradient (or gray & white given Joe's suggestion) at the peaks fo those mountains where you plan to make them volcanoes, try adding a little bit of a dark spot at the tips of those peaks.

    Then, when you create the bump map layer based on that gradient, this should create a small depression at the tip of the mountain, which would make the appearance of a volcanic crater.

    Then, I'd consider using a brighter orange-or-yellow color at the very center to simulate the glow of the lava, and make sure to blur the color on that layer (I might put the orange-yellow on it's own layer when you do this) to make it look glowy.

  7. #17
      jfrazierjr is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karro View Post
    Joe pretty much covered most of the points I would make.

    One thought I would add, based on another tutorial I saw here (one that was technically for photoshop, but might be useful here, too) regards the volcanoes.

    At an earlier step, when you still have the B&W gradient (or gray & white given Joe's suggestion) at the peaks fo those mountains where you plan to make them volcanoes, try adding a little bit of a dark spot at the tips of those peaks.

    Then, when you create the bump map layer based on that gradient, this should create a small depression at the tip of the mountain, which would make the appearance of a volcanic crater.

    Then, I'd consider using a brighter orange-or-yellow color at the very center to simulate the glow of the lava, and make sure to blur the color on that layer (I might put the orange-yellow on it's own layer when you do this) to make it look glowy.
    Though I have not tried, it, I would probably try making a "slightly" irregular circle for each "volcano" and then use a reverse of the angular gradient, with the lightish gray on the insides and a darker gray going out(perhaps 50% going out to 75% or so). Spread, blur, and, a bit of smudge (do this on a different layer) and then bump map each individually and merge down (or merge down and then bump map.) Hmm... good inspiration Karro... I will have to play with this when I get a chance.

    Also, pay attention to scale. Make sure you keep the scale in mind as you build your craters and then add any lava flows after you have the crater if you want...

    Joe
    My Finished Maps
    Works in Progress(or abandoned tests)
    My Tutorials:
    Explanation of Layer Masks in GIMP
    How to create ISO Mountains in GIMP/PS using the Smudge tool
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    Unless otherwise stated by me in the post, all work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial 3.0 United States License.

  8. #18
      jfrazierjr is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karro View Post
    Joe pretty much covered most of the points I would make.

    One thought I would add, based on another tutorial I saw here (one that was technically for photoshop, but might be useful here, too) regards the volcanoes.

    At an earlier step, when you still have the B&W gradient (or gray & white given Joe's suggestion) at the peaks fo those mountains where you plan to make them volcanoes, try adding a little bit of a dark spot at the tips of those peaks.

    Then, when you create the bump map layer based on that gradient, this should create a small depression at the tip of the mountain, which would make the appearance of a volcanic crater.

    Then, I'd consider using a brighter orange-or-yellow color at the very center to simulate the glow of the lava, and make sure to blur the color on that layer (I might put the orange-yellow on it's own layer when you do this) to make it look glowy.

    Hmmm Karro, shall you start a "Playing with Volcanos" thread or shall I?



    Joe
    My Finished Maps
    Works in Progress(or abandoned tests)
    My Tutorials:
    Explanation of Layer Masks in GIMP
    How to create ISO Mountains in GIMP/PS using the Smudge tool
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    Unless otherwise stated by me in the post, all work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial 3.0 United States License.

  9. #19
      Karro is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by jfrazierjr View Post
    Hmmm Karro, shall you start a "Playing with Volcanos" thread or shall I?



    Joe
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  10. #20
    Community Leader Facebook Connected Steel General's Avatar
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    Post New WIP Map - North Western Ashtalarea

    OK, this is derived from an old, and very badly done CC2 map. There was a lot of experimentation here using RobA's tutorial as a baseline (it was a slow day at work today). I actually kind of like this so far other than a couple of things;

    1. The forests need to be better - just not sure how to fix them

    2. I tried following the tutorial on adding rivers, but they kept coming out looking like they were below the "Dirt" level. Also, not sure how I should add a large lake in the middle of the large forest.

    3. I would like to add some tundra/icy terrain at the extreme northern edge. Couldn't find any examples of how to do that.

    As always comments, critiques, etc. are welcomed.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Telperion & Taramir - First Attempt w/GIMP-nw-ashtalarea5.png  
    My Finished Maps | My Challenge Maps | Ghoraja Juun, my largely stagnated campaign setting.

    Unless otherwise stated by me in the post, all work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial 3.0 United States License.



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