Indoor "Outhouses"

[RPMiller]

I definitely think I would rather not see any loos in anymore buildings from that time period and up through the invention of indoor plumbing. It isn't that we even bother roleplaying the needs for that particular function, but when such a room is in a map it calls attention to it and it tends to somehow creep into the plot.

[jaerdaph]

LOL - I was just thinking of how many fantasy inn maps I've seen with indoor privies, and how many space ship deck plans I've seen without.

The chamber pot was the closest thing to indoor bathrooms they had, be it a medieval city or frontier town. Some nights it was just to cold to make the hike out to the outhouse. And pity the late night reveler who just happened to be passing under the window of someone in the process of emptying the chamber pot!

[NeonKnight]

You will notice that in almost every one of my more recent city/town maps, I have almost all city blocks designed with 'central' courtyards. The function of the courtyard was to locate privies/loos that would serve the surrounding buildings.

Also, I have seen a great many fantasy floor plans with indoor latrines, and some of these maps were even in published materials. Always....bizzarre, and I can only imagin the smell.

[ravells]

Although, all this said, we are talking about Fantasy RPGs rather than real life medieval. Fantasy settings are basically a sanitised and idealised take on medieval / renaissance life. Disease, lack of sanitation, the sheer smelliness, the presence of fleas on virtually everyone and general lack of personal hygiene, the utterly back-breaking, hard life that rural peasants led, the almost universal lack of literacy and numeracy, the fact that it was not uncommon to step over the dead bodies of children in city streets in 18th Century London....the list goes on and on.

[Shessar]

He's a link to a condensed history of outhouses and privys. Rather interesing reading I suppose.

http://www.bottlebooks.com/privyto.htm

But I tend to agree with ravells, especially for the fantasy genre of games. It is fantasy, not necessarily medieval. My campaign is set in a world of high magic, and has one rich merchant's house that has the garderobes going to a non-dimentional space (sort of like a bag of holding does) and a permanant control temperatue so that the only fireplaces are those used for relaxation. However, the poorer inhabitants of the land use the traditional chamber pot and street.

If I were running a historical game, I'm sure I'd research things a bit more.

[Joshua_101]

Fantasy settings are basically a sanitised and idealised take on medieval / renaissance life. Disease, lack of sanitation, the sheer smelliness, the presence of fleas on virtually everyone and general lack of personal hygiene, the utterly back-breaking, hard life that rural peasants led

In the campaign I'm running right now one of my kingdoms is based heavily on ancient Roman history. I've tried to include as much historical detail as possible from the layout of Roman houses to running water latrines (they used communal sponges to wipe!) and public bathhouses.

http://www.sewerhistory.org/grfx/pub_bath/pubbath1.htm

I find it amazing that the Romans had such an advanced and technological society and that the Dark & Middle Ages was consumed by such regression. It seems that when the Roman legions left England and France, sanitation went with them.

Jack Whyte often writes about Roman sanitation in his A Dream of Eagles Series (called The Camulod Chronicles in USA). Fort at Mediobogdum (or Hardknott Pass) was located at the top of a cliff so the chute from the latrine just went out the side of the precipice. Good thing the valley below was uninhabited!

[Beowulf]

Although, all this said, we are talking about Fantasy RPGs rather than real life medieval. Fantasy settings are basically a sanitised and idealised take on medieval / renaissance life. Disease, lack of sanitation, the sheer smelliness, the presence of fleas on virtually everyone and general lack of personal hygiene, the utterly back-breaking, hard life that rural peasants led, the almost universal lack of literacy and numeracy, the fact that it was not uncommon to step over the dead bodies of children in city streets in 18th Century London....the list goes on and on.

Years ago I pondered the same issue, vacillating on whether dungeons & buildings should have bathrooms/indoor outhouses. Ultimated I reached the same conclusion as Ravells- it's a game of fantasy, not a treatise on plumbing! It's like the Renaissance Festivals so popular now, an overly romanticised view of the times (hey, I love the Ren Fest, but was everyone back then really a Lord or Lady, and did they all have bad English accents?).

[ravells]

I would LOVE to go to a Ren fest. Must book a trip to America soon....we don't really have them here. ...oh and 'back then' (pre 1900s) received pronunciation (aka BBC English aka 'the posh accent') hadn't been invented. In fact the American accent is closer to how people spoke in the 1500s than RP is....and as an added bonus you still use words which are obsolete here, like 'gotten'.

[pyrandon]

Ravs--you can come stay at my house anytime, buddy. There's a ren fest in Detroit close by--and I can sure introduce you to some "interesting" people there. IN fact, I'll bet we can find some McFacts about European history you've never "gotten" in your own schooling...

[Valarian]

Although, all this said, we are talking about Fantasy RPGs rather than real life medieval. Fantasy settings are basically a sanitised and idealised take on medieval / renaissance life. Disease, lack of sanitation, the sheer smelliness, the presence of fleas on virtually everyone and general lack of personal hygiene, the utterly back-breaking, hard life that rural peasants led, the almost universal lack of literacy and numeracy, the fact that it was not uncommon to step over the dead bodies of children in city streets in 18th Century London....the list goes on and on.

While this is true of the mundane world, the high magical element of most Fantasy settings could alleviate many of the sanitation issues common in the medieval environment. Thus, not only using the technologies used by the Romans you can also have more modern appliances run using magical means.

The toilet could flush (Create Water) the contents of your toilet down the waste (Dimension Door) to the city midden. Once a month, the content of the midden is disposed of (Disintegrate). Of course, this would be expensive and only prosperous cities could afford such luxuries. Smaller settlements would have to opt for more manual means of waste disposal.

Dishwashers: a cupboard where you place your dirty crockery and conjured water elementals clean the dishes for you.

The magical element would also alleviate disease. If Clerics are common, then even the most poor settlements would have access to magical cures (Cure Wounds, Remove Disease). If magic is more rare, then the supply and demand means that only richer patrons get magical assistance. Response units of clerics travel to famine stricken regions to supply Create Food and Water spells to aid the populace. Get arcane mages involved too and you can have a rapid response unit (Clairvoyance and Teleport). Even disabilities such as blindness and deafness can be cured through magic if the person can afford the services. Some states could have high taxes, but the equivalent of a national health service (using Clerics).