Noob training 101: Please, halp!
Hello there!
So, I'm basically a map enthusiast and recently decided to try to take it a step further and try to learn how to do some neat maps myself instead of only drooling over awesome pieces of art of other people.
Before I start with the map discussion per se, I guess I should say I never worked or played with any kind of image processing software like GIMP or PS and I'm quite challenged at drawing anything hand-free, so yeah... I'm a complete and utter green nooblet.
What I did to start was read all "basic" tutorials I could find with a style that I liked and from there, along with some google-fu, try to follow it and get something to come to fruition!
After reading the awesome tutorials of Ascension and "Hand-drawn Map Tutorial" by Gidde, I decided to follow the second since it's a style I like a lot and proceed to download GIMP and get on with it.
So, after around 10hs of playing with the tutorial and slamming my head against GIMP, I concluded a "frankstein map" of sorts but I had some problems during the process, and I'd like some help so I could iron those out so in my next try I can eliminate those and try to achieve something closer to the map shown by Gidde as example in his tutorial.
The problems I could identify:
1 - After doing all the Mountains/Hills/Forest/... layers and their respective shadings, merging them and getting to the step where the Tutorial says to merge all them I got a problem where my mountains and hill were somehow only showing when I had the Background active (With the eye on). Why did this happend and how do I make it not happen? As I understand I should have all these individual layers with their respective aspects (mountains, hill, forests, swamps...) with a transparent background, so that I can later put them on top of my modified/texturized background, right?
2- The Tutorial keeps refering to a "Fuzzy brush" but there's no brush named fuzzy or with a description as well...so I figured It had to do probably with version difference and tried to go with a brush that resembled the fuzzy effect, with a more solid center and fading out board...is that the correct thing or is there in fact a "fuzzy brush" that I should dl or something?
3 - The rivers part. The Tutorial says to DL a script and all that jazz, but I saw I could create a new dynamic to my brushes that could make a "Fade > Size" that would basically do the same trick to the line I draw, starting big and going thinner along the drawing...is it ok to do it like that or is there some other "correct" way of doing Rivers I should be using?
4 - Paths... When I got to the Labeling, I tried using the Path tool to mark 2 anchors, curve it how I like and than add Text and than Text Along Path. I encountered 2 main problems, sometimes the text would go to the path shape, but at the end I would get my selection running very, very far out of the screen, like as if it was pinned completely out of the picture and most of the time, specially when I tried using paths with a "S" shape or something more fancy than a simple curve, the Text would not be correctly shaped or would get "funky" starting in the correct shape and ending halfway through the Path shape and stuff like that. Am I using Path wrongly here? Is there a Tutorial I could use to eliminate these?
5 - Border...How do I cut the border correctly so that at the end I get a nice image with borders correctly limiting the picture outer endings instead of what I got that where there's background outwards the border?
6 - Text...doesn't seem completely readable...how do I improve that?
So, these are the biggest problems I could identify myself. If you guys could, please, help me with those and any other you might find, I'd be extremely thankful. Also would like to thank the Tutorial authors, since even though my map is looking ugly, considering I never ever even opened GIMP before I guess they made a miracle.
There's the frankstein map! ^_^
http://i.imgur.com/gsbduoN.jpg
Hi TK! Welcome to the Guild!
I'm not a GIMP user, so I'll leave the answers to the many people here who are, but I do want to say that this is the most well thought out list of questions I've ever seen in a first post. I love to see people read, try, and organize what they need to know before they ask for help. I have a feeling that you are going to be a very good cartographic artist very quickly, and I'll look forward to seeing how you develop this and more maps!
Hey, Chick! Thanks for the welcome and the words!
I believe if I'm looking for help I need to try to be as understandable as possible and I believe a list is the easiest way of doing so ^_^
I hope to have some good maps very soon to show you guys!
Yes, I agree with chick: it is a good list of well-thought out questions. I'll try and answer some of them, if I can (note, I have no experience with GIMP, but I'm assuming it has many functions the same as Photoshop; also I haven't read Gidde's tutorials lately, so I'll make a few assumptions about what steps are included):
--1. I'm guessing the problem with one layer vanishing when a lower one is hidden is linked with layer styles. To put it simply (there are probably others who can explain it better) an opaque layer with no layer styles will look the same, regardless of what is done to layers below it. Layer styles, however, are all about how one layer interacts with the ones that are lower, so that they an change colour, brightness/darkness, saturation, texture, and even disappear under certain circumstances. Play around with layer styles and you'll see what I mean. If my assumption is correct, that what you observed was occurring due to layer styles, then know it is perfectly normal for things to change when a layer is hidden. It also means that, if your lower layer is solid white, a colour, or even a textured image like old paper, you may get different effects that can really enhance your map.
--2. you are right. A fuzzy brush means one that has low hardness (i.e. it becomes lighter as it gets away from the centre; although the lightness is actually not colour, but opacity)
--3. rivers: thing about this is, Gidde's script jazz is probably a way of doing rivers that may be quicker, or easier, but it is no more or less correct than what you have found. Make rivers however you want, the fade function is certainly a useful one. Whatever works for you.
