Kaherm (an attempt to revitalize old map)

[Voolf]

Long time ago, when i was "proudly" becoming a teenager , i was introduced to pen and paper RPG games.
The most popular that time (and now too i guess) was DnD. My friends, who played for a while, didn't really like a lot of rules there and agreed to just tear off every page that stood in a way to enjoy gameplay. They replaced many rules with their own and at some point they decided to create their own system. And they did. It is called Blood and now when i see it, it is somehow simillar to Call of Cthulhu, but in a fantasy world.
Anyway this was the point when i jumped in into their group and started playing. I received every rules they had created that time along with a map. Good old MS PAINT map of one continent of world called Kaherm.


Labels are in polish, because... well was created by Pole.

So, i have been trying to draw it anew and want to share with you guys in what direction i am going with it. I am aslo hoping to get some advice/critique too because frankly drawing a large scale map is not my strong point (at least not yet).

So here it is. Just lines (but not done yet)


1. At this point, my biggest concern is that i covered almost everything from old map, but there is still a lot of white areas and i think it will look bad leaving it like that. I can throw couple of hills here and there, but i am not sure it that solves the problem. What do you think i could add more?

2. I creaded that massive moutain range on the left side, but maybe it is much of a mess to eye? Also i am not sure of my mountains because at fist glance they looks cool to me, but when i shade them they become ugly (but it may be my inabillity to shade properly).

3. It is something for later days, but.... any advice how should i colour it and shade? My usual way of painting close up maps seems to fail for world maps. I can not crack the right way to do it for this kind of maps.

Thanks

[Warlin]

Hey Voolf, really nice linedraws. Your mountains and forest are really well done. For the white part of your map, it's not a problem for me. I think it structures the map as well as the other features. Maybe some hills but not to much. For me there is another issue with translating a top down view (the former map) to a 3/4 view (your map). The land mass need to be modified in the processing. Like this, there is a disproportion between the south and the north part of your map.
Great work beside that.

[Voolf]

That is great point Warlin. How could i miss that. Hmm, it will take time to draw it same as original and maintaining perspective..... South island must be changed for sure, but maybe lower part of mainland could stay as it is??.... HA my laziness speaking....

[Eld]

I really like your mountains, they are quite simple without much artificial stuff yet look very impressive, like a relief. If shading makes them look bad to your eyes, you should practice shading because the mountains themself are great. However, that great river that runs from the mountain range in the west to the big lake in the east is illogical: the big lake has one entry and two exits. That's physically impossible. A lake can only maintain one exit over a longer period of time. The other question is how the river could even enter the lake as it has to pass through a mountain range, which means, he needs to go uphill. If there is a pass in the mountains that he could use to still flow downhill, the question is how this pass came into being if not by the erosion force of the river itself? My suggestion is to let the river flow around the range and enter the lake in the north and let it leave the lake in the east. Between entering and leaving river you could place some hills to make it more plausible. The southern exit of the lake I would skip. If you want to keep a river in that place, you could just embiggen the mountains south of the lake and let the river start from those mountains.

[Voolf]

I really like your mountains, they are quite simple without much artificial stuff yet look very impressive, like a relief. If shading makes them look bad to your eyes, you should practice shading because the mountains themself are great.

Roger that!

However, that great river that runs from the mountain range in the west to the big lake in the east is illogical: the big lake has one entry and two exits. That's physically impossible. A lake can only maintain one exit over a longer period of time.

Good catch. To be honest i haven't pay too much attention to rivers yet. I draw them in quickly as original map to help me place mountains. I did alter two spots with river though. (If you see the original map) first one is the small lake in west. The lake has also 2 exits, i ommited one that runs up north to the forest where the river ends. I also changed the north river - it starts from mountains. In original pic it is connectec to lake and sea.
The big lake river(s)' problem is easily fixable by adding next river from mountains that suround it, that will fall into lake, or just as you suggested - make the south river start from a mountain.

The other question is how the river could even enter the lake as it has to pass through a mountain range, which means, he needs to go uphill. If there is a pass in the mountains that he could use to still flow downhill, the question is how this pass came into being if not by the erosion force of the river itself?

Yes, there is a pass, it is no quite visible, i should fix that. It's actually a space between two mountains range, but i guess i have to make it more clear, right now they are too close to each other.

"How the pass came into beeing" is for me at this point irrelevant. I know a lot of people take into consideration how things are created by nature in real world. Obviously this is a good approach, but we should not overdoo it in a sense, like beeing crazy about it and erase everyting that is impossible even if it looks good. I recently saw a video where a guy was explaing how we should think about tectonic plates movement while creating mountains and valley, how we should think about winds blowing which way to create possible spots for deserts etc. All of this apply when we want to create a map with 100% realism that reflects the world we are living. But hey, i do not create a real world. I create a FANTASY world where a freakin' magic is possible. Almost all the maps here, perspective and top down are just an illustration that fools our eyes. So i just refuse to follow ALL nature rules as long as they don't makes the map clearly unnatural to human eye.

Thank you Eld for all suggestions i will try make appropriate corrections.

[ThomasR]

That's a good map Voolf ! The mountains are splendid and the forests, fluffy as hell even if you might want to make them look a little more iso, perhaps by reducing their vertical span ... nah, forget it, they're cool like they are. About the rivers, I second what Eld said, beware the river police, they're a tough bunch, also, on the southern island, you got a river with two mouth, it's the same with the one in the eastern marshland and north in the delta-ish area. In the mesh it could make sense, in the north, less and the southern makes he less sense to me. Besides these tiny nitpicks about rivers, I think you're on the right path, your linework is spectacular and you should definitely practice mountain shading because it will make your ranges epic !

[Voolf]

Thanks thomrey. I changed some rivers to make them more plausible. I streched bottom coastline and southern island a little, i hope it fits the perspective a little more now. Some mouintains are changed and i added a little more terrain and subtle hills. I marked major cities on the map with dots and now i am slowly drawing some simple cities thumbnails that will be placed instead of dots. That is actually very time-consuming for me....

Not much of a progress but always something.

[ThomasR]

Very gooooood ! The texture adds a lot and I'm particularly fond of the coastal details who really bring the coastline to life. When you shade and color the map, do not forget the coastal details. When shaded, they make a very good map great (see the Dragon's Backbone by Caenwyr).

[Voolf]

Thanks, i forgot i added the coastline details

I have seen Dragon's Backbone and it is one of my favourites. I will do my best with colouring and shading... (Caenwyr... help ! )

[Voolf]

I added some texture and started to shade mountains. Its the first overall shade pass.



After that i intend to deepen the shadows on the right side and peaks, but already feels like something is wrong to me.... What do you think?