City of Fogdown - WIP

[Redstar]

elevatioin lives .... oooooo what's that??? heh.

ELEVATION LIVES! .... you get the idea.

Thanks everyone. Hopefully I'll get some more done this weekend.

[Redstar]

So, here is WIP numero 3. I completely redid the colors, because I felt like the last few WIPs had more of a "tropical getaway" and not a "city of larceny and murder", which is what Fogdown is! It's just just a piece of the city though. I need to finish penning out the buildings to the south.

A few thanks for this one: RPGMapmaker for his Brushes (when you need a compass on the rush!), RPMiller for inspiring style (the bandit camp rocks my socks), and Andy Law (who did Freeport's incredible map).

Of course all comments and critiques are welcome, a few things I'm particularly interested in hearing from others about:

1) I beveled the houses to try and give them a "roof" look. They looked too flat before and need a little pop. Any thoughts? Do they look like stones? any suggestions?

2) I put in a water texture I found and I thought it added a lot ot the map, but I wasn't sure if it was too texture-y for the other parts of the map

3) Mountains - do the elevation lines (LIVES!) work?

4) I green-shifted the "flooded cemetery" - does it just look like someone airbrushed a section of the city?

5) Are the roads too bland? They look like they are paved in vanilla icecream to me... like the off-white, "old fashion" kind they sell by the gallon.

EDIT: 6) And scale please

Thanks!

[thebax2k]

Redstar, I must say, that is one nice looking map. I look forward to when the entire map is complete.

As to your points:

1. I like what you did with the houses. They are distinct without being so cg and "plasticy" that they draw attention away from the rest of the map.

2. The water looks nice. Although I suspect you'd be better keeping it as is, being a fan of the old Darlene Greyhawk maps, I'd recommend you experiment with different blue and green colors and hues to depict different water depths. The harbors will not have an extreme variation, but the depth will drop off as you get beyond the island. If you think that depicting water depth would make the map too kaleidescopic, just forget it.

3. I like the elevation lines, nothing needs to be changed.

4. The cemetery does look a bit weird. I don't know if you should use transparency or shading effects, but there's got to be a better way to denote that its flooded. Right now it looks like pools in a level ground area.

5. Just remember the KISS principle for roads and houses. They look fine as they are--don't try and get overly elaborate, it will just clutter up the map.

One set of structures that I would mention for the south part of the city (or at least in an area thats walled off and controlleable) are granaries. An island city the size of yours (I'm guessing the population is in the tens of thousands) would require an enormous amount of food to keep fed. Obviously, the food is going to be shipped in--but there should be a controlled place to store it besides the warehouses near the docks (as a safeguard against food riots).

In any event Redstar, your map is shaping up into one of the better city maps I've seen on the guild. Keep it up and good luck to you.

[Ghalev]

1) I beveled the houses to try and give them a "roof" look. They looked too flat before and need a little pop. Any thoughts? Do they look like stones? any suggestions?

I thought the flat roofs fit the overall style just perfectly, but these bevels are very subtle and well-integrated.

2) I put in a water texture I found and I thought it added a lot ot the map, but I wasn't sure if it was too texture-y for the other parts of the map

Again, subtlety is the key to your success. The pattern is faint and suggestive and the colors sufficiently desaturated to make it evocative. The same pattern used more clumsily could be gaudy and distracting, but you sidestepped that trap, I think.

3) Mountains - do the elevation lines (LIVES!) work?

Given the Waterdeep-style inspiration, absolutely yes; they fit right in. That aside, I think they create a vague impression that the city is otherwise flat ... I'm not sure if that's the impression I should really be getting.

4) I green-shifted the "flooded cemetery" - does it just look like someone airbrushed a section of the city?

Yes; I find that element calls attention to itself as more explicitly digital.

5) Are the roads too bland?

I don't think they are, no. The contrast is a goodly, valuable, legible and friendly contrast.

EDIT: 6) And scale please

The bar itself could use just the faintest whiff of character to bring it in line with your other typographical choices, IMO. As for the overall scale of the city, it seems modestly and very believably-scaled for a trad-fantasy medieval-type burg.

... and if you're looking for some recommended additions, it'd be nice to see some conspicuously large structures that suggest some local equivalent of arenas, cathedrals, etc.

[Badger]

So, .....Condensed...... Thanks!