--4. 5. and 6. I am pretty bad at labels, and almost never use borders, so I won't answer these questions.
Hope that is helpful.
THW
Formerly TheHoarseWhisperer
1. I also guessed that this problem has something to do with layer styles. If your layer style is, for example, set to "multiply", you won't see anything without having a layer to multiply on.
On the other hand, the white artifacts on your posted map should not appear with a "multiply" layer style.
2. The type of brushes changed from GIMP 2.6 (the version the tut was written for) to GIMP 2.8 (the current version). Now, there are round brushes in 25%, 50%, 75% and 100% "hardness". Try one of the below 100% ones and see which gives the results you like best.
3. I second THW here: use whatever suits you best. I personally prefer to taper my rivers by hand.
4. If found the text-along-path function in GIMP rather lacking for anything but the most basic stuff. The best way to do labels in GIMP is not to do them in GIMP. If you don't feel too overwhelmed with new software, I'd advise to use the free vector-oriented program Inkscape for doing your labels.
5. I'm not quite sure what your problem is here.
6. Again, I am not certain just exactly what is your problem.
On thing I can identify is the white "outer glow" around some labels. If I remember the tut correctly, this shouldn't be white, but rather the background shining through. This seems to be a problem with your layer styles again... but I just saw that this topic (blending labels onto the map) isn't dealt with in the tut.
Another possible problem: the more fancy your font is, the more curving you use - and especially if both things are combined! - the worse the readability. Try to switch to a less elaborate font, and see if that makes an improvement.
Last edited by Freodin; 01-12-2015 at 04:15 AM.
@TheHoarseWhisperer and Freodin - First of all, thanks a lot for the input! I imagined I had fumbled something with the layers when messing with them, specially because the tutorial only covers Mountains, Hills, Forests and I also used Swamps, Deserts in my map, so more chances to get something wrong.
2) Thanks for claryfying the Brush thing!
3) The script wasn't quite working for me, as It kept increasing the size of the line midway through so I decided to do it by hand.
4) I saw Inkscape being referred quite a few times around, so I guess I should tackle on it sooner than later as it seems to be what people use for good results.
6) Thanks for the elaborate font tip...I assume that's what's happening, since I got a curvy font.
After you guys said it had to be something with layers and I read in another thread that "Multiply" Mode needs something for the layer to multiple on, I changed all my "objects" (mountains, hills...) layers along with their shadings to normal, applied masks after finalizing tweaks (some were hanging there not applied) and kept going.
With some more hammering from what I had before, I suppose this is the finished map.
What you guys think? Passable for a first try?
Definitely good for a first try, and, with a bit more work and advice from people here at the Guild you could make a very nice map (unfortunately, it is late here in Australia, so I can't give any comments for the moment). Have some rep for your first map.
THW
Formerly TheHoarseWhisperer
Reasonably good, but a couple of things:
1. The pine trees are too much smaller than the deciduous trees.
2. The forest in the N around the monster mountain is too circular. Break up the edges a bit?
3. The rectangles that you have for underlying texture are too rectangular. Unless you want this for a reason, you could take some fuzzy eraser brush and make the edges less distinct.
4. Those same rectangles overlap onto the land. Ocean texture and land textures should not show a line that crosses the coast. It makes it look too much like an artifact of the art process.
5. Don't let the Infis label overlap the compass rose.
6. Add some Outer Glow to the labels so they are easier to read. Remember, on a map, readability counts a lot!
Don't you know that a map is never done?
Last edited by Chick; 01-12-2015 at 11:55 AM.
Hey, thanks THW!
@Chick
1 - I thought I used the same size for both...silly me. Gonna check that!
2 - I thought I read somewhere that large forest bodies usually ended with nice rounded shapes like that, thus why I used such...guess I'll brake it more!
3- Those rectangulars weren't used for texture. They're indeed "scarrings" I tried to produce to make an effect like as if something heavy was left a long time on top of the map, like a treasure chest, for example. They were done in the same proccess I did the coffee spill blob in the upper right and the scribbid rubbish in the upper left. All using grunge brushes, after reading this Tut http://www.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?t=533
4 - I guess I could smooth it a bit and take it out of the land, but as I said above, it's to represent the marking of leaving something heavy for a long time on top of it. But I guess I didn't quite pass the feeling...
5 - Okay! I thought it looked better if it, so I did it on purpose...silly me.
6 - Outer Glow...hmmm, gonna tinker with it. I definitely would love some improvement in the readability!
Oh, and thanks for the continued help!
Numbers 3-4: If that was your intention, it's fine, I just figured you were trying to add some texture. Maybe another coffee cup ring to add to the look and make it clearer?
Number 6: If you are using Photoshop, choose a label layer and click to Blending Options. Then check the box for Outer Glow and adjust the parameters until each letter has a faint glow (probably white) around it. That will help set it "above" the underlying terrain features. Then once you are happy, you can close that window, and for that layer do a Copy Layer Style and then Paste Layer Style onto all the other label layers. I would guess that GIMP has similar methods.
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