World Design Questions

[Gumboot]

My main issue with population and civilization concerns was my own misreading of maps I've seen in other fantasy novels. They're not like Google Maps. They don't show you every little village - just the big or important ones. I think that was my biggest problem.

To be totally honest, from the perspective of realism, most fantasy world building is terrible. Even authors praised for their realism like George RR Martin do a pretty embarrassingly bad job (they're in the business of telling stories after all, not creating a world)

I found the page that Falconius linked shortly after I made this post. Gumboot's interpretation and personal insight definitely helped too.

That document is my world building bible, and I use the excel spreadsheet created from that document (modified as needed) as my template for every state I build.

Edit: Gumboot, why do you say rivers don't split? I know they do, but is it just rarer than I realize?

It's exceptionally rare. The number on the entire planet is probably dozens.

Note that I'm excluding deltas and multi-channel rivers (braided rivers) from this.

[Krix]

Rivers may split occasionally and form small islands but they always meet up again and given enough time will go back to one channel. Where they split for real is in river deltas that empty into the ocean, I suspect because the land is too flat for one egress to handle the volume of water being emptied, and because it's so wet it has no where else to go. Here is a link to a discussion about these issues.

Man, I grew up walking through forests. How was I so wrong about water mechanics? Thanks for that link!

That document is my world building bible, and I use the excel spreadsheet created from that document (modified as needed) as my template for every state I build.

It's always good to know a source is reliable. I'll definitely be rereading it again and get working on some revised drafts soon.

As for the rivers. I never would have thought my understanding to be so wrong. I think I'd have done okay in most other aspects, but my rivers would have been completely terrible. Thanks again!

[Gumboot]

Man, I grew up walking through forests. How was I so wrong about water mechanics? Thanks for that link!

There are, of course, exceptions to every rule. The phenomenon of dividing waterways is called bifurcation. Divide Creek in Canada splits in two near Kicking Horse Pass, with one branch flowing eventually into the Atlantic and another flowing eventually into the Pacific. Likewise, North Two Ocean Creek divides in two at Two Ocean Pass in Wyoming, forming two creeks (Pacific and Atlantic Creek) which flow into their respective oceans.

To quote Wikipedia:

"An interesting aspect of geology that makes Parting of the Waters possible is that the entire drainage of North Two Ocean Creek occurs within a hole in the Continental Divide. Two separate legs of the Continental Divide completely surround the drainage of North Two Ocean Creek, with one juncture of these two legs occurring at Parting of the Waters, and the other juncture occurring high up on Two Ocean Plateau approximately 2 miles (3.2 km) due North. As a consequence, a drop of rain falling anywhere within the North Two Ocean Creek drainage has an equal chance of flowing either into the Atlantic or Pacific Oceans."

It's worth noting that these divides happen in small creeks situated perfectly in the middle of a drainage divide. The same happens very rarely with lakes that are situated perfectly across a drainage divide, such as Wollaston Lake in Canada which has two outlets. Isa Lake in Yellowstone National Park is believed to be the only lake in the world that naturally drains into two different oceans. Thus, not only is this phenomenon very rare, but it's even more rare in rivers of the size that are likely to make it onto anything but the most localised, detailed maps.

River bifurcation can also occur due to mankind's influence. A good example is the Nile which had a split called the Bahr Yussef which only existed during the yearly floods, when excess water would flow into an inland sea at Fayyum. During the 12th Dynasty a canal was built to increase the flow, but the channel eventually dried up and the inland sea dried up with it, forming a depression instead. More recently, a modern canal has been cut to reopen the channel and feed water from the Nile back into Fayyum.

One important thing to bear in mind about bifurcation is that while rivers and lakes change course, position, and size over time (with news ones emerging and old ones disappearing), this is particularly true of bifurcation as any waterway with two channels is inherently unstable and one will eventually close up.

[Krix]

There are, of course, exceptions to every rule. The phenomenon of dividing waterways is called bifurcation. Divide Creek in Canada splits in two near Kicking Horse Pass, with one branch flowing eventually into the Atlantic and another flowing eventually into the Pacific. Likewise, North Two Ocean Creek divides in two at Two Ocean Pass in Wyoming, forming two creeks (Pacific and Atlantic Creek) which flow into their respective oceans.

To quote Wikipedia:

"An interesting aspect of geology that makes Parting of the Waters possible is that the entire drainage of North Two Ocean Creek occurs within a hole in the Continental Divide. Two separate legs of the Continental Divide completely surround the drainage of North Two Ocean Creek, with one juncture of these two legs occurring at Parting of the Waters, and the other juncture occurring high up on Two Ocean Plateau approximately 2 miles (3.2 km) due North. As a consequence, a drop of rain falling anywhere within the North Two Ocean Creek drainage has an equal chance of flowing either into the Atlantic or Pacific Oceans."

It's worth noting that these divides happen in small creeks situated perfectly in the middle of a drainage divide. The same happens very rarely with lakes that are situated perfectly across a drainage divide, such as Wollaston Lake in Canada which has two outlets. Isa Lake in Yellowstone National Park is believed to be the only lake in the world that naturally drains into two different oceans. Thus, not only is this phenomenon very rare, but it's even more rare in rivers of the size that are likely to make it onto anything but the most localised, detailed maps.

River bifurcation can also occur due to mankind's influence. A good example is the Nile which had a split called the Bahr Yussef which only existed during the yearly floods, when excess water would flow into an inland sea at Fayyum. During the 12th Dynasty a canal was built to increase the flow, but the channel eventually dried up and the inland sea dried up with it, forming a depression instead. More recently, a modern canal has been cut to reopen the channel and feed water from the Nile back into Fayyum.

One important thing to bear in mind about bifurcation is that while rivers and lakes change course, position, and size over time (with news ones emerging and old ones disappearing), this is particularly true of bifurcation as any waterway with two channels is inherently unstable and one will eventually close up.

Wow... I was so wrong. I guess most of the creeks I saw in my youth were almost always dried up and I just assumed they were 50/50 dividing and joining. It makes sense now that I think about it. This has been very informative and very interesting!