1. Swweeeeeeeet. I love that look, you've really nailed it and I don't even know what 'it' is.... but I love that look. You must teach me your ways sifu.

2. That water texture is nice. Very subtle and very greyhawk, which I'm a fan of. I like it, I like it a lot. Leave it BE!

3. In my eyes, Elevation lines need to die... I've never been a big fan of elevation lines, and in my minds eye, it does detract a bit from the overall 'city' map. This however is a personal observation, probably not the best advice I suppose. I think a subtle gradient might be more effective, a painterly version of topography lines.

4. I like the look, but I might not blur it quite as much. However I think it works the way it is... I like it.

5. The roads are fine. I know the urge to want to add something to it, I get that urge all the time. But you can step back and ask, does it accomplish what I need it too? ... if so, then your best bet is to leave it as is. Adding some grunge to the street might otherwise detract and clutter up an already beautiful map. The roads work for me! If you really don't like the vanilla flavor... try some shade toning for the background, maybe you'll find a more pleasing and less 'vanilla' color. Perhaps add a hue/saturation layer, colorized, and mess with the levels on it.... something subtle.

6. SCALE!!! I love scale.... lets me know how far I have to go before I can find a room at the Do Drop Inn. Or how many alley's there are and how far each one is away from the other when delivering a large sum of larcenous wealth from one fence to the other. It works for me.

Seriously tho, this is one excellent looking map, it is something I will benchmark any future city maps in this style.... most assuredly ... REPPED

[loogie]

mmmmmmm drown zombies.

love the map... looks great

the little circle thingy... i don't even know what it is at the top... its a bit odd, if you explained it, or its part of your campaign, then its all good.. i'm just curious as to what its is (mostly cause i think it looks so cool )

[Redrobes]

This is very sweet - my vote for a featured map ! I like a lot of things about it. Sensible fortifications, sand banks, houses grouped, color - actually havent anything bad to say about it. Well done.

[Ascension]

Looks very nice, I like the color scheme and the layout. I tend to suspend my own logic when it comes to looking at maps so I don't even care that there isn't any real farmland to feed a city of that size. With such an extensive network of docks I'm assuming that this is very much a maritime culture with a huge navy and commerce...sorta like the Minoans. That lil thingy at the top looks sorta like a minimap and I think I like that idea...might have to try it myself.

[Ghalev]

Looks very nice, I like the color scheme and the layout. I tend to suspend my own logic when it comes to looking at maps so I don't even care that there isn't any real farmland to feed a city of that size. With such an extensive network of docks I'm assuming that this is very much a maritime culture with a huge navy and commerce...sorta like the Minoans.

There are many other examples, too ... really, only in stock fantasy worlds are cities required to be surrounded by farmland Early Novgorod had no outside-the-walls farmland at all, for just one example ... but heavy river-traffic (and a bit of cart-traffic) did the trick. And that's without any handwaving or magic to ease the strain. A cool climate helps, of course!

Edited to Add: I think it's kinda cool that most of the threads on WIPs tend to branch off into unrelated worldbuilding matters in addition to cartographic matters, but is there a site etiquette for requesting cartography-only critiques with no worldbuilding tangents?

[Redstar]

There are many other examples, too ... really, only in stock fantasy worlds are cities required to be surrounded by farmland Early Novgorod had no outside-the-walls farmland at all, for just one example ... but heavy river-traffic (and a bit of cart-traffic) did the trick. And that's without any handwaving or magic to ease the strain. A cool climate helps, of course!

Edited to Add: I think it's kinda cool that most of the threads on WIPs tend to branch off into unrelated worldbuilding matters in addition to cartographic matters, but is there a site etiquette for requesting cartography-only critiques with no worldbuilding tangents?

I agree it is pretty cool to have a lively discussion about general world building. I would say if the OP has questions specifically about mapping, then those should be the focus, else, it's all good The comments have really sparked my imagination about issues and features of the city.

In regards to food: scarcity is actually one of the defining features of Fogdown, thus the reason why the city is divided into districts by walls and its large thief population. It's in an effort by the Lawful Neutral/Evil rulers to contain poverty (and the rampant crime that comes with it) to the north. Think: Johannesburg - industrialized (and in Fogdown, also magical), but ruthlessly class divided in a neo-apartheid fashion.

On the "mini-map": actually it's the beginnings of a compass/rose